I would appreciate thoughts on a situation that is frequent, and I’m finding myself increasingly perplexed by. As an architect/interior designer, I often take my clients shopping at showrooms (especially plumbing showrooms, but also lighting and tile) where I count on my relationships with knowledgeable salespeople, extensive product displays, and attention to service to help pick out products. As a trade professional, I am usually given great service with product literature and usually a complete product order list. This list is put into the spec’s.
Product list in hand, the plumber then goes to his favorite wholesale supplier (who has little in the way of display space and customer service for the end user) and orders everything, cutting the original showroom out of their sales commission, which they’ve put effort and money into. I am getting increasingly uncomfortable with this.
I understand that the plumber wants someone they know to back up their order and where they’ve already set up accounts. I prefer that the sub’s buy their own products so they will warranty them, but *I* need showrooms that take care of me and my customers, and I’m starting to detect a little resistance from some that haven’t seen any orders materialize. A few of the showrooms around here are using secret codes to identify the selected products so that they can’t be shopped around, which is annoying. Maybe this is common practice around the country, though, not sure…
What’s the best way to handle this? Buy the products myself? Require a specific supplier in the specs? (I’ll get some fireworks if I do, I suspect.)
Richard
Replies
Richard,
One option would be to have your clients purchase what they like from the showroom/dealer that you take them to. Then just have the plumber in stall the products. The plumber still has to warranty his work and the manufacturer warranties the product.
Another option is to have an allowance setup for these type fixtures by the client. Then you take this allowance money. Then take the client any where you like. After they choose the products within their allowance you buy them. If you can work out a deal where you can get a “better” price, you can use the price difference as incentive. If not, it’s no big deal since you were paid for your time anyway.
Either way you need to “gain” control of the “buying” for these type items. If you don’t there just isn’t anything you can do about it.
Edited 12/30/2002 11:05:16 AM ET by Joe Fusco
I've gotten caught in situations like this - I think we all do to some extent. An architect will call me and ask for some help on a building. I've never turned anyone down. But often after working on the building, I don't get the order. It can certainly be frustrating.
I would sugest talking to the owners/managers of the showrooms about it. Tell them you're concerned, but don't know what to do about it. They may have a solution.
I can definitely understand the fact that they use "secret codes" to identify their products. Seems like that makes good sense. Maybe they shouldn't give out itemized quotes.
It might be a good idea to talk to your customers BEFORE you take them to the showrooms, also. Explain your concerns, and ask they they at least buy PART of their stuff from them.
Did you hear about the guy that lost his left arm and leg in a car crash?
He's all right now.
First of all, as an Arch you should not be buying ANY fixtures UNLESS you are willing to take TOTAL responsibility for missing parts and costs resulting from them, ie. sub has to stop work and return another day with the proper tools to continue the installation, tile man cannot complete tile installation because plumbing can't be installed, etc. This is your GC's responsibility. If he/ she wants to pass on the responsibility to his/ her sub, that's between them. It still remains the GC's responsibility.
As for your showroom dilema. Here are a few thoughts on showroom etiquette:
1. Some showrooms are sponsored by the manufacturer. Ex. Kohler. They have showrooms all over the place. Yes, the rep would like to make a commission, but the showroom is there for Kohler.
2. Then tere's the type of showroom that has great displays but charges triple what another supplier charges for the exact same goods. Now ask yourself "Self, how much work did they do, or advice did they offer?" If they just took you over to the display and then looked in their price list for a price I think you are still able to shop around. If instead, they offered capuccino, mocked up a display unique to your design with various components, mixed and matched - well, if you shop it around after that you may need to re-evaluate your purchase policy.
3. Sometimes it is better to bite the bullet and purchase the required samples to make your own dog and pony show, especially if they are materials you recommend often. Then suplier is a non-issue. Tiles usually fall into this catagory.
4. I have a lighting showroom that I use frequently but rarely purchase at. They are over the top in pricing but they do have pretty extensive displays. I recommend that the client goes there alone though many times they want their hand held. So, I accompany them making sure to say hello or leave a note with a particular rep. At the end of the year I drop off a small gift for the rep as a token of my appreciation. She has simplified my life by opening her doors and directing my clients and I to the proper area of the showroom. I rarely ask for advice and never have her do special mock-ups. The gift is usually jewlery.
5. Other times the showroom has an exclusive on materials. If this is the case, explain to the sales rep that x GC's will be bidding the project. The rep will then make a note of the project name, along with yours. When the GC's call for pricing the rep will a) be prepared, and b) maintain claim to the commission. The GC's should also be informed as to whom they should be dealing with. This saves everyone a lot of busy work.
6. It is an Arch's resposibility to get the required info and catologues/ specs from the manufaturer if you are not going to be purchasing at an independent showroom. Most have 800 numbers and websites now. It's amazing how much info is available with just a few taps at the keyboard or a few tel calls. Many catolgues are available in CD format as well as print. Maybe you can partner w/ someone for a Sweets catologue as a starting point. I understand that this is not as much fun as designing but it's part of the job and therefore has a cost - your time or a reps commission.
7. Have your preferred GC's introduce you to their supply houses. The supply houses have knowledgable staffs that could give you the part/ model #'s and can note the GC's files. Saves time on the bidding side of the process.
Hope this helps. Let me know what you think.
Frankie:
You make excellent points and I agree that there are actually a variety of showroom situations, and a number of different approaches to fit.
Today was a good example, though, of the situation I was referring to. After my initial post on this, I took my client to a local plumbing showroom. The salesperson spent LITERALLY over two hours with us, chasing down finish samples, discussing pro's/con's of various brands, calling a couple of different manufacturers to confirm availability of items, photocopying spec sheets, etc. (This was a more grueling day than most. <g>.) We left with everything picked out and my client is a VERY happy camper. Pricing to my client was retail less 30%. A plumber might get slightly better pricing from a wholesaler, but not enough to justify it in my mind.
I've decided, at least on this one, that no way is the plumber going to decide to go elsewhere. These items will be either furnished by Owner for contractor installation, and plumber can include whatever money is appropriate for risk/warranty, or he can buy direct from this supplier with standard markup. I'll let the GC decide which of these options is more palatable.
Richard
Your plumber is most likely familiar with this showroom. Insist that he/ she by it from them and particularly that sales person who was so helpful. He/ she earned it. Assistance like that is invaluable. I am certain the Client was impressed. Good job!
I need to find these showrooms you guys are talking about. I had a salesman insist a type of retrofit faucet did not exist. I got the info off of the internet and the local plumbing supply ordered it for me. ...that's not a mistake, it's rustic
Those show rooms are easy to find.
All you need to do is take 2 hour bath, put on $200 tie, $300 shirt and $500 suit, manicure. After that print up business card that say you are architect and give that to the sale represent at the store. They will work their butts of to impress you.