Okay, I’m relatively new to the building trade as a career, but I’ve been building for a while. I’ve gotta get a reading from y’all on an experience I had today. To preface all this, I’m from the Maryland suburbs of DC, though I currently live on Long Island, but I’m doing a deck for my mother down here in Maryland. Maybe geography has alot to do with this.
I went to the lumberyard today to order about $300 worth of lumber. I’ve already spent about $500 there earlier this week. This is one of the smaller yards in the area, not a chain or anything–a family business. The guy at the counter was pretty condescending to me. I’m not sure if it was because I’m not a regular customer, because of the size of my order, or because he thought I was a DIYer. Earlier in the week, another guy at the counter acted about the same. By the way, not to be cocky, but I build better than most of the clowns who are putting up houses out here, which isn’t saying much.
I know that $1000 is small potatos when they’re taking huge orders over the phone from building outfits, but it’s business, and I pay cash. I’d just as soon take my business someplace else, but it’s pretty much the same everywhere here, if not worse. Also, the stock guy in the yard busted my nuts about picking through the stock to get boards I liked, as if I should just let him throw the first ten boards on the pile into my truck, even if they’re crap.
What gives? Maybe this is why so many people go to Home Depravity. Even though the lumber there is garbage, and the staff don’t know the first thing about what they’re selling, at least they don’t look down on you for not being “builder of the century”. I still won’t shop there if I can avoid it.
There’s a real building boom here now, so I guess the lumber yards feel okay dismissing a small timer like me. Maybe when times get a little tighter they won’t be so eager to treat a cash customer like he’s wasting their time.
Is it like this everywhere?? It’s the same deal on Long Island, if not worse, but that’s New York, you expect it. The guys at the tool shop I go to act like you’re retarded if you can’t draw a schematic of a universal motor with your feet while blindfolded.
Maybe this forum should have a “rants” folder. I’m pissed off.
Replies
I know what you mean. As much as I hate the HD's and Lowes - every time I go into a commercial supply house of some sort I get much the same attitude it seems.
Maybe it's cause I like to know how much stuff costs - handy to know so that you can do correct bids and estimates.
Honestly - I've stopped trying to find service at just about any place these days. I called my local plywood supplier and inquired about maple melamine and matching edgebanding for a laundry room job - and then picked up 4-5 sheets of it but forgot the edging - then I called back and whoops - they don't actually have it in stock, and sorry, we are busy - have to call you back in a few hours.
Don't know why anybody goes to SW paint either - lines are longer and prices higher than Lowes or HD anyways, and the Valspar paint at Lowes is superior to any other paint I've ever used.
Problem with HD and Lowes is that they homogonize the mix of products and limit the variety and quality of what's available.
But, it's not like you can go stare at the local Plumbing supplier house's rack of fittings to try and figure out how to do what you need to do.
JT
But, it's not like you can go stare at the local Plumbing supplier house's rack of fittings to try and figure out how to do what you need to do.
I can, and I do. It all depends on your supplier. If you are in a store catering to pros and they don't know you, odds are you won't be given the same respect that the locals get. Even if you can "speak the language". Sometimes there's nothing you can do, and maybe it's not that way everywhere.
Thats close to the same way I feel at the local places here. Some guys always rave about the great service they receive at their local yards. I just havent seen it here. There are a couple of places like my drywall supplier, where I spend much less money than the lumber yards ,that do treat me well. We all know we are not going to get great service at the big box stores, so if I go to my local yard and pay a little more than Home Depot prices I expect to get a little service for that extra expense. I dont need the red carpet treatment I just want someone to act like Im not interrupting their coffee break just because I want to spend a little money there.
Big, it must just be a regional thing, man.
I have accounts with two local yards here, each with 3-4 stores within a 50-mi. radius, of which I only go to one (each).
At the first, the tone has gone from condescending to just OK. I've bought from them maybe 5 times, and only because they were closer (prices are same as #2).
At the second, I've been in at least once a week for over two years, dealt with the same sales lady (who knows me by voice!), spent anywhere from $20-20,000 a pop. I gave her (and another salesman who often serves me when my woman is off) each a gift certificate to a good BBQ place close by recently. I also give them the benefit of the doubt whenever there's a question with my order.
