Ok, OK, bring it on. I’ve seen all the HD threads, and I can agree with pretty much all the reasons why a lot of people go nuts just thinking about the place. But …
If you lived in a town of 15K, in a county of 45K, with the nearest real city 230 miles down the road, I’m guessing you’d be dancing with me. I am so very tired of hearing, “We don’t have anything like that, but we can get it.” So you order it, at full retail (competitive pricing?? Hah!), then you wait 3 weeks to …
1) Recieve your order, only to find out they ordered the wrong thing
2) Find out that it’s back-ordered
3) Find out that the feral idiot at the builders’ supply never ordered it in the first place
Sure, you walk in HD and you’re on your own. Fine. Anyone in the trades knows that up front, so you walk in, pluck what you need, and you leave. But it was there! I love it! So if you’re into HD bashing, save it, because I already read your post, and I may well agree with it. But when they open next month, you’ll see me right there in the front of the line!
Replies
Man-
You'll love'em...
They are the best....
They never order the wrong thing.... Ever!
No back orders... EVER!!!!!!
And always order it right away... seconds after you leave the store.
It's great!
Now click those ruby slippers and repeat after me
" There's no place like home"
Oh yea and don't think twice about all the Americans they put out of work in your town and others putting the little guy outta buisness while sending your hard earned cash to China for those great products like "glacier bay" or "Hampton Bay" etc. Here's hoping you never need parts for them because.....HA! HA! HA!...................
YOU CAN'T GET THEM!
I've lived enough places and patronized them enough to know what they can and can't, will and won't do. I also know that every time a larger retailer comes to town, all of a sudden the local businesses find a new level of courtesy and service they didn't seem to have before. They were doing just what they needed to do to satisfy customers, and no more.
Competition?? They never heard of the word. If they're whining now about the competition, they should have discovered that extra level of service a little earlier. I'm personally sick of being gouged. I understand the argument you're making ... I just don't buy it.
I agree that competition never hurt anyone. I will never forget when Wally World came here. (pop. is 13,000 for the WHOLE county). I think a tear came to my eye. It was the first semblance of home since I had left Knoxville. Have a great day at HD. I like to go and just look. You don't really have to buy;-)
As a side note... the local suppliers also sale stuff from China didn't you all know?Tamara
I've not ordered enough special order tiems to probably matter, but the first thing I ordered were a coulpe of 14' 1.75"x11-7/8" LVLs. Took about three days to get and I got them for $10 less than the cheapest lumber yard in Atlanta had them for. So, I got three of them beasties.
The second special order were Simpson I-Joist hangers that are not stocked as a norm in HD or Lowes. Within 60 hours I had 24 of these babies in my hand and at a quarter less per unit than the cheapest building material shop had them.
No, I'm not a builder by trade, but I to build by need. So, I saved $36. Was it worth it? Well, the HD was 3 miles and the nearest lumber yard and or builder's supply house was about 14 miles. You do the math.
Not saying the are the king's solution to everything, but I don't go there for building advice (I ask builders for that, including some of you), just to buy something I am already ready to buy.
man you are so lucky. be sure when you need to order some custom doors and windows order from them especially if your on a tight schedule with a penalty clause in your contract.
Also be sure to ask for there helpful advice.
Theyre sales people are always ready to assist you when you need it and know where everything is in the store.
Oh yes besure to buy all your tools from them. they got the best return policy in the business. At Darkworks Customer satisfaction Job One..Yea yea were all over it...
You didn't listen so good. Will I place my special orders there for building materials? Nope. Got my door and window rep for that. Ask for advice? Nope. I'll ask someone I know, or who knows, I might even end up here with a question.
But all 2 hardware stores and 3 lumber yards in town would do little more than fill the corner of HD. The rest is all gravy as far as I'm concerned. It's called "choice", and now I have it. I'll take it.
BEMW, I completely understand what you're talking about. I once lived in a very rural area and know your dilemma first hand, HD would have been a godsend despite its faults.
As this store opens and operates through its first couple of years, see if it mirrors what I noticed through a couple HD that have set up shop here?
-Day one: Shinny, neat, clean store. A nicely stacked wide choice of merchandise. An orange vested employee lurking in every corner ready to help. Quick in and out.
-Few months later: Most items you purchase, you will set aside two or three pieces before you find one not damaged or package opened. Stocking not so neat anymore making it a bit more time consuming to find what you want.
