I have come to the conclusion that some people are just to stupid to own a house.
What do you do when working in a house and see obvious dangerous situations resulting from homeowner or hack construction?
I fear my latest customer thinks I’m just trying to up the bill by pointing out problems, but this house is scaring the crap outta me.
Examples:
12 ga aluminum wire on 20 amp circuit to non-aluminum outlets.
Deck framed so bad I won’t get on it.
No smoke detectors.
treads coming out of stringers because wall was removed.
And the list goes on….
At what point do you turn a blind eye????
Replies
DW and I have some friends who live in an older, poorly built house that's an absolute firetrap. And they sleep upstairs in a converted attic with the only egress being the rickety open stairway that starts in the middle of the house, right past the wood stove....knob and tube wiring in some areas, newer hack wiring in others. One of those houses with no roof overhangs in a rainy climate so the walls are rotted and damp.
I won't work on it, because it's hopeless! (and kind of depressing). What would fix it right is one idling pass with a D-8, pour a slab and put in a mfd. home (their income is a little on the light side). I suggested that once, but they like the "charm" of the old house.
You've got to be carefull with comments like that.
My youngest brother and his wife bought their first "dream house" in a beautiful location but soon found mold problems. Their son is allergic and asthmatic so the mold is a disaster.
Bro showed me through and, while it is all stuff that can be taken care of with enough money (which he doesn't have), asked me what I thought.
I frivolously stated, "Nothing a five gallon bucket and a match wouldn't fix". He got the joke but his wife overheard and got her feelings hurt. I won't tell you what she said to me at breakfast the next morning..
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit. The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are." --Marcus Aurelius
Come on Piffin, don't do that. What did she tell you the next morning? Let the thunder crack and the waves roar.
We're going on.
Lemme guess: "Your attitudes nothing a stinger missile wouldn't fix."
GEO (I like the short version) I see two ways. One end is you do what you were hired for, clam up, keep opinions in, and cover up the mistakes and when the place burns / crumbles / implodes you say "well, it wasn't my work". The other is you say look, you hired me for this but if I do X on top of these four thousand other disasters, it's not gonna last and it's going to be shoddy workmanship and there's no way on Gods green earth I'm going to stand by it since you cant fuse good work to crap and have them both equal gold. Either I can fix what's wrong the right way, or you can pay for the work I've done and I'll move on to the next job. You can find a replacement down at the cardboard box under the bridge who will probably be happy to overlook the inherent flaws here.
I swear you follow me up so quickly sometimes that It seems like you've got a program set up to set off alarms whenever piffin posts.
She said, "If you don't like the eggs, I'm sure you can fix them with a match and a can of gas."
And everything was patched up quickly after she got it out of her system..
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit. The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are." --Marcus Aurelius
When I made my suggestion, I left out the D-8 part. That would have got me skewered!
I often find several things that need repairing when I visit a house. Even a quick walk through can provide a list of things. I've often hesitated to start pointing things out because
A: It is their "home" and many people feel personally insulted if you point out things wrong with their house
B: People get the impression that I'm just trying to run up my bill.
Now I usually ask, "would you like to know what I've noticed about your house that needs repairing?" It places the ball in their court, and when I give them a long list of things they take it much better. I've also had people tell me no, I don't want to know. OK with me.
Justus Koshiol
Running Pug Construction
As an electrician that works on quite a few older house I am confronted with this sort of problem quite often. No final answer this but my general plan is:
Unless the HO has reacted badly in the past I feel obligated to mention safety hazards. If it is bad enough they get told even if it costs me a customer. Some conditions can have a controlling influence on the HOs and my choices. When I find a home that has aluminum branch circuit wiring the first thing I want to talk about is mitigation and rewiring. If the HO doesn't want to address the problem I politely excuse myself and drive off. As far as I am concerned working on such a home without addressing the larger issue is to put my name on a ticking time bomb. If they want it defused we can talk. If not it is better that I walk away before becoming associated with a disaster.
On less critical issues I play it by ear. I mention it. If they seen interested in correcting the problem I discuss options. If not I stick to the job I was called in for. As for non-electrical problems, leaking pipes and broken ducts lead the list, I try to tailor my commentary to the customer. If they seem receptive I mention it. If not I hold my tongue and keep moving.
These are the same kinds of hazards that people talk about in the threads on building codes. If you believe the government needs to enforce building codes to protect the current and future occupants of a house, shouldn't the government also require tradesmen to report these sorts of things to the building department, which would then revoke the certificate of occupancy until they were fixed?
we call it civilization but really it's a pretty primitive state. Let the thunder crack and the waves roar.
We're going on.
Geob
It just amazes me what it takes for a house to fall apart. The "burning, fire" issue is the most prevalent. This is where I draw the line. Smoke detectors are a cheap form of life saving products. Stringers and all that.well...usually dont all cave in at once.....Actually when I;ve distmantled my own spec homes (parts of them) its amazing how they continue to stand till the last stud. Absolutly amazes me. Still, I wouldnt be part of that. Isnt an excuse to be a home owner retard flake but non the less.
AS a builder in my opinion you should NEVER EVER turn a blind eye. EVER!
Did I say EVER? Its your dharma (path) in the profession you chose, to lead your customers into the right direction and if they "choose" not to follow your professional advice then in my opinion I say "Walk". Cause for one......guess who's to blame when something goes wrong to that poor vision (or blind eye)? And how would you feel when something really goes wrong. You can do one harmless blind eye thing and
THAT will lead to something serious "coinsidently" and guess what?
Be well
Namaste
Andy
It's not who's right, it's who's left ~ http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
It's hard to know when to stick your neck out. Last wk I had the oppty to talk to someone that wanted to install Lowes cabs w/ a "young man" they knew as the installer. I had to warn her....had to!! Geez lady even if you save $2000 your kitchen is gonna look like it still needs remodeling! (didnt say THAT but I wanted to.)
I look down my nose at people who dare to look down their nose at people.