Now, I've gotten great to excellent service at #2, and I'll continue to go 20 miles out of my way (did so today, as a fact!), just because everyone knows me by first name, asks how my day is. They seem like they're genuinely concerned with my business. Not to mention my outsde salesman (for the builder I'm framing for) comes from them. Also an excellent guy, very thoughtful on takeoffs.
I've been to local stores outside my home area before...best I can give ya is just let them know you're from somewhere else, that you know what you're talking about, and that you'd like to deal with only them for the duration of your trip. Be courteous, but not too friendly, just give them the impression you like dealing with smaller guys who know what customer service is. Then let the chips fall where they may.Jason Pharez Construction
Framing Contractor
Jason,
The big box lumber is second rate. Don't go to the lumber yard - Plan your orders so that they deliver for free and take the lumber that they send you. Allow 5-10% for waste. Your time is way too valuable to drive to the yard.
rich
PS I did have this trouble with the yard I deal with. Finally called them and pointed out that during the prior 12 months I had ordered $25,000 worth of lumber. After that it was "Hello, Mr Thurlow"...
:-)
Rich
Bigwagon,
I think you have a legitimate gripe too. There's a few places that I no longer do business with simply because their attitude sucks.
I used to use Marathon Tools in Medway MA for my tool/nail purchases. But everytime I'd go in there I'd get the once over or they'd look at me like I was jerk for asking about some item that they decided wasn't worth stocking. So I gave up on them. Last year I spent around $20,000 on nails and tools at my new supplier. They're great. I have a salesman on my Nextel two-way, they deliver, remember my name, and actually give a sh2t about my opinion on tools.
A similar story, with a different ending. About a year and a half ago, my wife and I moved to a new town. Sooner or later I ended up making trips for oddball stuff at the small local lumberyard. Same crap. I'd go in there and the guy behind the counter would be chit-chatting it up with someone and just blatantly ignore me standing there, cash in hand, while he finished up his small talk. Not 1 or 2 minutes either.... more like 5 minutes without even acknowledging that I was standing there. Happened more than once too. Either that or I'd go out into the yard and if I had to ask where something was in that mess, the yard help would put on a face like I completely ruined their day with my foolish request for assistance.
I went in there with the plans for my second floor addition one day. To be entirely honest, I had very little intentions on letting them supply the whole job but was curious to see where their price would come in. Same crap happened. I stood there at the counter for about 3 minutes while he BS'ed with another employee. Finally I just turned around a started for the door. He called out, 'hey what do you need'. I said, "I need about 40 grand worth of lumber for this addition", as I held up the plans, "but I sure as he11 ain't buying it here". And I continued out the door.
They've been sweet as pie to me since then. ;)
But you're right. There's something about the trades in general that seem to bring out that kind of attitude in some guys. It's such BS. I'm not going to kiss someone's azz to get them to take my money.
Dieselpig,
What is the name of the great new supplier that you use? I am in Needham and I wonder if they are nearby. Thanks
Alec
hey ... I get to use two of my favorite lines I learned from Dad when growing up ... thanks!
but before that ... I get great service from one place ... and good service from most others. But pittsburgh is known as a friendly kinda place ... and ... most carps here will cut straight to the point if that friendly service is lacking ... so most places are held on a pretty tight leash.
Sometimes sarcasm is the right tool!
back to Dad ... first fav line ... when getting a price quote on a lumber package ...
he'd listen to the inflated price ... then say ... "Oh no ... I want the regular framing lumber ... Not the f'n gold plated stuff!"
then ... when picking thru what they considered to be a good load ...
as he threw half it back on the floor ...
"I'll just leave this stuff here till next week ... we'll be building all the rocking horses then..."
they all hated him ... but they all respected him! and he always got the best lumber at the lowest prices. Sometimes it pays to be known as a sarcastic pain in the a$$ ...
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
those sayings are classic (may adopt as my own). My fathers saying to me growing up "Son, if your gonna be dumb, you better be tough"
My old man used to say "Don't be a slob just 'cause you know how."
Big - Can't help you in Maryland, but long islands' a different matter.
Don't know exactly where you are on LI, your profiles' not filled in.
Try Thurber lumber in Rocky Point. Fair prices, great service, nice people, and good material. They've survived the depot and lowes for a reason.
For tools and repairs, Ace tools in Wantagh. You'll get treated well if your buying a $3 fitting or a $1000 tile saw.
