A customer of mine wants a wooden deck that will be level with a tiled patio that is at ground level. To avoid digging a hole, that would be 24 inches deep or more, the length and width of the deck, to accommodate concrete piers, double 2×8 beams, 2×6 joists, and 3/4 inch Ipe’ decking, would a shallower hole for a 4 inch concrete slab with 2×4 treated sleepers on the flat that the Ipe’ could be placed on be OK? There is no place to put all the dirt.
Any advice would be appreciated.
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Replies
Didn't we just see the inverse of this the other day.
Not necessarily ideal, but workable. I would pour the slab with some pitch so that water doesn't just sit there, orient the sleepers along the pitch instead of across, and build the deck in sections that can be lifted up for periodic cleaning underneath. Instead of 2x4 on the flat you might need tapered sleepers to make the deck level.
Agree it will work per your advice.
I have done much the same when covering existing concrete porches. Never tried the removeable sections thing, but that is a good idea.
Dave
I'd (politely) tell anyone who wanted a wood deck level with a tiled (is it really tile?) grade level patio to find another contractor to do it.....JM2cents worth.....
Sounds workable, but I would put your sleepers at 12" o.c. The problem isn't span, but fastening. You will have almost no ventilation under the deck in your scenario, and the bottom of the Ipe will stay wet longer than the tops and want to cup. And when Ipe wants to cup, it cups. It is so strong that it can just pull the screws out of whatever it is screwed to. Being able to fasten the edges at 12" o.c. will help minimize this, but I would explain to your client that if they want Ipe they should expect some cupping, and it's not something you would consider a warranty issue.
I've a ton or ten of IPE` and never seen it cup yet
WQhat area are you in and do you know where your IPE` is harvested?
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I'm in minnesota and I don't have any idea where the Ipe available here is harvested. I (possibly naively) did't realize it mattered. I guess I'm not talking about turn the board on its side and spell something that starts with "c" cupping, but noticable nonetheless. I've seen it happen to some extent on almost every low to the ground or groundlevel Ipe deck I've looked closely at. Now, we as builders of things have eyes that can pick out flush, plumb, level, etc. from about 30 paces, and maybe the clients don't notice. But I think it's best to assume (and hope) that they do.
Piffen, BTW, when do you find time to build stuff??? I swear I read you giving advice to someone in almost every thread I look at. That's not meant as a knock, I appreciate it very much...you must be a very fast typer.
He's a master at multi-tasking.
either that or he has hired help.
Every once in a while I'll check to see the post count. He might get 100k soon. Wouldn't it be funny if the breaktime counter acts like an old car and cannot handle six digits, and he goes back to the beginning.
LOL. That would be funny. Reminds me about buying used cars and the owner would lie about the odometer readings. "It's only got 120,000 miles" when it really has 220,000.Good page about deck construction issues. I followed virtually all the points that were mentioned, Anchorseal, Penofin, SS screws, etc. I also precoated all sides first, let dry for a week then recoat every fall. In addition, I spread out pea gravel under the deck and put leaf guard (vinyl coated wire mesh) around to prevent leaves from accumulating and potentially giving off more moisture as they decompose.
I personally am tired of seeing lattice used ad nauseum as skirting, so I planted burning bush around the perimeter.
The lattice is ok on the low decks but I like more unique skirts then the standard stuff.
I was up at my sister's place outside burlington vermont and say more than a few decks with lattice on decks that were 10' off the ground. Now that really look nice, lol.
"you must be a very fast typer."you've found the secret to my spelling difficulties, LOL'I sit here with the TV - news, investments, or science channels usually on and reading BTSometimes during the day I'll be doing the book-keepintg and have to break away every couple of hours for sanityOr I'll be doing a CAD design and need to back off and let my subconscious work on a problem and I stop in at BT, It's nice that Windows let's youhave more than one window open at a time...in other words, TGNY has me pegged, I'm busy multi-tasking - both of me get a lot of work done when we're both going the same direction...;)When I'm healthy, I work a good fifty hours on the job - per week.
This winter I had a couple things limit me to a couple days a week. I have good men working for me or I'd be broke.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I think this is some indication of a cupping problem if the underside stays moist. http://www.ironwoods.com/ResInstall.asp
I've seen a few other things here and there about the need for air flow, but I think it's just common sense for any deck. Any wood that dries out quicker on one side than the other will cup, its just how the wood reacts to the difference in moisture.
Good page. I do pay attention to ventialtion
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I had to repair an Ipe deck where the boards had swelled up so much they pulled completely from the EbTy screws. The owner had put a rain catcher (corrugated panels) within a few inches of the underside which prevented the boards from drying.
No cupping, though. Just swollen boards ripped away from the joists.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
I'm afraid I don't have the whole picture here.
Tell me if I'm wrong or flesh out my copnfusion and vacant knowledge on what you are doing
The patio is already there, right?
it is at ground level - how does that compare to the interipr finiwshed floor elevation?
Does ground slope away from sioad patio? Does the patio drain water - is pitched somewhat away from the house?
What is the construction detail;s oifthe patio? Concrete slab under the pavers? Or compacted mineral fill and stone dust?
What sort of retainer is at the edge of the patio?
Finally what sizes are we talking about?
I see this as a doable challenge, but the devil is in the details...
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Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
Paul, very generous to think in terms that this might be your own job. No sarcasm meant here neither.A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Ain't that why we're here?
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Well, I suppose so. But, many posters get a vast array of answers before any "real" particulars are known. Taken in context, there's probably a whole slew of possible different answers, some of which might work. Often we question the existing conditions but you went just a little further. You asked all the questions you would need to figure this job from afar.
Just pointing it out because those that need to know how to do it pretty much now have an example.
Could be the pain pill.
A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
"Could be the pain pill."Yours or mine?
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I don't know.
Meet you behind the school.A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
It will be interesting to have a beer with both of you oldtimers :-)
Not all it's cracked up to be.
Pif and I had a beer together and got lost in Newport.
Helen woulda shot us if she found us.
Well, she did find us sort of. We snuck back on the trolley and then went looking for her looking for us.
And don't get your hopes up. None of us are 18 y.o. girls.A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Well if you want to see that lighthouse in Montauk, I know a couple places out that way.
Yeah would be cool, but that 100 miles andy was talkin about got me camera shy. Any other light a bit closer to the attack?A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
I was NOT LOST. The bus was misplaced!
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
nagar, you can bring the dirt out to my place, more flat yard.
A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time