*
Jim –
I’ve had dealings with HD and find they carry discontinued items and seconds. I’ve also heard that some materials are being made specifically for them, so quality may be an issue there.
The larger picture is a social one, the end of the local supplier/hardware store, and I stopped shopping HD, and other box stores, for that reason as well.
Best – Don
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Now let me see if I got this right Bill. To save $15, you drove for 3 hours, put 100? miles on your truck, consumed 15? gallons of fuel, added x number of pounds of carbon to the environment, added more damage to the streets, wasted 3 hours of your time (worth what, maybe $40 an hour?)not to mention the extra trip back to the original Home Depot to return the first drill. All this to save 15 dollars? With all due respect, Bill, I would say that you just spent a heckuva a lot more resources to acquire that second drill, but that's just my way of thinking...
*
Lawrence,
Or should I say, "lostrence"....McDonalds go under????...I know at least three owners of stores...Two of them went from flipping burgers to multimillionares in years....How much are you worth?
If you understand anything, know one thing...Leading corporations don't go under very often....they may have a tough year here and there but I bet you all the milkbones I can gather neither store disapears in the next 50 years...
J
*jonathon,Totally true with 80% of the Kmart 'blue lite" special trained Americans...I have had to slap myself over and over again to stop from doing it to(o)....Free time or rec. time is all I allow now for such silliness and I better know my prices from a needed trip, the phone, an ad, or past experience.....Mailorder with free shipping and no sale tax, and buying returned merchandise is a nice low price way to go...But even better now is I've finally lost the need to buy a new tool all the time...Now I buy and replace for tax purposes, almost making money!..Now that's satisfying.J
*Did I hear a milkbone bet?I'm in!Blue
*Two cents coming! Billy, quit reading threads that don't interest you, and when you get hooked in, quit complaining! You really sounded silly!I happen to love the big box! I am careful to scrutinize my purchases though.The big boxes have made the builder supply a lot more competitive. You are now saving a lot of money at your other suppliers because of pricing pressure that the boxes generate! Be thankful for that, if nothing else!Do you guys that refuse to patronize the box really like spending 50% more for tools such as tinsnips, channellocks, etc. Your material suppliers have raked in huge markups on that stuff 'cause they used to be the only place to get it! If you were lucky enough to have a "tool" store in your region (50 mile radius) you wereat their mercy concerning the stock and supply. How I hated to hear those words "Special Order, it'll be here in blah, blah, blah!" I need the thing NOW!Blue
*I'm continuing my ling ranting useless pest in more than one reply. This will trick Joe into thinking I am getting to the point easier!I used to drive tons of miles looking for specialized tools, now I can just breeze through hd. Almost every trade's tools are there, making me an expert in many fields. I know longer wonder how electricians strip the romex, I bought a romex stripper at hd for $1.97. Could I have found that at a lumber yard? If I happened to wander in to Ray White Electric, could I possibly even see that little thing hanging on the board along with 45,00 other things behind the counter?Hd has opened my eyes to a substantially larger building supply world than ever before. it is a remodlers mecca! You can spend hours reading the labels on paint, and glue cans and learn more than most tradesmen! I can whip through the store, and walk out with $300 worth in a hurry! I used to have to make my own 50' 12 guage power tool cords. The cheap homeowner stuff was a joke. A 12 guage, type OS cord with a manly end used to cost me $60 for a 50 footer! And it was heavy as hell to lug around. Now i get a lifetime warranty on the yellow stuff, a much better product, and a lot faster to put into service! And at $30 or so! That would be well over 100$ in today's money! I bought my first power mitre box for more than 300$, and it is junk compared to the stuff that's on the Hd shelf today! Sorry Rockwell, oops porter cable, oops rockwell! opps porter cable! Geez I wish they'd make up their minds!I've walked into mu nail supply company and gotten them to match Hd's price on paslode framing nailers! Thank you HD! that $100 bucks will but me a lot of java for the upcoming bloodfest, I mean FHB ghet together!Blue
*Too bad Joe!When did you ever walk into a hardware and find 200' of nuts, bolts, washers, and other similar fasteners? you simply built with what they gave you, and it was usually wrong!Your only choice was a catalogue! who in their right ming wants to buy a $300 tool without trying it out? I've got 1/2 ton of stuff in my barn that I wouldn't use for anchors that came from cataloges! count yourBlue bleesings, I'm stopping now!
*We're guilty to the tune of $5,000 per month,mostly odds and end stuff but it adds up.Been dealing with the same lumber guy for 10+years but he's to far away to run and get 5 2x4s (yeah, he'd deliver me 5 but we need it now).Like blue said in a previous post my lumber yard guy stocks anything we need or can generally get it in a day.They also have a mill, stair, door and counter shop,but,he doesn't have everything that the big boxes stock.Maybe that's why he occasionally shops at the Lowes store near him!You can't beat the Depot commercial charge account,monthly statement each invoice listed with job name as well as items bought.Only wish they could come up with some other greeting besides "how are you doing".RE: Going out of buisness, $10,000 of depot stock in 1981 or $10,000 worth of tools which would have been a better investment?
*Now we know how Blue got so smart,He's been reading labels at HD!I gotta find me one of these stores!!!!!
*I used to ignore these hunches but lately I've been bang on too many times. You heard me...You may as well put all those milkbones in an envelope...unless I have to come down there to collect. You can't fool the people for ever...Macs aint selling so well in England any more. Computer stocks are hot till 2 months into 2000 and just watch the grief the banks go through towards d-day. I'm emptying all the accounts just to watch them squirm.