-One year later: Items you saw in the first few months are no longer available. Stock has been paired down to allow for a depth of merchandise instead of breadth (choice). Freestanding cardboard displays are thick in the isles and many times must be moved as to see items on the shelf. Most of the lumber carts have a bad wheel.
-Beyond one year: What should be couple minute shopping trip takes too long, especially in the pluming or electrical departments, nothing is where the shelf tag says it is, many of the tags are missing or its completely out of stock because they have no idea what's on hand anymore (even though the computer says they have fifty). No one is able to help you locate anything because they have only half the staff they had on day one and the remaining staff spend the day locating SKU #'s for the front register people.
Scott R.
Edited 12/11/2002 10:04:39 AM ET by Scott R.
I hear you, and I have seen what you're talking about in their stores, and I agree with you. Despite all that, here's what I see happening in our area ...
You have a small town, untouched by the big box syndrome. The locals offer a limited amount of materials at pretty steep prices. Some of them treat you fairly; others downright gouge you. And while it's still a small town, you don't really get that "small town" service, because it seemed many of the business people have never been anywhere that they have observed good service.
The big box announces its plans to enter the local market. Local businesses howl and scream that it's "unfair" (this despite the fact that most of them are of the conservative ilk, worshipping free enterprise, until anyone like WalMart or HD carries it to the point that they're REALLY successful, then it's all of a sudden "unfair"), and they can't compete. Huh? I thought competition was the name of the game. The locals scramble to reorganize and remodel their stores, and they discover a "new level of service" they can offer (where was it before?).
The big box opens. Everyone flocks there, initially, and the locals take a hit. It's honeymoon time for the big box. And then, the process you describe starts to set in. I've seen it in the HD 50 miles from here, and I saw it in other large cities I've lived in.
The homework paid off for the locals who paid attention. They've gone through a process they needed to anyway, for the health of their business. After the honeymoon, a fair contingent of the shoppers make their way back to the local stores, because they know where the bolt bins are, they know the faces. The level of service is better than before.
What's the end result? I know HD's service will suffer from the git go. I know that even if they have holes in their inventory, their stock will far surpass what the locals can or will do. But in the end, I will have more choice, and the competitive pricing keeps the local outfits on their toes. So again, I'll take what I can get, and to me, it all means "choice".
Edited 12/11/2002 1:03:48 PM ET by BEMW
I thought for sure when a HD opened about 40 miles away, that the Ace Hardware a block away wouldn't last out the year.
It's been 5-6 years, and the last time I was in Ace, they were crowded as all get out. They seem to focus on hiring people that can actually help you, and they're all friendly. Seems like they're still doing ok.
The HD? Still clean, most things where they should be, much larger selection of things. Ocassionally have to step around stock in the aisles. Sucks to check out, nearly always takes too long. Not as bad as the local KMart, but close. Both have their place. I like Ace and hope they continue to do well. If I just need a few things, I usually go to one of the 3 hardware stores within a couple of miles of me. Ocassionally, I hit the HD. My BIL lives close, and lets me know when they put out big piles of close-out stuff. Gotten some good stuff real cheap that way.
Been in a Lowes 2-3 times, don't really have an opinion of them. Nearest one is hundreds of miles away.
Scott , that same type of thinf just happened in our small town. We got a new super center . Everyone was so excited to get it. We got it and it took four police cars directing traffic for the first two days. Tried buying groceries there and they wont put enough checkers on staff. I was there last night and only three lights were on . So , Im waiting in line to watch 2 price checks . Total check out time 15 minutes . I will not buy groceries there now . Old Piggly Wiggly is doing great business again . I can be in and out in 5 minutes . Hello Walmart ?
Tim Mooney
AMEN!
That seems to be the case at the big orange box, especially a couple of years down the road because they are desperately trying to make some additional money in additional stores that they open in mature markets. The additional stores have to cannibalize from one another for sales. I agree totally that the help is abysmal. Think logically for a second, if you had it together in a trade, would you settle for the 10 or 12 bucks an hour that HD pays? NO WAY!, so you get the slackers who are thrilled to be working inside with heat instead of working out in the snow. Just my two cents, but your post hit home with me as I have trudged through aisles and had tons of stuff shown to be on hand in abundance yet there is nothing on the shelf.