Been using both places for about 20 years. Both make my job a little easier...Buic
Last fall I did some renovation on a porch. I went to one of the more local family busineses for the lumber. Not a large order. I was treated really well. In fact the kid in the yard went out of his way to find straight PT for me. At one point he called back to the office to say they didn't have anything worth a crap in one particular length and was it ok to give me the next longer (granted itwas only one piece...).Another yard that is closer treats me just as well. Maybe it's a community thing. I can find a larger selection if some products at the L or HD but for most lumber a few cents more will get me a better product and service closer to home.
I'll second the recomendation of Ace Tools...
Buic,I live in Mastic Beach. I've gone to 84 in Patchogue and had good experiences. Other than that, I haven't tried other lumber yards on LI. I've had a few clients who asked that I buy things at HD with their account, which I won't do anymore. Too much wasted time picking through crap lumber. The tool store I was referring to was Dynamite in Bohemia. They have everything under the sun. There's one guy there I love named Al, who will talk to you for hours about any tool, even if you've never used one before. The other guys can be a pain.I've actually been to Ace in Wantagh, as my father in law lives in Massapequa, but I was just browsing. Theres also a nice joint on Montauk highway in Shirley called universal tool. Not a great selection, but good in a pinch, all top quality stuff, and the staff is nice.See ya at the beach,
Dave
Big - I agree about Dynamite tools. Great inventory, good parts and repair.
If you need some lumber, give Thurber a try. I get deliveries that look like I picked it from the racks myself.... Buic
Buic,Will definitely try Thurber. The next job I'm starting when I get back to LI is in Stonybrook, so its on my way, more or less. Just finished a job a few weeks ago in Rocky Point.In case you know anyone whose looking, my MIL is selling her 4 bedroom 1.5 bath house in Old Medford--Patchogue/Med school district. Fully renovated two years ago. New kitchen, overhauled baths, new doors and windows, new siding, etc...I think she's asking in the $400sAlso, friend in Rocky Point whose place I worked on is selling. 2 bed 1 bath coop. New bath. Just painted. Refaced cabs and new counters. High $100s.If I can get these two places sold, my wife will have to do the dishes for the rest of our lives!!Thanks,
Dave
Usually I have found the attitude displayed by the salesman at a business is directly related to the treatment they receive from management up above.
"Thurber lumber in Rocky Point"
Talk about Deja Vu!! I lived in Rocky Point from '76 - '79 and shopped at Thurber. I helped a neighbor build a deck with lumber from them. Neither of us knew much about deck building but my pickup came in handy - lol.
Sometimes it really seems the world gets smaller with each passing minute!... or is that just another sign of aging ;-) Buic
Nobody appreciates rude treatment or condescending attitudes. I was raised in the DC area - northern VA actually. On the odd occasion that I go back there it seems really apparent that DC and the surrounding suburbs are now truly part of the NE US megalopolis. When I go to big cities, I expect indifferent and some rude treatment... I've found this to be true in most any large city, but particularly in this NE megalopolis. Sux and that is just part of the reason I'm not there.
OTOH, not sure what your thought is about being a "cash customer". If anything, as far as I know, being a cash customer at a lumber yard earns one higher prices and less preferential treatment.
I'm not going to get on a tangent about home centers, but I have received what I considered strange treatment when trying to arrange some large ticket orders at HD and blowes. My deduction is that the target market for home centers is not people who build for a living. Likewise, around here anyway, lumber yards don't target DIYs as their customer base. You are, essentially building this deck for your mom on a DIY basis - right?
BTW - I get excellent service from the lumber yards I deal with. I think it's due to the longstanding business that my company has given these places, the volume of material that we order, and the fact that in in business environments, I'm always polite, even when I get POed.
Big:
A couple points, for what they're worth. Sometimes the attitude that we get from sales staff is only a reflection of the attitude that they receive from us, the customers. I've worked both sides of the counter and I can tell you that when all day long, all you catch is a lack of respect, it's hard not to have a bad attitude. Now, I am not saying that it's right, just that it happens. Stand at the counter at your local yard sometime and watch how the bulk of people treat the staff, sometimes it's realy not pretty. I try really hard to remember how it felt when I was on the other side of the counter whenever I encounter a less than happy counter guy (or gal) or yard person and go out of my way to be pleasant and respectful (like when I have to sort through 50 2x's to find 10 staight ones, I put the other 40 back in a stack instead of leaving them in a heap where I sorted them). Probably what's most frustrating to me is when I catch attitude from people at a yard that knows me so I just figure that the last guy that they dealt with was a jerk and I take it as kind of a challenge to have them smiling by the time I leave. I tend to have quite a temper so I find that if I get pissed at something, I carry it with me for the rest of the day and all it does is give me heartburn, so I sort-of developed my leave-em happy strategy as a self defense mechanism. Doesn't always work with the people, but I take less Nexium, so what the heck.