*I'm glad I didn't have to rely on a pension from Aichinheads. I'd probably like the depot a little more if they would buy something from me.L
*Computers and banks....Are you a scatter brain or what??We're talking McDs and HD....no banks...no computers...Time to bury your head in the sand cause the scarey millenium is coming????b Give me a Break!!J
*I work in a small town (not quite 30,000 people) in a small county (70,000). Three years ago I needed a router, and I needed it NOW. I went to every hardware store and lumberyard in the area and the ONLY router that was on hand to purchase was the Craftsman at Sears. Everytime I use it I wish Lowe's had gotten here sooner.On the other hand, I am increasingly trying to get my stuff from sources that are a bit more local in nature. They pay their help better, and their help is better (usually).Rich Beckman
*Maj, that was the nicest thing any one on thenet has said abo
*
We hear alot of stuff about BIG HD and the little guy can't compete and yada yada yada. We live in a capitalist society. Don't be fooled by the little guy. He isn't in this racket for kicks, he's out to make a buck...and to squeeze out his competition if he can. Just like the HD. Oops, my dimes up.
*
The boxes are tough to beat. I have a locksmith friend whose family has been in the business for 75 years. He told me that he can but from HD cheaper than he can buy wholesale on some popular brand locks! OUCH!
Blue
*"They pay their help better?" Is that an assumption?
*Jonathan let me help you to see the light. Some times I have more then one job in more then one location. Due to area that we work in here in less then a hour I can cross three state lines( ok so DC ain't a state) On the drill in question I was out in Vir when the old right angle gave out. Bought a new one at the local home depot and finished the job there. When I left to return to a another job located in MD. and had to stop to pick up some supplies. Have to cruse the tool section. Found the same drill for 15 bucks less. Walked out to the truck and returned the drill there and bought the same one there for the 15 bucks. Total loss of time was 15 minutes. Like a 60 dollar billing rate.
*I guess it depends on how you figure it, but from comments made to me by various people at various times, the average pay rate at the local yard and the local hardware store is higher than the average wage at Lowes.Assumption? I call it an informed guess.Rich Beckman
*I watched as a HD clerk painfuuly counted out every nut, bolt and washer for my 25 item purchase as the line grew longer and longer behind me. I went to HD because I was not near my farm supply center that sells the same fasteners (even the same manufacturer) by the pound. They just weigh them up and you're gone - and at half the HD price. While I was there, I asked to see a full mortise deadbolt - the clerk took me to fasteners. When I asked for pricing on a particular Milwaukee item, they said they don't carry it - only items they can move fast. HD, Lowes and all the other home center stores are high volume, mass merchandisers that are home center stores - not commercial liumberyeards; if you want a commodity - like drywall, they may be OK. But don't count on them for commercial grade products (try to buy Stanley bonderized hinges at a HD). What goes around comes around and before long someone is going to come up with the idea of a good old fashioned lumber yard/hardware store!
*cc, whoa dude, don't be looking at me for approval. I GO to HD when I have to, and don't feel the least bit guilty. Mom and Pop's have been gouging me for years, so, as far as I'm concerned, they've dug their own holes (with extremly high priced post hole diggers). I've paid my dues to that club. That doesn't mean I don't go there anymore, either. I just use my options. Just wonderin' why you're bitchin'. Don't we all know why we go to HD? The Price is Right! It's sure not the service, or in lumber cases, quality. OK, I do mosey around the tool corral and get in some fondling, while my wife is in the garden shop. And, one thing is for sure, they have put more choices under one roof.I also don't care if Home Depot goes under. Before this incarnation it was Home Quarters, and before that, Hechingers. So what if it's Hechy's Depot next? Oh, and thanks for the hint, but I'll go almost anywhere for info.
*Agreed! Agreed! Agreed!I'd like to see that good old fashioned lumber/hardwae store set up right next to the box!That would be the best of both world's!Blue
*Having been on both sides of the fence ( I worked for Hechinger/HQ teaching clinics ), Let me shed a little light.HD does pay better than the competition. The benifits & working environment are better too. They do make an effort to try & hire folks from the trades & have cross training for the employees. Part of the reason you get floor associates (industry term) that don't know anything is they can't hire that many trades people away. Why? The hours SUCK! Also if you are good & can find work most of the time you can still make more.Don't get me wrong, I'm not in love with the places. But for convienince & pricing (I know what I'm looking for) they're hard to beat
*I know a half dozen counter boys that moved over to the new Lowes for pay raises, more benefits, the retirement fund and stock discounts, and the chance to move up through management and make even more money....Much more "potential job movement than at the local yard.J
*Several points have come up that I wonder about too. Some things I have heard from reasonable sources on, so here goes:1. HD segregates lumber by quality. The good stuff goes to competative markets, while one store markets get the remainder.2. As for tools, HD (and other boxes) get the same stuff as everyone, but as someone noted, it is only the stuff that moves fast.Now personal experience:1. "New" stores (around Washington D.C.) seem better than older ones. After they have been open for a while, they seem to go downhill in terms of stock and floor help.2. Other than tools, I do wonder about the boxes getting "specially made" items. Even buying name brand like Hunter, I have had enough problems to wonder if the manufactures do "special" runs for boxes. After all, there are only a few manufacturing plants around for any particular item, so that is where everything gets made. Sears "house brand" items are made by some major manufacturer, but in some special way, just for Sears.3. Here is how I like to shop in general: I want to know two things: that I can go someplace and get a pretty good price (it doesn't have to be the absolute lowest, just close); but more importantly, I want to know that I can go and get what I want in the quantity that I want. HD basically does this, Hechinger's does not. But I am only a hobbiest, so I am not buying in large amounts where price can really make a difference.What really drives me nuts is that I often have no way of telling if I am getting a quality made item or not. I can be reasonably certain that if the price is really cheap, it probably doesn't have any quality. But I can't be certain of the opposite; if I spend a lot of money, I don't necessarily get a quality product. After all, in a complex item like a power tool, it only takes one bad critical item to trash the tool, like cheap bearings or something. And since I don't do this every day, it is hard for me to tell when slop in tolerences will affect me and when it won't. So I love hearing from people who use power tools more often than I do mention what specifically creates a problem with a tool or what makes it really nice to use.Thanks for all the help!
