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What is your experience with above two types of floors for kitchen/family areas with much children traffic (feet not wiped, grit)? What do you recommend?
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Sconnor
You have asked the difference between night and day.
Putting down a hardwood floor in a kitchen is dependant on lifestyle. Amount of water spillage, humidity levels, traffic, abuse etc.
For the type of traffic you are describing you have two choices.
The first is ceramic tiles. It would be the best choice, bar none.
The second would be a vinyl tile floor. Something inexpensive, easy to replace.
Pergo belongs on countertops, period.
It can't be repaired when the joints fail and this will likely be the case with any abusive traffic.
*How about floating laminate not placed under the cabinets? When it wears out it is easy to replace, and the cost seems very reasonable.Dennis
*Morning Dennis,the only problem with this is that you are dependant on caulking preventing any water infiltration at the perimeter.As the surfaces move the caulking will fail, it's only a matter of time. The surface of Pergo doesn't make for a good bond with any caulking, even silicone.
*Gabe,Have you seen pergo or other laminate flooring joins fail? I'm curios about this as the correct installation has both the tounge & groove glued.
*Rob,Yes I have. In floating floor installations, the glue is normally installed on the top of the tongue, primarily. This is the area where it is most important to have a seal from moisture.If you have any downward flexing of the flooring at all, you have a potential for failure of the seam.Even the 1/2 cork floating floors that I import into Canada, should be layed on a solid surface.The main difference remains that the thinner floors are imposible to repair because of the inability to router the damaged material in place to install a new panel.
*Gabe,it sounds as if you are seeing the problem in floors that have a substrate that flexes. i glue both the top of the tounge & the bottom of the groove. The only question I have about this joint is related to the material being a composite & not solid wood.I am installing laminate flooring in an entry landing & on the stairs at my house that will beat the hell out of it. Ask me in a few months how it holds up. If we don't destroy it I doubt a normal household would.
*Rob,Are you thinking of putting Pergo on stair treads, say it isn't so?
*SConnor, as your request has been answered "tile," I'll conclude that my reply of 3/4" Maple with three coats of Oil-based Polyurethane is of no value. Also, you should consider the potential for using a cork flooring product. See: http://www.askthebuilder.com/cgi-bin/bulletin?044:00038 for a very good cork flooring overview.Or Search: http://www.abuildnet.com for some related sites.
*The Pergo joints should not fail as described IF the substrate is quite flat. It's hard to find the number in their literature, but Pergo wants no more than 1/8" in 10' -- i.e., no room for flexing at all. I used leveling compound to eliminate flexing -- tedious and probably more work than most installers go to. Pergo will chip if provoked hard enough. BTW, for some reason they forbid using silicone caulk. I doubt the latex with backer rod that I used will fail anytime soon, and like most we clean up spills as they happen.Tile would certainly be the durable choice, but it doesn't like flexing either. Whatever floor, sweeping regularly will extend its life (make the kids do it!). Frightening for an American to propose this (and this really does unnerve some guests, though we don't force anyone?), but we don't wear shoes in the house (except when Dad is ducking in and out and doesn't want to pry off his workboots), making a lot of things all much easier.
*Laminate, ugh! Gabe, as far as ceramic tile on a kitchen floor, I would have to sayb NO! NO! NO!I've had it, and my daughter has it now, and the primary concern is that it getsb very slippery when wet,therefore it can be dangerous! We've both had more kids take a fall on it than we care to remember. b Andit is a bitch to keep clean! It showsi everything!Now, I love ceramic tile - have it on almost every counter in my house, among other places, but on a kitchen floor? Not for me! I have lived, for the past 20 yrs., with the original heart pine floor that is in my very old house, and Ii loveit! Non-fatiguing to stand on, doesn't show the dirt (heh), and looks great. It was polyurethaned a number of years ago, and should be polyurethaned again, but, hey, I like it just like it is! If I had to replace it, and couldn't use real wood, I'd go with your second suggestion of good ol' vinyl tile! ...but then, with kids... um, can you still get battleship linoleum? ; )Patty
*Dear Patty,You bring up a good point regarding ceramic tiles being slippery.The newer tiles designed for residential housing are available in non-slip textures.However, someone coming in from minus 25 C. with snow and ice under their feet will fly, just as they would on just about any smooth surfaced flooring, difference is "Id rather land on wood, cork or vinyl tiles before landing on ceramic."
*Gabe, snow? Ice? Oops! I'm in New Orleans, but there's enough humidity here to slip on! ; ) My daughter has the textured ceramic, and it's still pretty slippery. I agree, I would much rather fall on something a little softer (forgot about cork - love it!), plus dishes don't break as easily!Patty
*Gabe,Yup, I am. It's one of htose things I want to try. I am making my own stair nosing as soon as I can get a table saw back from one of my subs. I guess I've done enough work for home owners with more ideas & money than any thing else & it's starting to rub off (the ideas any way).
*Morning Rob,You may want to make an allowance for non skid runners for your stairs. Coming down stairs in socks could be an experience.Besides there's nothing wrong with having fun in a house, that's what makes it a home.
*Treads sound fine -- clever idea if the look turns out OK. Definitely worry about traction -- safety and liability -- as you know stairs are a big source of injury. I wonder if you can apply a clear traction finish over the Pergo?
*Morning Andrew,I don't think that the normal antiskid finishes would last on something as hard and smooth as Pergo.It would probably require some type of experimentation to get something that would adhere and still last. On wood, we simply add silica sand to the urethane.I'd be terrified to try this in stairs. It would make for one hard surface to fall on.
*Gabe, interesting, I just read a tip (not here) that adding sand to the finish on the treads is a good way to prevent falls - is this not so, for real wood? I'm glad I read this post before I did it!Whatever happened to landings? I think those are one of the best ways to break a fall, but you rarely see them in new, mid-range construction anymore. Too expensive and space-hogging to build?For my deck steps, I nailed on those "self-stick" (ha) sandpaper-looking strips; they don't look great, but they have worked for years (with some replacement, of course).My three girls used to chase and drag each other up and down our stairs all the time, fighting over everything from boyfriends to borrowed clothes; it's a wonder they all survived! The funniest thing, though a little sad, was when our 60-lb. Lab lost her footing and slid all the way down the stairs, backwards! She was fine, but my husband had toi carryher up the stairs for a few days!
*What I didn't make clear is the nosing I am making will be painted to match trim in the kitchen it leads to. This color will be used on all the trim in the stairwell ( at least thats the last thing I was told). I plan to mix silica in the paint for the nosing.
*Way to go Rob, best of both worlds. The nosing will make a difference. If you've never done the silica sand trick before, test it out on a scrap first. I don't remember the exact mix that I even used last time. We added until the sample felt right. Not too scientific, huh!
*A little silica goes a long ways...you need to keep stirring or you will apply varying amounts as you go.Keep mixing, keep mixing,Jack
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What is your experience with above two types of floors for kitchen/family areas with much children traffic (feet not wiped, grit)? What do you recommend?