I was in a Lowes this weekend to pick up some mdf, they will rip the sheet for you and I was kind of in a hurry. So I see two Lws employees talking to HO’s. Iasked one of them to rip the sheet for me and how accurate was the saw. Then the other guy asked the helping me if it was ok to put 1/2″ Ply down for subfloor???? I immediately said no. Then he walked up to me and said he had 1/2 and it wasn’t a prob. I told him he shouldn’t be working at a home center giving out BAD info. These home centers should be held responsible for the info thier employees give out. Thats what I told the home owners after I set them straight on the proper way to do the job. I’m thinking about going back to talk to the manager tonight. This should be stopped!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Men do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they quit playing! Holmes Sr. Oliver Wendell
Replies
You so mad you can't see straight or type straight. Its that way with all the new guys in all businesses. There is no trade school or apprentice training required anymore. I know more than most plumbers, electricians, lathers, cable guys, sprinkler installers and handymen. But, I just keep my mouth shut and say nothing, (except here), cause it will make me upset too. I have no more old timers to get their wisdom from (except here). Just teach those who want to learn and past on your experience. We here are now the "Old Timers" who will teach others.
Yea I here what everyone's saying, Just had to vent. Stupidity is just running rampant in this country now. Think of the dangerous situations these people can create.Men do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they quit playing! Holmes Sr. Oliver Wendell
My brother just got a job at Lowes. He just moved to Richmond and needed something and they were hiring. I would never go to Lowes expecting a 20 year old boy could give me solid home advice. The salaries they pay dont lend themselves to getting good employees. Who is gonna stick around lowes for 9 dollars an hour, or for that matter, who wants to learn for 9 dollars an hour?
i bet all plumbers know more than you.
"i bet all plumbers know more than you"
I wish they did!!!! 30 years ago I did hang with plumbers I looked up to. I have to show plumbers how to lay out drains and vents to code, how to keep abs drains quiet, how to prevent water hammer, how to run a new water service under the driveay without jackhammering the slab, how to sweat copper and how to do lead and okum.
I dont consider myself a plumber. I consider 80% those guys who work for Adee, Jack Stephan, George Brazil, Roto Rooter and Mike Diamond to be crooks. When you charge little old ladies $1500 for a new toilet whos only problems was it ran all the time, I hope you are not one of them.
It's not just Lowes and it's not anything new. People have been giving out bad information since the beginning of time. I can remember when I was 15 working at a hardware store and the CASHIER told an old man how to stop a fuse from blowing by buying "a 20A instead of the 15A, or put something metal in there like a quarter or a soda bottle cap." I was young and didn't question any of it and neither did the old man. I just showed him where the fuses were.
Why do you think they work there. Duh
"My life is my practice"
they should hire trained monkeys, at least the customers wouldn't be able to understand the "advice". the people who can't make it in the real world due to incompetence end up working for corporations/government. it's darwin's worst nightmare, because they end up with health benefits. on the sorrowful occasion when i have no choice but to sprint thru one of those places to pick up a pack of gun nails or something at 8pm, the whole situation makes me wretch. you can't do it. we can't help. somebody has to start holding these people liable, because HO's believe commercials and trust the blinding authority of a smock. do you know any capable tradesmen who would acquiesce to wearing a friggin' smock? i can't write anymore, this gets me furious on the same level of cable quick fix design show smutfest.
I get the warm fuzzies when I hear these stories, and embrace them, as I know, as long as they are out there giving advice, I will have job security for years to come. Houses will be falling apart all over the place and I will be there to fix them.....get out your check book folks, this is gonna hurt a little. Keith
I was in HD about a month ago, and a woman asked the ceramic tile 'homer' why some of the flooring trowels had bigger teeth than others. He told her it was for better ventilation under the tile. Unbelievable!!!
'unbelievable'
yeah everybody knows the big teeth are so the water can run under the tiles when the grout fails.
Nope you're wrong about the water draining.
The ridges are there to provide sound attenuation. Everybody knows that hard tiles transmit sound better so the air spaces left between the ridges are to confuse and mute the sound waves.
I was always told,, you get better mileage from the thinset, whoops! I meant liquid nail. Jim J
gees- and all this time I thought it was for the insulation value.