*Re. power tools,when Lowes opened, they had the best, not it is what moves the fastest. Hint, when they are changing formats, you can deal on various items, and often you will get it at your price. I did that with several power tools that had reached the end of their life.Dennis
*First, disclosure: my son (2) put his modest college fund in HD stock, more than doubled in a year, better than the market. smart toddler.HD has a superb upper management team, that's what has enabled them to clobber the other boxes. But management at each store is also a big factor. We have two (2) HD's within 15 minutes. The Alexandria store was pretty sorry, and the employees were clearly unhappy, when a new one in Falls Church opened. The new one was perfectly stocked .. for a while ... but the employee attitude was entirely different -- really nice (I won't shop where the staff is abused). Now the mgmt at the Alex. store has changed and it's the better store.... Management can make or break a cutthroat business like this. I'm sure others, like me, shift their business as conditions change.I buy from HD, a Hechinger's, 2 lumberyards (one generic and one high-end), 3 mailorder outfits, and, for drywall & plaster, a building supply. I am lucky enough to have a sense of their strengths and weaknesses, what's where and what it's worth. The people who complain they don't get enough handholding at HD, or that only high volume stuff is stocked, or that the salespeople astonishingly are not all knowledgeable tradespeople dishing out free advice (though I've met a few, and know them by name now!), or that the checkout process is inefficient could have gone to a lumberyard but didn't -- and they're not saying get rid of HD, but make it better. These are the sort of criticisms that mgmt should listen to.The great thing is the competition and choice involved. I don't think one type of store will kill off another, and I don't see much evidence of HD pulling the dirty tricks it is accused of. I do see that the competition is good for the consumer (including the middlemen, contractors!). Would you rather have extra cash go into buying product or your profit?As for the sentimental Norman Rockwell idea of protecting small business, small farms, etc. I think the market will provide just fine. Noncompetitive small concerns big and small will not survive, unless shielded by mindless political protectionism (such as forces us to pay 7 times the world price for sugar ... so Coke switches to corn syrup). I am not going to pay an extra $30 for a drill to subsidize the local hardware store -- my charity goes to people who don't have enough medicine or food -- but I do pay outrageous markups for odds and ends all the time because of the convenience (and not their "expertise"). This is about capitalism, not charity. And I think the millwork & specialty hardware (hinges too) at the high-end lumberyard makes HD's look hideous. Different niches, different practices. IF HD slips into antitrust or predatory behavior, my opinion will change ... for now, overall, I think the growth of the "home improvement" market will benefit everyone. (A couple of years ago, for example, HD settled a sexual discrimination suit that it was shunting women into cashier positions rather than floor positions with advancement potential.)P.S. The stuff about HD selling craftily degraded versions of brand name products is just silly rumor. They carry the same warranties and, unlike, Sears, you know exactly whose reputation you're buying from. A lot of stuff they sell is junk -- so don't buy it, including the lumber. I have found it trivial to return defective or judst unwanted products to HD. BTW, a big reason that the lumber looks bad to some people is that the stuff on top is always someone else's culls. Underneath, the product is fine.
*They let you return a USED drill? Wow. :)I took a Tool Crib offer for a Paslode framing nailer that I saw the same day I bought one from HD to management; they matched the offer on the spot, giving me a no-mar tip, extra battery & 2 fuel cells (all worth about $90) for the same price. No hassle, no suspicious looks. Satisfied, no, downright pleased, customer.
*The attitude of retail companies twords their employees can be interesting. My wife and I used to shop a lot at Orchard Supply Hardware. They grew out of a cooperative in the San Francisco bay area when there were orchards covering the south bay, hence the name. They later were forced to become a for profit business and recently got bought out by Sears. I used to work part time there for a couple years before they were boughty by Sears.One neat little trick they had was to avoid paying overtime by some creative accounting with computers. At that time in California, you had to pay overtime (1 1/2 time) anytime an hourly employee worked over 8 hours a day. They had a policy of rounding off the last 15 minutes, and used a magnetic stipe time card reader. Certain members of management had a policy of keeping people 15 minutes late before they were allowed to clock out. This especially happened at night when they would lock the front door so that you couldn't get out until everybody left together for "security reasons".Employees had to sign a printout that their time was correct before getting their check. That same printout was manufactured by the computer to "round off" the quitting time to a particular number (say 9:47 PM) such that an exact 8-hour quitting time was shown even though employees were working the extra 15 minutes. A small irritation to each employee, but can make the company a bit of extra money with thousands of employees. Also breeds some disrespect for the company.My wife and I rarely shop there anymore.