Later,
Jeff
Went to my local lumber yard yesterday. I walked up to the order desk. before I could even open my mouth. The man behind the counter said "Yes Sir May I help you" I told him I need a few 2X4s in fact just 4 of them but I needed them straight as they were going to be used for a base for a vanity and a moblie base for my router table. "Yes Sir We'll get you some straight ones" I paid the guy walked fast to the cash register and walked back (all of about 30 seconds or so , "Sorry for keeping you waiting Sir, heres your invoice" "Thank you Sir go out to the service desk in the yard and one of our guys will get them for you" I did 2 minutes later the yard bird walked up and said "yes Sir can I help you" I handed him the ticket, explained I need some straight boards and why. He walked over to the 2X4 lumber rack that had the lumber neatly stacked. "Here Sir is that straight enough for you"? (They looked as straight as a arrow) "Yep those will do Thank you". "Thank you Sir Please come again". As I was walking out to my truck He came running (literally) out to me " Oh Sir you forgot your invoice" "thank you I said"
Wait til ya go to your Home D---do about 3 months after they opened and then tell me about it.
Darkworks..The safety guards have been removed for demonstrations purposes only
Ron, Where do you live? If anyone around here acted like that I'd probably drop dead from the shock!!!!!cc
That was Ganahl Lumber in Buena Park Calif. It used to be Buena Park Lumber(another family owned yard opened since the 1920's but was recently bought by Ganahl) Ganahl is a family owned place that has started to expand. Its been around since the turn of the century. Great place profesional people, drive right into the yard they load the stuff on your truck and you drive out. Have I mentioned that I now buy my tools (at least the delta and pc ones) at a place called Battels in Whittier. Its now run by the son but the the old man (probably in his 70s still stops by) They are a delta/pc distributor and factory repair center. Its also a Ace Hardware. Heres why I buy from them:
Shady just returned from Pakistan. He wanted to buy a delta platinum series shaper. We went to western tool supply another chain some of you guys in the northwest know about them. Shady was his debit card out waiting to buy it. The salesman had it on the Forklift. We measured it wouldnt fit on shadys truck cuz of his canopy. so Shady wanted to lay it on its side. Salesman said No it could get damaged that way. We wanted to open the box to if it would fit. Salesman said No if it wouldnt fit he'd be stuck with a shaper. We asked if He would deliever it (Its only accross town about 20-30mins away) Salesman said no they dont deliever(But they do for there internet sales)
Went to Battels looked at the shaper. Told them it wouldnt fit in the truck asked them I fthey deliever. They said when you gonna be home we'll put it on the trailer and get it out to you. They did when they said they would set it right in shadys garageand they did it free of charge. Let the Home Di---o compete with that.
At Darkworks Customer satisfaction Job One..Yea yea were all over it , I got my best guys on it.........
Edited 12/13/2002 6:20:12 PM ET by RonT
Edited 12/13/2002 6:29:20 PM ET by RonT
Ron:If more of the yards in this country had service even close to what you describe, The boxes wouldn't exist. My local family-owned yard bought up all the local competition about 15 years ago and closed them all down. They now stock junk at exhorbitant prices, are rude, and have the nerve to advertise that we should all "buy local". Every time this tread topic comes up, someone always says how good service is worth a premium- and I agree. Too bad that after 100+ years the local place can't figure out the without good prices, good service, or good selection, there isn't much reason to buy local. I dislike the boxes, and I hate to drive 30 miles for a widget, but enough is enough.
=====Zippy=====
Although I don`t get the "sir" treatment (I`ve been shopping my local lumber yard better than 20 years) I wouldnt dream of shopping elsewhere. No they don`t stock the selection of a HD, but if its quality product, they can order it for me and have it in a day or two. The guys in the yard pretty much ignore me, as I probably know where the stuff is better than they do. Return policy cant be beat..returned a ten foot 2 x 12 for a fourteen footer without having to go inside. One of the boys ran inside when he had a spare minute and informed the guy at the register. My next trip back the kid told me we were square. Try that at HD! Sure I`m paying more, but that cost is passed on to the client who wouldnt know if a two by cost 10 cents a foot or ten bucks. I`ll gladly pay premium prices for premium materials and premium service. I know not everyone is so lucky to have a yard such as this...but if HD had to match my fav yard, it would be they who folded.J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
"DO IT RIGHT, DO IT ONCE"
Jay what ya mean you dont like asking a floor person where theyre electrical tools are and they send you to the tool coral dont find what ya need so ya drive accross town to get it then a week or two later your walking in the store and wander by the electricasl section and see everything you needed or ask some one where something was and was sent on the proverbial goosechase till ya get frustrated and go to a smaller business and just pick it up, ya dont like standing in the return line forever then be told ya cant return it and they wont even give ya store credit while your standing under a sign that says 100% customer satisfaction guarenteed... .......