Air flow... Keeps the tile cool or seat of the pants RFH....Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaimingWOW What a Ride!
Insulation value? I thought it was to get the tile off easier when the tile cracks because it was Thinsetted over the OSB subfloor.
I was in Menards the other day. Overheard a clerk trying to explain how to hookup a 4 prong range line. When I saw the 30A 220 brecker he had the guy buy. I couldn't stay quite. At least the range won't operate, so I don't have to worry about the guy burning down his house. Told the clerk he was'nt qualified to give this advice and suggested that the guy protect him self and his family and hire a licensed electrician.
Edited 3/16/2004 11:05 am ET by hammer-n
It just isn't the clerks. I was in the hardware store and overheard a guy asking the clerk for a "3 prong" receptacle for a dryer for his son's NEW home.
So I went an tried talking to the customer. Found out that this was a brand new home and have the appropriate 4-wire grounded receptacle, but that the dryer has a 3-wire cord set.
I walked him over to the cordsets and showed him the appropriate 4-wire cordset and how to hook it up to the dyrer. Even got out a paper bag and tried to draw some circuits.
Ended up just say use the 4-wire stuff is it "better".
But he walked out with the 3-wire receptacle.
At least you tryed. Some people are intimidated by people that know.
If the NEW house is inspected, the electrical inspector should catch it.
New outlet is cheaper than a new cordset.
There's actually people working in your big boxes? Thankfully in our local HD there is no one to ask anything of........not that I would ask anything but where in the store did they hide the ______ that I need. Lowes is a little bit better they at least have people to "help" here, but they never seem "to be from this department".
I do it for fun now.....walk up to someone in the plmbing aisle and ask them something about plumbing......."gee, I can check for you, I normally work in hardware". The craziest thing is when you then go over to hardware for kicks and ask them something...."Gee, I normally work in plumbing." How about this, you two numb nutts switch places so then at least you can give bad advice in your proper departments.
Ah.....whatever.....even as a DIY I don't ask them ####.
SJKnow a little about alot and alot about little.
Been there done that. I feel your pain.
In a local big box I suggested a HO use actual electrical conduit and fittings as opposed to plumbing ones. He left with the white stuff. He saved all of something like $5 on the price difference for a 100' underground installation. Electrical 90s are more expensive. Not sure how much he saved in time trying to pull wires into those plumbing 90s.
Talked to one HO, again in a big box, that was going to run the wiring on an addition in ENT mounted on the surface. He wanted to use ENT so he could use the rolls of wire he had on hand. What he described sounded like ancient RH rubber coated wire of unknown gauge. He was running it unprotected through the attic and into romex plastic boxeswith holes drilled for the ENT fittings. They were cheaper than ones with an actual KO. I suggested Romex and some drilling or runners but he couldn't see it.
Had a man, HO I assume, tell me when I mentioned that he might need some wirenuts that 'everyone knows that twisting and taping is better'. He has a couple of rolls of the cheapest available tape.
Used to try to give advice even at the risk of being rebuffed for unsolicited help. Sometimes it worked. Too often it didn't. Any more my attitude is 'Sure. Why not. I live far enough away that the fire trucks won't wake me'.
Speaker wiring and extension cords for wiring? Sure. I will bite my tongue. Use the gas lines for return current? Great way to save on that expensive wiring? I remain silent. Want to hang that ceiling fan on a 25 cent plastic box? The wobble is sure to be decorative. Dodging descending fans will help keep the party lively. What fun. Don't think I'll be going to that one. Nothing to this electrical stuff. Anyone can do it. All common sense and coat hanger wire.
A bitter attitude perhaps but for the most part I no longer bother giving advice without some assurance that they are willing and able to follow it. Best way to determine this is their willingness to ask politely, do some research or pay me. The HOs who think they can do the job and undercut professionals without some education deserve every bit of hardship they bring on themselves.
IMHO none of these people had, would have, benefited from 'expert opinion', mine or any big box 'pro'. The boxes are hiring at pennies over minimum wage. They ought to feel lucky their employees show up on time and sober. Actually knowing something would be gravy.
Anyone ignorant enough to try to do a job based on a total lack of research and based only on free advice at the home center is getting great value for the money. The money not spent.