*... and also illegal. Another growing practice is to call more and more employees "assistant managers." Managers don't get overtime, or even hourly pay, but many end up doing the same work as the people whom they supervise -- and who make more! This sort of sham can be prosecuted, but I don't think it happens oftens these days with the labor movement relatively weak and everyone saying that labor demands for more $$$ would spark inflation. One of the interesting aspects of the economic boom of the last few years is how little it has done for the average wage slave. Yet everyone feels better off, maybe perception is the most important thing.
*Andrew, The depot is growing in our area. They are opening a new Expo Design Center in Fairfax this year. They currently have 8 and are planning 6 new centers this year. Is Smoots your high end yard? One gripe with depot is they put so much stuff on the floor you can't push a cart up the aisle.Trivial complaint, but for some reason it bugs the heck out of me.
*
HD, HQ, Lowes all stink at customer service if you want my opinion. The new stores are good for a short time, then it's the same story. The become dirty, understocked and the help on the floor is undertrained to say the least. Having said that, I still shop there from time to time. Why, because low prices are low prices. The management in the box stores business knows this and until their profits begin to fall, they will never change.
*
All this homer talk reminded me of a nother reason why I like homo depo.
I neede new countertops. I called an old business contact at greenfield plastics (I had bought there for years). I got a quote for $1200. I had told him that it was for my own personal house, and if there ever was to be a deal, give it to me now!
I decided to give hd a shot "just to see"! Well suprprise, surprise, they delivered it to me for 1000$. Guess what? Greenfield supplied it to the box!
So much for "contractor" discounts!
Blue
*Fred: Yes, HD's growth is meteoric. My amateur investor logic was that people who have done well in the last few years will start to plough their profits into their houses. They gotta spend the money somewhere. If you want to renovate your kitchen, HD is a good place to start, and those orders run into the tens of thousands. Profits look good even if the market goes flat -- actually if it goes flat, people with investments will move money into their houses faster. They and their contractors will buy even more. Since real estate prices have been pretty stable, it is more attractive to stay put & renovate. On the other hand, what effect with the virtual elimination of the capital gains tax on home sales have? There's always prep for sale!Good call, Smoot is our high end yard. For certain items they have been great, even unique. For other things their prices are looney. Don't buy an $8 tube of PL 400 there!What's an "Expo Design Center"? A homeowner trap?Fred/jstreet: Again, it's management. The Hechinger's near us is horrible, the one in Fairfax was actually nice (though it too had the magic Hechinger invisible salespeople -- even management couldn't find them). I've made a point of complimenting the improvements I've seen. My biggest annoyance with HD is that no one there can spell. "Tool Coral" (a new line of pink tools?) was the latest.
*Andrew, Your logic equals Depots logic. Expo Design Center offer high end products,design service and installed sales of kithchen, bath and interior projects.Thier goal is to have 200 of these open by 2005.Current stores are in larger metro areas, market, upscale remodeling. What's your other lumber yard??? ABC Hackinger's is a last resort.
*Um, yes, ABC. This is eerie. OK, what color car do I drive?I went to the Hechinger's in Fairfax for cellulose insulation & the free loaner cellulose blower. That store, and the one I swung by in Smoketown, were pretty decent. For some reason the home improvement places closer to DC do not carry cellulose, or used to and abandoned it (if you can find an employee who doesn't think cellulose is a brand name for fiberglass). An urban thing?The building supply -- Capitol in Vienna -- said they've seen a surge of interest in plaster/blueboard. People have enough cash not only to remodel, but to want to buy materials that say "hey I have more money than those drywall people." Capitol has been nice to deal with.
*
Not necessarily the same, Jim. Stores like Home Depot, Sam's Club, Builders Square, etc, frequently make deals with manufacturuers to make a line (such as the faucet you mentioned) that is considerably less expensive to make but LOOKS LIKE the expensive brand - doing things like using plastic coatings over plastic (which only look like brass) instead of real brass. Look at the UPC codes and maunfacturers product numbers carefully when comparing prices from different stores for similar products - they WILL be different if the products are differeny.
*
andrew d:
A red Volvo Station Wagon. Saw one at Alexandria HD the other day...
Frank
*Wouldn't be caught dead in a Volvo station wagon ... except when I have to borrow our neighbor's. And it's so old I don't think you could really say it has a color.
*Folks:Home Depot is a love/hate thing with me. I love having the huge selection, great pricing,liberal return policies, and convenient store location. However, I hate waiting in line for fifteen minutes trying to spend money (giving me plenty of time to wonder about the fifty three unopened checkstands...) , employee attitude can usually be rated in negative double digits (exception: cashiers are great...), the store is so crowded I can't find a place to park my cube van during the day (and FORGET going there on a Saturday!).Finally, I don't like having to compete with a forklift to load my material. Why can't they fill the shelves at night like a grocery store does? Sheesh.Hammer
*
Hammer, the local HD uses the night time to move things from where they were living to somewhere else. About the time I know where things are, there they aren't anymore. Some of the help knows, but they aren't too easy to track down either. I was in there one day last summer and no help tp be found. Turned out they were all at FORKLIFT SCHOOL!!
*
I do try to support my local retailers the best I can. But if HD is selling a KD stud that's clean and straight for $2.49 and my local retailer either, doesn't carry KD studs, or will charge me $5.80, HD wins. My local lumber yard is also limited in his space and variety. So, if I can make one trip to HD instead of going to several suppliers, HD wins again. If it is quality hardware I need, HD always looses and I'll go anywhere to get good hardware and fixtures. Also, the best times for shopping there are weekday mornings (6am to 9am) and weekday late evenings (7:30pm to closing). It's almost always near empty that early in the morning and the staff is seldom too busy to help.