BILL
Good post. I do the same at local lumberyards. Am always cordial, friendly and like to strike up conversations if the moment presents itself. It's great what you get in return.
As for the previous post, I have lived in the NE all my life and have found that there is good and not so good wherever you are. I have recieved cold shoulders in the south (maybe they hear my Yankee accent)and have been treated like a king there too. It's all subjective and mostly on the attitude and energy you the customer bring into the store.
jer & nailbanger... i'm with you..
it's a game to get 'em smiling.. even the jerks are people..
if it really bothers me, or it's beyond someone having a bad day.. i'd go see the sales manager.. he wants to know this stuff
and.. it's not just my favorite yard..
i try the same techniques at every place i deal with..
my wife is a travel agent and she deals with the public every day.. she has honed her gaming skills to where she can turn most curmudgeons into willing slaves ( almost )
if a sales counter continues to deliver indifferent and unfriendly service.. they will soon find themselves without customers
i live in the most densely populated state in the union.. might say it's the heart of the NorthEast Megalopolis.... believe me.. the only way the independents survive the competition from the big boxes is thru service.. so if someone is not getting good service.. the store wants to know about it
as for waiting while they BS with someone else ? look at it this way.. if they are BS'g with someone, it means they have a relationship with that person.. thye are maintaining that relationship... they will get to me when they are done stroking the person in front of me
if i demonstrate, thru body language, that i want them to hurry up.. then i'm disrespecting them..
what i really want is to get them to stroke me , just like they did the previous person, the ball is in my court
is this kizzing azz ?.. i don't think so.. i think it's probably a chapter in
"How to win friends and influence people " maybe blue can quote the chapter & verse ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Well said, Mike.
BILL
<as for waiting while they BS with someone else >I think disel was refering to counter guy BS'ing with a fellow employeenot a customer.
To quote my #1 hero of fiction ..."Years ago my mother used to say to me, she'd say, "In this world, Elwood, you must be" - she always called me Elwood - "In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant." Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. And you may quote me." Elwood P Dowd from "Harvey"
>>i live in the most densely populated state in the union..
2nd most - behind new jersey
when did they change that olde statistic ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
05' census
RI, 1,046 persons per sq. mile
NJ, 1,180
damn !Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike,
that NJ number probably includes the bodies the NY'ers buried in NJ.
bobl Volo, non valeo
Baloney detecter
We gotta use something ( or is it someone) to fill all the toxic dumps
Wow! I think it's the wealthiest too isn't it?
>>Wow! I think it's the wealthiest too isn't it?
that would be Connecticut, NJ comes in 2nd every year
Great thread guys. Like alot of you, I've had really bad service, and really great service too. Some guys treat you with such indifference that it makes you wonder if they care about their jobs at all. On the other hand, I've placed relatively small orders of drywall and the delivery guys went so far as to help me walk it around the house and into the customers basement and were polite as can be.
When I was a kid, my dad always used to bring coffee and donuts to the mechanics in the garage when he brought his car in--he thought of it as insurance against getting hosed. But I still wonder why I should have to bribe a sales or serviceman into giving me my money's worth. Justin Fink - FHB Editorial
Hmmm. I think because of the size, RI is still the most densly populated. Maybe not though. Lottttssa poysons live in Joisey.
I get the same attitude as you from my local yard. I have a HD 3 miles away, the local yard is 5, and a bigger yard has 2 locations - each 20 miles from my shop.
The HD crew is extremely friendly and tries and goes out of their way to be helpful - even within their limited knowledge base. I still won't by lumber from HD due to the poor quality but they're a convenient hardware store when I need them.