At Darkworks Customer satisfaction Job One..Yea yea were all over it , I got my best guys on it.........
Ron,
I'm not going to pay for that cabinet, now that I know you've had your "guys" all over it.
LOLDon't bogart the Ghost
Quittin' Time
ONE thing HD does better than any merchant I know, is take your money. <g> Slide the credit card, a couple seconds wait before I can sign, and before I'm finished signing they're handing me the receipt and I'm out the door! The best Ace Hardware here in K.C. has brand new computers but they're way slow in comparison.
Thon
" You didn't listen so good."
What? Huh? Im sorry I couldnt hear you over the clicking of the key board..now its stopped..what did you say....
Darkworks..The safety guards have been removed for demonstrations purposes only
You know, it doesn't have to be that way at the big boxes....
I recently bought all the windows and exterior doors for my whole-house remodel from Lowes. The guy in the millwork dept. was knowledgeable, courteous, and helpful.
He pointed out that he had a door in stock that was just what we were looking for. And it was on sale for a price that was less than half the price of similar doors in his inventory and in the catalogs at other local suppliers.
He correctly spec'ed and ordered seven multi-unit casements, and they arrived when he said they would.
The next time I was in the store, he asked my how the windows worked out.
My trips to the biggest lumber yard in the area have yielded only frustration. Even more frustrating is the fact that as a DIYer I have to either take time off from work or get there promptly on Saturday morning thanks to their business hours.
The local HD, on the other hand, is an almost complete waste of time. According to one of my friends who worked there for ~6 months, its problems are mostly the product of the person in charge.
K-
-
"The average player must be allowed to theorize to some extent. It is a necessary concession to him as a thinking animal… On the other hand, if he does not recognize hitting the ball as his main business, and theory as a recreation, he becomes so bad a player that he nearly gives up." Sir Walter Simpson, The Art of Golf
Thanks Ron That makes my point nicely. They are not a custom order house. They have Lumber and crap that you need to get through the day, or night. The kind of stuff that you just need one of. And they have a lot better hours then 7:00 To 4:00. I can swing by one on my way home and pick up what I want. Most nights I don't get off until way after everyone else is closed. Sunday afternoon when I want a couple of 2x4's they are open. If I want to custom order cabinets or doors or buy a lumber package for a house then I go to the proper place. And I think most people here do the same. I can't recall who right now but there have been a couple of people who have made the statement that they have ordered custom cabinets from them and the order has been totaly botched. Well DUH! Look at what they are. And look at what you want. Totaly different.
Part of your non-problem is that you seem to be in Atlanta which is where Home Depot is headquartered.
-Peter
Lawyers are more expensive than Indians.
25550.28 in reply to 25550.5
Part of your non-problem is that you seem to be in Atlanta which is where Home Depot is headquartered.
..... which just happens to remind me of a story. My first job after moving here was to finish the interior of a little 6K sq. ft. weekender for Rick & Becky Mayo of Atlanta. Don't know Rick & Becky? He was one of the original partners in HD. Stole the idea from a chain he saw on a trip to England.
So they needed a little getaway after finishing a $1M "addition" to their place in Atlanta ... a rec room for the teenagers, don't you know.
Big-time log house, 30' ceilings, antler chandeliers 15' tall, 6 x 10 copper hood in the kitchen, etc. Great countertops ... GC drove to Green River, WY, and retrieved slabs of limestone full of fossil fish, like 6-10" long. They were all buried under the first layer of the slab, but the quarry dude could "read" where they were, and had marked them with a crayon. Couple passes with a diamond wheel on a R/A grinder, and Voila!, fishies on the countertop. The stuff was actually very easy to work, and scribed to the logs like butter.
Don't know how I got started on this, but I have to go, so, there you go!
Good morning BEMW, I've got about 40 minutes until HD opens this morning and since it's only 10 minutes away that gives me 30 min. to fool around.
Yea I'm heading to HD this morning to pick up some const. adhesive and 2" scraper blades for jobs I've got going.
For all you HD bashers out there I'll paraphrase Clint Eastwood. A man's got to know HD's limitations.