*Both HDs near me are practically begging for FT employees. I asked a clerk about it, he said they'd opened ANOTHER one nearby and many emplyees transferred, other just left. He told me (under his breath) that some people get paid well, others....Not perhaps the best employment, but better than flipping burgers.
*My word! Who'd ever thought that Home Depot could stir up so many emotional posts!? I only go to HD when I know exactly what I want, I know they have it in stock, and I can go straight to check-out; forget asking an employee for help - personally, I can never find one! Like most of you, forget Saturdays! Our HD now stays open 24 hrs., and being a night owl, I love to go about midnight! I've been to Lowe's, in other states, and I like them better thanHD. I use a small (relative to HD), local paint store for paint, and a little hardware store close by my home, run by an ex-Hell's Angel (his dad died and left him the store), for emergency stuff - not enough nails, weird stuff they don't make anymore, etc. It's dusty and funky and I love it (not to mention the guy is very protective, since I'm a woman, and the store is in a bad neighborhood). Their sign, which been there forever, shows a woman in short-shorts, uh, riding a chain saw.Now, I like to think my moral compass is in good working order, but if we all knew what was going on behind the scenes in every retail and wholesale establishment, we'd start living in communes and growing our own tools, heh.AJ, as far as big corps going under, remember International Harvester? Now, that was a shock!Patty
*Sign alone would make it worth the drive.Dennis
*
I agree with Hammer. HD is also a love/hate relationship with me. I try to only shop at the small (non-Walmart), locally owned, knowledgeable supply stores. That would leave HD out of the picture. On the other hand the prices for basic items that any store might carry are very competitive. I don't want to see the big chain stores run out all of the small ones. I might as well pack-up and head for Russia where my choices are limited. I enjoy walking into the small stores where I can feel like an individual and get good service; not just another number. I realize sometimes I may pay a higher price at the local store, but I want them to always be around. I realize not everyone has my same opinions or ideals (just look at urban sprawl), so therefore I also invest in HD knowing alot of people absolutly love them. I guess I am a fence straddler.
*It's interesting that in a discussion group on the Fine Homebuilding website you would read so much discussion about Home Depot. I thought that Fine Homebuilding was a magazine for serious craftsmen or something. No offense to anyone but Home Depot's lumber department doesn't have much to offer. The Home Depot in my area glues pieces of scrape oak together to sell as wider boards. They do a good job of joining the pieces and planing them smooth but they make no mention of this to their less discriminating customers who don't notice what they are buying. It is false advertising, if you say a board is a 1"x12" and it is not a solid piece of wood, especially if you don't even discount it. I might go there for a power tool or a lawn mower if it were on sale because they can afford to sell items like that for less given their large inventory but as for woodworkers it is the pits. You can't even get a decent box of finishing nails there, Prudential is the brand they carry and 1 out of every 20 nails in a box of Prudential nails is a dud (no point, no head, deformed point or head). Not all of Home Depot's merchandise is crap, but alot of it is and when you are working hard on a piece of furniture or doing some home remodeling the last thing you want to do is to trek back to Home Depot and go through their return process, not to mention how nerve racking the place is with all the loudspeakers buzzers, bells and forklifts trying to run you over.
*
Dennis, so that's what would get you guys on the road! lol! I would
i love
for all of y'all to see that sign, but, alas, I have no website (yet) in order to upload it. The local N.O.W. group, with the help of the national group, tried to have it removed a number of years ago, but it was deemed historic (it's from the forties), so they had to leave it alone, thank goodness.
Here's something I do to make my HD shopping experience a little easier (and I found out that you don't have to be a business entity to do it!): I call and give them my list for "pick up;" by the time I get there, it's ready and waiting to go. Of course, this is good only for items with exact descriptions/brand names, or stuff you trust the employees to choose. Maybe everybody knows about this, but I didn't know just anybody could do it.
In my experience, "small" and "local" do not always mean good service and expertise. My favorite brains to pick have always been the professionals and experienced DIYs, not to mention the smart guys and gals right here - and I don't even have to make cookies! ; )
Patty
*Robert, get a grip!The whiner of the year award has already been given.Blue
*Small can be great, bad or indifferent.Good point on calling ahead fiyo. I thought that was only for lumber. Think I would prefer to send a fax...
*Took a field trip to Homer once. I left badly shaken. The harsh glare of the sodium lights, the dull gaze of the orange shirts, the beep, beep, beeping of the forklifts, the echoing of shrieking customers. I...must...control...fist...of...death...%^)
*I second the motion...All in favor say "Happy Easter!"J
*????????
*Just Rich's tribute to Nietzche.