Most don't even know enough about the terminology itself to make heads or tails of even the best information. Explaining what current is and how it can lead to heating and the roll of circuit breakers could take a long time. Especially if the person doesn't know anything about electricity or circuits. There are some good books out there that cover this. Giving a half hour lecture in a home center makes sense only if they are willing to pay me for it.
When houses start burning and people die in fires the codes might be enforced. The HOs might think about hiring professionals for electrical work. Old adage was that every article of the code had a person who died behind it. More metaphorically true than actual the general public seems to need to see flames and bodies before they will take it seriously enough to spend the time, effort or money to do it right.
Any more I just smile as they tell me they are going to 'be smart' using aluminum clothes line cable to save on the cost of actual wiring. It has plastic 'insulation'. Just about bit through my tongue on that one. The house is down wind and on the other side of town so the smoke won't irritate my sinuses and the firemen won't wake me.
as they tell me they are going to 'be smart' using aluminum clothes line cable to save on the cost of actual wiring. It has plastic 'insulation'......
I thought for a minute that you might be joking about that, but that's so scary you couldn't make it up......
Some ranges do only use 30 amps. Mine does. I also have a cooktop that uses 20. Was going to put in a new radiant one, but discovered they want 30 or more and I'd have to pull new cable. I'll live with the old one. Maybe the guy got lucky and had a range that only needed 30 amps.
Might have been, but my experience most range/ovens pull over 30amps so the next size is a 50 amp breaker. My friend just went thru the same issue last month. He needed a 50 amp line to add an electric range/oven. In some cases it might be overkill, but it's code in our area.
I thought the teeth would cut groves in the thinset so ants could travel under the tiles without getting stepped on.
"...why some of the flooring trowels had bigger teeth than others. He told her it was for better ventilation under the tile. "
You mean it's not ???Well behaved women rarely make history.
why waste your time !!
they dont care or know the diffrence !!
Yall are forgetting sone thing else even more importaint. There are a lot of "sucessful" guys out there working as painters, plumbers, handymen, etc. that give even more dangerous advise.
Mike. An admitted Handyman.
This is true mike, Look at the posting "carved out big holes for pipes" Poeple need to be held accountableMen do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they quit playing! Holmes Sr. Oliver Wendell
Toolin, take comfort in the fact that it is practically impossible to find anyone to give you advice in a big box store. Most homeowners and DIY'ers will just have to figure it out on their own, and will not get any bad advice; they won't get any advice at all.
Where do you get 32' 2x4s?
You don't, you idiot. You have to nail 4 footers together, end to end.
Geez, you could never get a job at Lowes.
: )
If I survive, I have survived.
But if I have enriched someone else's life, I have succeeded.
quittintime
I was on the highway today and saw a whole flatbed load of 2x4's only 4 feet long. At the time I wondered where they were taking the load and what it was to be used for. Now I know. To Lowe's. To create long runs nailed end to end.
"I was on the highway today and saw a whole flatbed load of 2x4's only 4 feet long. At the time I wondered where they were taking the load and what it was to be used for."
I almost hate to try to inject some usefull info into a bitch session, but...
Truss plants sometimes buy short lengths of lumber for web stock. Sometimes you can buy 4' lumber for 1/3 the price of 8' stock. Buying 6' stock is also frequently done. Every once in a while you can buy 3', 5', or 7' stuff too.
The shorter the stuff is, the cheaper it generally is. So cutting a 4' web out of 4' stock makes a lot more sense than trying to cut 2 pieces out of 8' stock.Vegetarian: Indian word for lousy hunter.
Sorry, I'm a little suspect of this:
I was in a Lowes this weekend to pick up some mdf, they will rip the sheet for you and I was kind of in a hurry.
The big boxes have their shortcomings, but certainly have their place; I guess one of the biggest assets is ripping sheets of mdf...and people complain about the latter? Whatever...
Few years back I did a job fixing someone elses booger. Needed a slew of 1 ft wide by 8ft lattice. Lowes became my hero when the went ahead and ripped about a dozen 4x8 sheets into the foot wide pieces.
It was a horrible thing to watch as I stood in the distance to protect myself from the zingers that were flying. Ol' boy doin' it got a cut in the cheek from a staple but kept on and finished it.