With that in mind it's a great place and their return policy is hard to beat.
Too bad you didn't get a Lowes. Not a whole lot different except in 6 months the Lowes would still be clean and organized. Never seen that in any HD.
Don
I'll take what I can get.
"Too bad you didn't get a Lowes. Not a whole lot different except in 6 months the Lowes would still be clean and organized. Never seen that in any HD."
I have only been in one HD, but several Lowes. From my limited experience you are correct.
We have an HD about 4 miles to the west that has been open sometime and a Lowes about 2 miles to the west that has been open about 2 years. Next year they are building a new HD about 2 miles to the east. Interesting to watch that store.
I do go to HD when I have too. Like last month I needed some of the clamps for romex that will allow you to stack multiple cables, but Lowes did not carry them.
But last year I put in a lot of drainage I had to go to both stores to get what I needed. I was at Lowes looking at some trench drains and was talking to a guy looking for some catch basins. Lowes was short of what he needed. I think went to HD to see what they had. While I was looking a clerk shows up with this other guy trying to find the catch basins. The clerk had no idea of what or where. I had to show the clerk and the customer. I had to dig through a couple of stacks of unopened boxes stuff. The boxes had been setting out in the garden center and where detoriating from the rain.
They will respond if you push them. Local new HD had only one or two people at the checkout everytime I went. Big lines would form and you could easily spend 20-30 minutes in line waiting, while other droids walked around. I called HD and told them I was doing remodelling that was going to use $10-20K in materials, my time was precious, and the next time I waited more than 5 minutes to check out that I was leaving my stuff right there and walking out for the last time. I haven't had to wait since.
Two days ago, I was trying to order a portable dishwasher since the kitchen reno wasn't going to get done before baby boingo arrived. Twice the appliance people at Lowes said they would call me back and didn't, so I called the national b*tch line, they transferred me to that stores manager, and the manager walked over to appliances while I chatted with them, and the most recent guy who blew me off became real attentive. I don't like doing that, but I believe everyone needs to realize that people with money can make choices in where they shop. Lowes already lost a sale on a new washer on Saturday because the appliance guy was too busy doing something else, and I informed the national customer service person of that, and if the local appliance store had had a comparable dishwasher at the time, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Both Hechingers and Home Base have gone out of business, and there is no guarantee for either Lowes or HD that the same thing can't happen to them. Consider that HD stock has dropped from 40 to 25 in the last 6 months, and you really have to wonder if there aren't some major problems in that industry. You can complain here, but a solution will only occur when you let THEM know you are ticked off.
When I go to HD I already know what I want and where to find it. If they don't have it I go else where.
I have only custom ordered something once, shingles. They were supposed to take 4 days to deliver and I asked the order desk person if they could get it speeded up and get them to me in 2 days so I would have them that weekend. They said they would try but after reading all the stuff here I figured it was a slim chance. I got a call the next day telling me that they would be delivered the following morning, they also delivered the insulation and lumber I ordered and the delivery guy told me that they had substituted some more 16' 2x8s for the 12' I had ordered because the gal picking my order didn't like how straight the 12's were.
Maybe the HD in Canada are different, or maybe it's just a different culture but unless you go on a weekend during the middle of the day you can always find someone to help you if you need it, they may not be the most informed person but at least they can tell me if they have something I am looking for.
We don't have Lowes, but we do have Revy which is (was?) a Canadian based chain which has both Superstores, and older/smaller hardware stores. We also have a number of other national chains like Totem which are smaller but still pack enough variety and stock to perhaps keep the HD's more service oriented.
Robert
Like I've said before HD fills a big void for what they are intended for. I think most people get mad when they try to use them for more then what they are. I love the conveniance of them.
"Like I've said before HD fills a big void for what they are intended for."
Bawahahahaha! I've got 8 home depot's within 10 miles of home base and 2 Lowes.
The only Void is in their location specialists head.
Newest store is less then 2 years old oldest is over 8 and they all give the same level of service. If they had any sense they'd combine all that waste of space and employees into one well staffed, well stocked store.
But my bucks go to the local yard where everyone knows me and I know my spent dollar goes through many local hands before winding up in china.
You mouth off about China, Give me some examples where HD does and your local lumber yard doesn't. They basicly buy from the same places. Most of our lumber comes from Canada. Are you talking about tools? They both sell the same brands. Give me something to work with here.
Edited 12/13/2002 9:06:54 PM ET by Gunner