*Okay, so what is fiyo?Personally glad to drop in. Just finished quarterlies for payroll taxes, dropped in on the news (mostly bad) and slid over here. Always learn and laugh.Dennis
*Andrew:The new HD in your area is at Springfield Mall. It is the first HD I've seen that has a parking deck instead of a parking lot! And you can walk to Borders book store for your capachino (sp) and Taunton Press books before buying your lumber and returning to your projects.Frank
*Well, at Seven Corners (Falls Church) you can walk to Starbucks and Barnes & Noble. Plus 2 pizza joints. There's an even newer one --Merrifield? Below is their "opening soon" list ... scary.Jeez, I dropped by the Alexandria HD for $2 worth of electrical parts -- it was a three ring circus. At Smoot's (the snooty lumberyard) i overheard a homeowner saying "this place is like Tiffany's." Uh-huh, I thought, as I bought some fiber-cement siding.We just want the rest of you to know how rough life is in Northern Virginia.***02-11-99 Decatur, Alabama The Decatur,Al Store 1225 Wimberly Dr Sw 02-11-99 Mcallen, Texas The Mcallen Store 409 N Jackson 02-11-99 Houston, Texas The Copperfield Store 6800 Highway 6 North 02-11-99 Janesville, Wisconsin The Janesville Store 3200 Deerfield Drive 02-18-99 St Louis, Missouri The Manchester Road Store 13929 Manchester Rd 02-18-99 West Chester, Ohio The Tylersville Store 7749 Dudley Dr 02-18-99 Knoxville, Tennessee The N Knoxville Store 2751 Shaad Road 02-25-99 Greeley, Colorado The Greeley Store 2815 35th Avenue 02-25-99 Matteson, Illinois The Matteson Store 20808 Cicero Ave 03-04-99 Delray Beach, Florida The E Delray Beach Store 1400 Waterford Place 03-04-99 Lake Worth, Florida The Lake Worth Ii Store 5750 Jog Rd 03-04-99 Conshohocken, Pennsylvania The Plymouth Township Store 200 Alan Wood Road 03-11-99 Wichita, Kansas The W Wichita Store 8444 W Mccormick Ave 03-11-99 Rensselaer, New York The N Greenbush Store 600 N Greenbush Rd 03-11-99 Irving, Texas The Irving Store 3200 W Irving Blvd 03-18-99 Hillsboro, Oregon The Hillsboro Store 1950 Se Minter Bridge Rd 03-25-99 Auburn, Massachusetts The Auburn,Ma Store 779 Washington Street 03-25-99 Lodi, New Jersey The Lodi Store 99 State Route 17 North 03-25-99 Delafield, Wisconsin The Delafield Store 3400 Kettle Court W 04-01-99 La Habra, California The La Habra Store 600 S Harbor Blvd 04-08-99 Folsom, California The Folsom Store 2675 E Bidwell St 04-08-99 Simi Valley, California The Simi Valley Store 575 Cochran St 04-08-99 Brandon, Florida The East Brandon Store 1542 E Brandon Blvd 04-08-99 High Point, North Carolina The High Point Store 2300 N Main 04-08-99 Victor, New York The Victor Store 7600 Commons Blvd Lot #9
*Dennis, re: what is fiyo?Fiyo is a woman who is a serious DIY (aren't we all!), who has had the mixed pleasures of working for a couple of contractors. Fiyo is also part of the name of an old Neville Brothers album called "Fiyo on the Bayou," where "fiyo" means "fire." It's a holdover from my (few!) days on aol, where it was important to have an asexual screen name, for obvious reasons. It also tells I'm from New Orleans, some of the time, anyway!Patty
*Ah, my kind of place.Dennis
*Hi Patty,My sister is rebuilding a 27 room house ( the last remaining structure from the Delechais plantation) down in New Orleans.What are your specialties, she and her hubby to be are allways looking for good people.BTW is the biker hardware store down there?Ron
*Here's an interesting HD twist.Picture a tub with traditional hot and cold faucets and diverter to shower head. Retrofit by a plumber with decent fixture by Central Brass. Cold side dripped after a while. As ususual it was Saturday afternnon and HD was the source of choice. Picked the appropriate replacement 'guts' from their after-market selection. $26, no seat. It lasted about a year and again the repair became inevitable on a weekend so back to HD. Out of stock. So, to local plumbing supply on Monday. Suprise, OEM part with seat $20 for hot and cold sides (yes that's two units)! Less than 50% for the real stuff. So the less expensive rule does not really apply.In case you're wondering, just replacing the washer was the first thought but the brass retainer screw sheared off and the brass around the washer was crumbling. 2nd time same + the seat was rough (except I'd substituted a SS screw, at least that's one thing HD does have).
*Ron, wow! A Delachaise Plantation structure - how cool! Are they going to actually live there, a la Ann Rice, or are they going to open a bed and breakfast or something? Oh, yeah, you had a question, didn't you? : ) My primary business is hand-dyeing, printing, and embellishing silk (and sometimes cotton and linen) fabrics; I have my own designs but sometimes do custom work. I also do some gilding, but not really big jobs (like entire rococo rooms!), because I'm just one person (I think). I have done some decorative painting (faux marbling, washes, etc.), but there are so many excellent decorative painters in New Orleans, and fewer fabric dyers (surface designers, actually), and gilders, that I no longer do any of that. If your sister is looking for decorative painters, tell her to go to the Helm Paint on Earhardt Boulevard, in Uptown; they have actual samples of all the best decorative painters' work right there. If she needs original fabric, or has a small gilding project, ask her to call me - I've e-mailed you details.Yep, the hardware store is on Claiborne, at the corner of Napoleon (if you don't count the Shell station that'si actuallyon the corner). And I'm gonna take my camera down there and get a photo of the lady and the chain saw, and e-mail it to anyone who doubts that such a thing exists, lol!Thanks for your interest - in my work, not the hardware store! ; )Patty
*Patty,They are going to live in 1/3 of it and rent out 2/3. My sister is also a clothing designer. I'll e-mail you her phone number.Thanks Ron
*
Patty,
Ex-Hell's Angels eh? Super. And signs like that are what makes a place a place, not just a location... It could be a stop on the tour at the Gabfest 2000, heck, invite him to join us...