Next day I went to get some more and they had a sign up that said they would no longer cut lattice.
Our local Lowes as a sign up that they won't cut rips, only cross cuts because of the "danger".
rez, dang, I've ripped lattice and had the same thing happen to me; $hit flying all over the place--I tend not to wear eye protection, but you've reminded me why I should.
Funny thing was, once I had to start cutting my own lattice, I marvelled how fast & safe the whole process went after I started taking the circular and dropping it lightly into each stick of the lattice.
And the crap I'd put that poor guy thru just cause I was lazy. The shame. Oh the shame. :o)
Lowes and HD are better than grocery stores for starting conversation with women. You guys are looking at this the wrong way. Be helpful, not critical. Spot some lost looking woman at the big boxes and offer to help. It's a natural. Save her from bad advice and see where it leads. (Actually nowhere for me, but I have been thanked and it's a nice feeling.) And if I had any sense I would delete this, but my wife never reads FHB or this site.
Knowledgeable women of course cannot offer advice to men wandering around because they'll never admit to not knowing how or what to do.
"Bang bang Mrs.Maxwell's silver hammer came down, on his head..."
Doesn't work so good. A grocery store where I used to shop had a singles night every week. Idea was possibly to get advice on whiter-whites from some nice young single lady in the laundry aisle. Only people there on singles night were men. At the big box near me, don't see many unescorted ladies. Just scruffy guys like me.
Hey! Why doesn't everybody just stop shopping at Lowes/HD/big box? Then you wouldn't have to complain about the help. Nobody says you have to shop there . If you want to pay Lowes/HD prices then deal with incompetent help.
Heh heh
Johnny's a newbie.
john's right, and I was adamant about the same thing (the bad rap the big boxes seem to get) when I was a newbie. I have an account at a pretty custom lumber yard where the service is excellent in the yard, and is decent with my owner-builder questions. But geez, if I have to return something, it's like I'm on the Iraq council negotiating Sunni and Shi'ite issues. With the big boxes I just periodically collect stuff in the corner(s) that is unused and has been adding up and return it with out receipt for credit or whatever; it amazing how the $1.32 items add up after a while and I've got a $40 credit in my pocket.
And it doesn't seem to freak anyone out at the big boxes when I go in for what I think is one item and start stuffing my pants and coat pockets with small items only to start pulling them out of person when I get to the register.
<And it doesn't seem to freak anyone out at the big boxes when I go in for what I think is one item and start stuffing my pants and coat pockets with small items only to start pulling them out of person when I get to the register>
I didn't understand this. Could you rephrase it?
Well rez, like I will put a few electrical switch and/or outlet covers in my back pockets, dump some electrical boxes in my coat pockets, put some screws and other hardware in my front pockets, etc., because I don't have a cart or bucket. I just start pulling everything out of my pockets when I place all the other stuff I've dragged around the big box (maybe buckets of paint, some 16' foot pieces of trim) on the register counter.
Oh man! And you've never had a store detective follow you around after that? Ha ha! That's what I thought you said.
One time I had to buy an exact replacement screw so I bought it into a n Ace Hardware to make sure it would match up.
I get the screw and put the old one back into my pocket. Some guy down the aisle saw it and went and reported to a manager that I was stealing something or other.
Glad the manager knew how to handle things cause I was starting to slow boil.
rez, I know what you mean about matching screws and what not. When I'm in OSH I usually put everything on the register counter i.e. new and old screw so there is no misunderstanding--I mean sometimes I feel like I am "sneaking" or stealing my own screw or bolt I brought into OSH by slipping it back into my pocket. <g>
With HD it's a little different story; I'm usually just loaded up and I make it quite obvious that I am stuffing stuff in my pockets, plus it is often poking out of the latter. It's not something I do every visit, but I should watch it cuz I will see the argument or discussion go like, "Well, I'm using my pockets to carry this stuff...would you accuse me of stealing by having everything in one of your orange buckets? No, well, you can see the items I'm carrying in my pockets too..." C'est la vie.
