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The Daily Fix

A Homeowner's Story: Did Going Green Make Sense?

FHB_WEB, member

5 users recommend

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by David Arkin

Gladwyn and Martina wanted a radiant-heating system for comfort and health reasons: Forced-air heaters can spread a lot of contaminants harmful to their daughter, who has asthma. A typical gas-fired radiant floor costs about $15,000. Operating this system, along with a water heater and a stove, would cost $100 a month at current rates.

The solar radiant-heating system we installed cost $26,920, including labor and materials for sand beds, tubing, solar panels, controllers, sensors, and piping. Natural gas powers backup water and space heating, cooking, and a decorative fireplace. In the system’s first year of operation, gas bills averaged $25 a month. With $75 in monthly savings, the simple payback time on the additional $12,000 spent to install this system is about 13 years. This estimate assumes no rise in the price of natural gas, which is quite likely to go up over that period of time. (It is also worth noting that the thermal-mass cooling value of the system’s sand beds means no air conditioning is necessary.)

The 2.5kw photovoltaic (PV) system cost $29,344. The rebate from the California Energy Commission’s buy-down program was $11,140, for a net cost of $18,204. In the first year of operation, the PV system generated as much electricity as the house used, resulting in bills that totaled $0.00. Given the typical monthly electric bill for a house of this size (1823 sq. ft.) is about $100 at current rates ($0.1544/kwh), the simple payback time is about 15 years. As electricity costs go up, the payback period shortens; at payback, future electricity is essentially free. And there is great satisfaction in watching your electric meter run backward.

Read the complete article... A House for the End of Cheap Oil Healthful, light-filled, and energy-efficient, this home reaches back to its California past and toward a sustainable future by David Arkin

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Comments (8)

greenredbuilder writes: Wow, I went to the mddesign web site. It was just what one would expect to encounter. An aging white male, who hasn't pried his lard butt off of the lazyboy, for quite a while. Design divinely inspired by watching too many reruns of Dallas or Walt Disney on the flat screen, in the home auditorium. Grand great rooms galore, pay homage to the vacuous space of self importance . Your sense of aesthetic is the stuff that doll houses are made of. Devine, do the world a favor, live out your deluded fantasies in your own gated community amongst your brethren. You'll be safe from the empirical evidence, supported by 97% of the scientific community, that yes, the world is a different place than your medieval, stunted design sense of history would suggest. Global warming isn't a make believe hoax. Devine, don't worry. The tooth fairy, Santa Claus, the Easter bunny and Tinkerbell will all live, happily ever after.
Posted: 12:51 am on April 24th

mddesignhomes writes: It is nice that we can come up with all these different calculations to help us feel better and justify what is essentially that right thing to do in the first place, but if that is what it takes than so be it. The bottom line is what is it going to cost per month, can they afford it now and in the foreseeable future. That will ultimately drive what people do or do not do. There are some things that people will spend money on regardless of whether they pay for themselves or not.

For those of you whom might possibly feel that you haven't done enough yet to mitigate your guilt for what we are doing to our planet than I suggest you go purchase yourself some carbon credits from Al Gores company. For more on this subject you can read my blog "Low CARBon diet" @ http://www.mddesignhomes.com/blog/index.php

Mark Devine
mddesignhomes.com
Posted: 1:17 pm on April 21st

SteveCoSprgs writes: What is the life span of these systems? PV and Radiant.

Posted: 9:57 am on April 21st

contract writes: Well, reading all of your commens about your different opinion about what's green and the different perspective of the way you calculated money wise what's green still.
The truth is, everyone will have to understand that even if you don't agree on the way somebody spend their money, at least we can see that the market is changing in a forward thinking manner, not allways do way we think is the best but at least it's going somewhere for the future. Slowly will get there. NOW for those who think about smaller is greener, i will respect your ideas, but if you think that some of us work so hard and long hours is not for fun, it's to threat our self whit what ever we desire and enjoy a early retirement. We bought a 43 acres piece of land to buil our next home and relocate my business and i'm planning to buil the house to be 400 sq.meter foot print and have no utility service provided. 100% sustainable. I'm sorry for those who are jalous or can't afford bigger house, but at least respect the fact that it's there and we work for it and it won't go away. At least we're doing something to change the industry. What are you doing? We respect your choice and opinion, so respect ours!
Good luck to you in your effort to downsize us.

Posted: 9:25 am on April 21st

greenredbuilder writes: I'm still amazed that the green moniker is so easily attached to virtually any dwelling. How could a home this large, be considered green? Size does matter! The amount of energy to manufacture the materials, the energy consumed transporting everything and everyone to the building site are just a couple of the factors that should be considered before a building is deemed "green". When the bar is set so low, it becomes obvious that the marketing aspect of construction trumps true sustainibility. Fine Homebuilding should focus its attention on small, well built structures that are part of a vernacular that is truly relevant in 2009. The old paradigm of big, seductive shacks are hopefully losing their audience. We need a new model, if we have any hope of a future.
Posted: 2:11 am on April 21st

AlexGr writes: I don't know if it's worth that. How about proper insulation? For example, use 2x6 as studs, then you can put R-19 fiberglass. Use heat-reflective paint for the exterior, and light-colored roofing, not some awful rubber. I think that would still be cheaper than this fancy system.

I can't compare directly with that; I'm in Orange county. My house is a bit smaller, 3 bedrooms. During winter, I pay about $15 more for gas heat (over regular $30 bill for other needs). Usual electric bill is $50, and can go up to $100 during summer. If I replace some windows and patio door, it will get even better; these are single pane now.

Posted: 12:12 am on April 21st

ChrisBriley writes: Fpratt,

You make a good point, one does usually pay interest on loans, so I hear you there. But if these homeowners “invested” that money somewhere else, say the stock market? I think they’d be wishing they spent it on the operational cost-saving features of their home right about now.

I love that they are sharing their numbers. It allows us all to take an easy swing at answering the question “Is it worth it?” and it allows us to “do the math” as you recommend. You did the math and came up with 50 years as a payback time for PVs? Hmmm.

Posted: 5:49 pm on April 20th

fpratt writes: I wouldn't want to appear anti-green, but why would you present the costs & payback of a system without taking into account the cost of the extra cost? The money has to come from somewhere. Either it's borrowed & you pay interest, or if you have the cash it could be earning a return. For example; The real payback on the PV system is more like about 50 years (do the math). Most PV system only last half that. I'm sure there is a wonderful warm & fuzzy feeling brought on by watching the meter run backwards, but we need to have the complete picture so we can make intelligent decisions about how to go about how to place less strain on out environment.
Posted: 4:56 pm on April 20th

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