Our local dusty, musty, crowded place is run by a serious redneck and his scarier son. Couple times I have been in there, it was the 'ol what-would-a-woman-know-about-anything act. These boys make the Taliban look liberal...
I agree about not knowing what goes on behind the scenes - TRY to buy kid's shoes that are NOT made in China...rrrrrrr!
Keep the fire bright,
Lisa
*
Lisa, lol! Actually my 'cycle dude is pretty nice. And wait til you have to buy those shoes for a teenager - the
i price
will be about the size of China!
I was looking at that sign the other day, and it's a pipe wrench she's sitting on, not a chain saw... maybe it was a chain saw some other time... maybe it was a chain saw when I didn't know what a pipe wrench was...
Patty
*
If you get this weird feeling when you go to Home Depot thats because you have been assimilated by the BORG.
*
1-877-work4hd
no kidding ... not tempted
*
WARNING! Mesh tape is NOT as strong as paper tape. For DIYers, mesh tape can be very convenient. My neighbor and I decided to give it a try for part of our basement projects. Not being in a rush for drying times, we followed a couple of different "expert's" recommendations and used all purpose joint compound for all the coats. Well, we had a problem with some of our butt joints cracking. After talking with a tech person at the mesh tape manufacturer (Goldblatt), he advised us that if we didn't use setting type compound for our first coat, there was probably a 50% chance our taper joints would crack, and a 75% chance that the butt joints would. Paper tape is stronger and can be used without setting type compound. We weren't thrilled with this news, especially since the product was being marketed to DIYers at HD, and there wasn't anything, including the HD salespeople, advising of the need to use setting type compound for the first coat. Now here's where I give high marks to Goldblatt. We couldn't believe how responsive they were. One of their VPs volunteered to pay us what it would cost to have our walls redone. When we requested that they change their labels to include a note about using a setting type compound for the first coat, they agreed. It was a very short time later that we noticed the change on the rolls sold in HD. Now that's a responsible company.
*
Geez, I'm impressed at your results. You ought to be a lawyer.
I've used some of the mesh tape I bought to seal the ductwork with mastic for a few joints -- it is about 20x stronger than the HD mesh. A good story ... I'm thinking of switching to setting compound for the first coat, if only to shorten the ordeal.
*
Sorry, I don't know how my above post ended up here. I meant it to be under the drywall post.
*
The only thing I can say about Home Depot is, I want my neighborhood Hardware Store back. You know the one that through up their hands in disgust because everyone wanted to save a penny or two. I am less and less impressed, although I still need them for some things and the new one is only a mile or two from alot of my work. I really try and use other sources for materials. I find Home Depot to be to general, but I do commercial work, so I can't expect much.
If you ask me, Grainger Rules for hardware store type stuff.
*No,Dilbert
*Not since Dilbert [Scott Adams] sold out. Hard to be counterculture when you're a money-grubbing weasel. (A disappointed former fan.)
*Andrew, just noticed your post saying that you thought Scott Adams, the Dilbert creator, had sold out. Why so? He's still doing what he wants to do. Is there something wrong with being a money grubbing weasel?Change of subject: I'm just curious - are you a trial lawyer?Patty
*Dilbert is now fundamentally hypocritical. It holds itself out as anti-establishment, subversive, lets-kill-all-the-middle-managers ... and now it IS the establishment in the comics/cartoon/antimated TV. I liked it when it was small and quietly passed around the Internet (and readers' e-mail produced many of his story lines, he was the first to put his address in every strip) -- now it's just another mass-produced vapid juggernaut. He even quit his engineering job, now he's just an illustrator. Same with "Garfield." Bloom County was flirting with this, but I guess Berke Breathed went astray. Gee, from his name he sounded so conventional...No, I'm not among the 5% of so of lawyers who are litigators. So far, I have been a federal appellate law clerk in Chicago, a rather narrow and specialized niche. Fascinating work, however, hence highly competitive to advance in. Having not done so easily, I have taken to building with a passion and will pick up the books in time. I love being outside so much! As contrasted with reading the same 8 pages of a Supreme Court opinion over and over to deduce what they really "mean." Having told you more than you wanted to know, I might as well add I'm thinking of volunteering to assist low-income spouses with divorce in D.C. Too often one spouse is represented and the other ... loses a second time.Why, who are you going to sue? (sigh)P.S. ON THE ACTUAL THREAD TOPIC, I asked an HD employee why the turnover was so high, did mgmt treat them right? He said yes, the problem was the customers -- some were the worst a**holes ever, and HD frowns on hitting them with forklifts.
*Andrew, are you saying someone actually reads that stuff?Amazed in MI,Blue
*Not just that, they get PAID to read it. You'd be surprised how tangled it can get, and how much influence the reader's understanding has on the outcome. Opinions are like partial answers to later questions. Trust me, it's fun. :)
*Andrew, I do indeed know of what you speak; my ex did pretty much the same thing for a while - he, too, found it fascinating, until the judge got busted. I think your idea on helping low-income spouses with divorce is excellent, and much needed! There used to be a statute, here in Looziana, that basically stated that the spouse with the greatest income had to help the spouse with little, or no, income pay for his or her divorce; that statute lasted about two years. Having no money for a retainer, I handled my own divorce (from the above-mentioned attorney); I ended up practically living in Tulane's law library the whole time! Everything worked out, and we each got pretty much what wei reallywanted, though he probably got the better end of the deal. I find that the best advice (aside from excellenti legaladvice), one can give a freshly divorced couple is:i move on!Having been married in the past to an attorney, I will probably NEVER sue anyone; I pretty much didn't believe in lawsuits before, and, now, I would probably do everything i butsue, if the "necessity" for a suit presented itself.Patty
*Oh yeah, a lawsuit is a miserable thing. But letting a jerk get away with murder gets to me too.