Store detectives?? My brother is a townie cop in a small New England town (which shall remain nameless!!) and he goes to bust shoplifters at the local HD now and then. He was talking to the manager one day and the managers said they lose something like $10k a WEEK in theft-primarily air compressors!! My brother asked why people got away with it so much. Well, said the manager, no money in the budget to pay loss prevention guys, and no one really watches the security video because they are understaffed. They BUDGET IN the ten grand a week loss!! That to me is the primary difference between the big box and the mom and pop.
How can their be no money in the budget to pay security and still have enough money to eat a 10K a week loss? Something's not adding up. I know most retail stores have theft insurance, but they'd get their policy dropped in a second if they tried to claim 10K a week.
They can pay me 10K a week to stop the crooks. I'll hire six thugs at $1000/week each and pocket the other 4K......
I was just thinking about this same thing the other day.
How many times do you ask about their item # _ _ _ _ and they look into the computer and say "there's 14 in stock" but when it comes to actually finding them they draw a blank?
I think their horrendous inventory control with the addition of employees who feel they deserve more than their paycheck are the root of a lot of their "shrinkage".
I don't know how to steal an air compressor, do you? I bet the employees would find it very easy to throw a "defective" compressor out into the dumpster ready for pick-up after their shift is over.
Jon Blakemore
Well they could steal in from the dumpster if the manager was involved. He is the only one who has a key to the compactor that goes out to the dumpster and they're supposed to inspect all the outgoing trash. I sympathsize with your problems with them not being able to find a particular item that they are supposed to have in stock. I work as a manufacturers rep calling on The Big Orange and they never can find any of my stuff either. Quit wasting my time looking for it either.
You know, I worked in retail for a while and I can't figure out what the hell they were talking about either. Cost of doing business, I guess. I remember about 10 years ago you couldn't walk out of the tool corral at HD with anything-you had to pay fot it at the tool corral register or the alarms would go off. Now the registers are all gone. No one watches it anymore. I'm sure you wouldn't have to get very creative to re-stock your toolbox for free.
That's what I was thinking.
There is no way that they are budgeting ten k a week to cover theft, and yet cannot budget for security.
If they hired their own people, 24/7, it would still not cost them half that. If they hired a rent-a-cop, it would cost even less.
The bean-counters that run that corporation are not that stupid. Bean counters at the locals who were that stupid would not last long.
If I survive, I have survived.
But if I have enriched someone else's life, I have succeeded.
quittintime
Yesterday..I go to lowes for a PVC 1" to 3/4" threaded reducing bushing..just one. I root through the box that is marked for that part..find ONE. No problem. No item tag on it, so I write it on my hand (direct from the box). When I also spied a craftsman style hanging lamp on the clearance table..was 98 bucks, marked down to 49.00, then 39.00. It got my attention...so I grabbed it, and headed to checkout..one aisle open @ 10 am. The cashier girl says she has to look up the item no..I said here it is on my hand...78 cents. No, I need the computer number..what is it called? I told her..no can find. I gaze into her DOS screen and and tell her to punch in REDUCE/BUSHING/PVC and all of the other combinations..no dice. So she says she has to call someone in plumbing..no answer. She rings up the lamp..and the phone rings..it is plumbing dept. she tries again to describe it..I finally say screw it..I can go to True Value and be done in my lifetime..
As I am going out a smiling customer service woman asked me if I found everything I wanted..said, yes..but could not pay for it for a lack of price being on it, and noone could find the damn part no. to ring me out..I am a little pizzed..she sees the lamp and says come here..scans it and gives me 10.00 cash back!
I head to truvalue..no bushing..ooops. Tractor supply..no bushing..double ooops..finally this am back in the city I hit an industrial supply house..no threaded bushing 'cept in galv..hmm I got copper to brass supply coming in..is galv ok? I think..screw it put it in...1.93 cents.
moral of my story..steal the damn bushing at lowes if no tag on it.
BTW..the DW loved the hanging lamp, and the dog stepped on it in the van and broke one pane of bubbly glass..not a good day.View Image
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
I dunno Bud the Home Dildo and Blowes near my home have a return policy where no recipt money credito or no ticky no washy. They wont even except returns on some things after 30 days or so. More good Home Dildo news
http://www.dailynews.com/Stories/0,1413,200%257E20946%257E2022329,00.html?search=filter
Darkworksite4:
Gancho agarrador izquierdo americano pasado que la bandera antes de usted sale
Edited 3/19/2004 8:14 pm ET by RonT
Just an aside, not that I like the other silling little names people have come up with but I am very glad to see that people have gotten away from using H*m* depot. Not to be overly PC, but that one always bothered me.
Maybe the system manger edits this out, but I am glad to see it not used.
Newbies are always such idealist.
Sad thing is that everyone posting on this here, and doing so from personal experience, will most likely return as a customer, in spite of all the b1tching, about these joints. I was guilty of the same, 'till Lowes gave me a $500 reason to not.
Ordered new kitchen cabinets from Lowe's. Gave 'em sizes and model numbers, colors .... Delivered direct from the mfgr, sat in the garage for a few months while the wiring, plumbing, plastering and flooring was being done. Lo and behold, the two blind end cabinets were ordered, by Lowe's, reversed. Claimed I had exceeded some unstated 30-day period for return of such. Refused to accept responsibility or do anything. Sorry, nothing we can do. No refund, no replacement. No offer of any compensation, for their error.
I will never, with the occasional exception for vandalism, ever set foot in a Lowe's ever again.
I would recommend all of you to follow suit, if reasonably possible. Go to HD or Menards or best of all, a real hardware store/lumber yard.
Had a special order come in yesterday, Oak Med cabinet. took 45min for it to be brought up,"is my time worth nothing" the store was dead. Saw the box was damaged and opened it and the mirror was broken. I talked to the store manager he reordered and he gave me 50% off. I wasn't really bitching about the big boxes but they really need to train the employees to know when to offer advise and when not too. It's not that hard to say, "I'm sorry, I don't really know let me find someone who does" Or better yet it may be a good idea if there were books in the departments on the local code reference book written in layman terms. Men do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they quit playing! Holmes Sr. Oliver Wendell
Edited 3/19/2004 11:51 am ET by Toolin63
>I'm thinking about going back to talk to the manager tonight. This should be stopped!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'll argue the contrary opinion and throw my own lowes b*tch in.
The one I shop frequently (I pay 5-10% more than a yard, and it's worth the convenience to me) has pretty competent people. I like the clerks at the commercial desk. It's no different than wal-mart in that I have to know where stuff is to be efficient in getting supplies, or else it's frustrating as heck. Most of the guys there don't have deep knowledge of products - I have to size my own wire, etc., but their general knowledge is ok.
And a couple of them are deeply competent. One is a retired cabinetmaker and is worth a lot to me. So think of it this way - we all need a retirement job when we get too old and broke-d*ck to work in the trades. And there's not enough cushy building inspector jobs to go around for us all (barb to Tim). So we NEED lowe's in our older age.
My b*tch with lowe's is I spent $40k with them last year. I had more to give them, but the suburban housewife buying a 2x2 cut piece of plywood gets better service than I do (she's cute), and we pay the same price for everything. I confronted their store manager a bunch of times on this because it irritates me. Their best offer is a lowe's credit card with 6 mos same as cash or something. My card gives 1% cash back off the top. So they have nothing to keep me if HD would give me a 1 or 2% discount on a loyalty card.
remodeler
Wow! You spend $40 grand a year there and they won't help you out?I think you need to talk to someone higher up in their pecking order.
One time I had to buy maybe $500 worth of Melemine board at one time. I despise paying more than necessary at any time so I ask about a discount on a bulk purchase. One phone call and 'Sure, we'll go 10%'.
Every couple weeks I'd go in and get a couple hundred bucks more Melemine. Always gave me the 10%. Someone in the front office must have seen a receipt cause I get a phonecall inquiring how I liked their service and 'if we can be of any kind of help....'.
I have no trouble with the big boxes if you learn their turf.
RonT always likes to buy his tools at the big boxes. Said he always gets such great service.
Most any employee can auth 10% off on a sale. I usually pick out the most shopworn/faded box on the shelf, get 10% no problem. I'm not gonna keep the boxes, I use what's inside.
Got 25% on a sheet of 3/4 hw veneer plywood a few weeks ago, cause one corner was wacked up for about 3" -- I only needed a pc 36x60, so rest was going to the scrap rack.
Edited 3/19/2004 10:01 am ET by ProBozo