*Well,i murder...I thought we were talking about civil suits. ; )Nowadays, if you sue a doctor, for example, you go on a "list;" I hear this makes other doctors very leery of seeing you, even if the suit was justifiable. Scary.
*
Help I am turning into a Homer Depot.
Am I crazy? What draws me to this place?
I know its selection, I know its easy to get in and out,and i find things in there by accident that I could have used on past jobs when I had to drive all over town and run up my cell phone trying to find. The best has to be price. Take all these good things in consideration, Why am I embarressed of this? HELP ME.... Tell me there are more like me or tell me IM CRAZY.
*Yeah -- its that kind of place you do not have time to read all the magazines with neat solutions and you stumble on to things that would have worked or will work on future jobs. I like that part of it. One of their main selling points is the customer is always right and the return policy -- if I buy something and it is not needed they take it back with no questions asked and the exchange/credit time is ususally less than a minute.There are things I go to my lumber company for but HD is nice because you can wander and explore -- prices seem fair and they treat you like a customer.
*Box Suction,I use HD...For the enormous "in your face" selections...stainless fasteners, even finish nails. Like the pre-aclimated materials, trim with less shrink, etc.But I never get out of there in less than an hour!! and that always gets my goat. So I only go there in during "recreational" time...like the kids cruzin the mall...Our main contractor spotb delivers for free, negotiates quantity puchases, has all the lengths of lumber, and did I say they deliver for free?Home Depot's a "cheap date," and I treat them as such,J
*Follow-up question. Are the products you buy at HD exactly the same as the product sold at a specialty shop? For example, is a Delta faucet from HD the same exact faucet as the same model number at the local plumbing supplier? I have been told that they may be inferior products made specifically for HD to sell at a lower price.
*Jim -I've had dealings with HD and find they carry discontinued items and seconds. I've also heard that some materials are being made specifically for them, so quality may be an issue there.The larger picture is a social one, the end of the local supplier/hardware store, and I stopped shopping HD, and other box stores, for that reason as well.Best - Don
*Here's the trick invented by Cicuit City or American Appliance, etc....The Mega Big Box Chains;1-Buy mega quantities2-Save on shipping3-Save on inventory turn rates4-Save many other mega-managed ways...computers tied together, etc.5-As for lowest price....A neat trick done when possible is to have all model numbers be made store specific. So if you go to another store to match the price of say a Halo recessed lite, you'll find that HD is the only store that carries that model. They look similar but the springs might go on different etc. b tricky, tricky, tricky...J
*Jim R.,It would be my guess that a Delta faucet at HD and a Delta faucet at the bath boutique would be identical if they had the identical model number. But it might get tricky. Best Buy, for instance, used to sell Toshiba laptops with high end performance but dual scan displays. They used a model number that appeared to be the same as the standard, identical Toshiba model (the one with an active matrix screen), but the letters after the number were different. (Am I rambling, or is this clear?) Anyway, Best Buy could offer a seemingly great price for this computer because of the inferior display.I doubt that Delta would give HD an inferior product with the same (EXACT same) model number as at the bath boutique -- HD isn't that big, I don't believe, for Delta to risk their reputation in that manner.But, hey! This is all moot, because nobody should be buying the Delta ball faucet, anyway, unless antique collecting is their hobby. Ceramic disk cartridges be it!
*Like all people I too use the HD. Pricing is good but there help is really bad.(I don't know what rope caulking is) Stay away from the peak hours there. We have used the call ahead and it's ok. love their price on 3/4 stuff and they stock nice 5/4 stuff to. Hard to beat there tool prices. Have found out one thing......not all HD are the same. Just bought a 12 volt right angle drill at one and found the same one at a differant store(1 1/2 hr away) for 15 bucks less. Did the swap and bought the cheaper one......
*I guess I don't get it. Seemingly intelligent sounding people are complaining about crap at Home Depot. What's your point, and why waste site time. Not all stuff is all cheap at all places. It's why we do our homeworkwork. What is it that you want? Personally, if things were that easy, what bozo couldn't do your job. Creativity is what set us apart. You don't have to get everything at HD. And if you can't, I don't really give a shit. Give me info I can use.
*Hi Folks,I have two friends that work at HD.They say the big secret is a tiny markup on LOTS of stuff.They also say that in the past couple of years, raises have been much smaller and the time between them bigger, and employees are being pushed hard - many employees are feeling the squeeze, both my friends are looking elsewhere.It looks to me like somethings gotta give...Good health, Weogo
*Oh Excuuuuuuse me , Mr. Billy, I will think next time when I have something to say " I wonder if Mr. Billy would approve of this" Heres a hint DON'T READ ANYTHING UNDER A HEADING YOU DON'T WANT TO READ.
*Sorry Billy;Valid topic. I to don't feel right about giving all my business to the big box stores. The question has to do with ethics. How does the store treat it's employees? To buy American for the good of the country or not. Add to that the fact I am Canadian. I do buy some tools there, but I make a conscious decision to try to spread my purchases around. When it comes down to it a corporation has one reason for existance, more profits for the shareholders year after year. If it makes less profit it is viewed as a sinking ship. Home Depot's days are numbered as are McDonalds as long as there remains a defecit of ethics.