The local family-owned yard is a lesson in futility. I can walk in and the 5-6 guys on duty might give me a glance but more often than not they'll continue on their personal BS until I interrupt them and ask for help. Want to place an order by phone? Good luck, odds are what ends up getting delivered is wrong. I've done a few special orders thru them and not one has come thru by the promised due date. These guys were the only the game in town until HD opened a couple of years ago - Darwin's business division will take care of these knuckleheads before too long.
The bigger yard, also family owned, is a model business. Free delivery on anything I need - materials, tools, even a 1lb box of nails if needed. Their pricing consistently beats HD and the other local yard. If I have a return they'll pick it up next time their truck is in the area - free. If I just want to look at something they'll send it to the yard closest to me with no obligation to buy & no restocking fee. They have a great tool selection, with my discount the pricing consitently beats anything I can find on-line. The staff is well trained and they run several 'contractor days' every month with free training, special deals, etc...I couldn't ask for anything more - they get 99% of my business & I'm happy to spend my $$ there.
-Norm
Hey Norm,
You mind disclosing your yard of preference?
Thanks.Technique is proof of your seriousness. - Wallace Stevens
Rk Miles out of Manchester, VT. Last year they bought Taconic Lumber in Williamstown, MA and have plans to move them onto Rt 7 in a big new lot.
-Norm
When you guys talk about the lumber from Home depot being of poor quality, are you refering to the obvious bows, twists etc. or is there more to it that i should know about? The reason I ask is that the last time I bought lumber at home depot, I'll swear I inspected it well and it was stamped KD and all that, but a week or so after sitting around (inside and dry) it started to look all twisted.
Joe
Bows, twists, splits, knots are all a problem. Nothing worse than wasting time culling thru an entire rack of 2x's trying to find a half dozen that are at least semi-straight.
-Norm
In my career, (And after), I dealt with a LOT of different lumberyards.I have never gone to the counter or gone up to an employee in any store with anything but a genuine smile, and cheery attitude.In my experience, among the smaller yards... Unless and untill they know you, 95 percent of the time you get treated with anything from indifference to downright crappy attitude.I do think that the two biggest reasons for that are the way the majority of the customers they have to deal with, treat them... and how they are treated by their bosses.They are people. Not just robots behind the counter.I have never -not- been able to put myself in that other person's shoes, and then shown them a bit of nice treatment in their day. Regardless of how I was treated. Do that every time, and they start to remember that you are the one who makes them feel good. And it doesn't even have to occur to them conciously. It just happens.I HAVE discovered a secret tool. One whose opportunity doesn't happen all that often, but when it does, it drastically cuts down the time it then takes you to have a friend behind the counter, instead of just another surly employee back there. Become the clerk's advocate when you see them dealing with a surly customer.Someone else besides me here in this thread mentioned the way the employees are being treated by the customer. The first thing I wanted to ask was "well what did you do about it" ?If I see a roundabout starting up in the line ahead of me, I first pay attention to what is going on. I want to know what it is about instead of just bargeing in. Then I try to defuse it with a simple question or suggestion.These are human beings. Having a difference. If I am near by, it has an effect on me. So yes, it damn well is my business. And it is yours too, if you are there. It is a cop out to ignore it and say it is none of your business.When all is said and done, I have tried to give them both a smile, and a good feeling. And I have tried to settle their difference amicably with a cool word, and unbiased opinion.Next time I am in there, the clerk remembers me.
The destination is not the point. The completion is not the point. Enjoy today. If you can't enjoy today, then what is the point ?
Luka:
"Someone else besides me here in this thread mentioned the way the employees are being treated by the customer. The first thing I wanted to ask was "well what did you do about it" ?"
Let's just say that it wouldn't be the first time that I was asked if I worked for the yard. I don't know if it's that I can't stand watching someone who is having trouble getting questions answered or if I'm devious enough to think that I'll get something out of it but I always try to diffuse the situation. If it helps me out, so be it.
The bottom line is that I always try to treat everyone with the same respect that I want to receive, no matter where they are.
BILL
Yup.
The destination is not the point. The completion is not the point. Enjoy today. If you can't enjoy today, then what is the point ?
Great post! I operate much the same way, and it does make a difference. With all the opportunities to be disappointed by poor (or even rude) service these days, there is another thing that I go way out of my way to do every opportunity I get. When someone provides good, thoughtful service, I make sure to not only acknowledge that person, but to let the owner, manager, supervisor or whoever know about it too. It is a sad sign of our times that often when I begin the conversation the initial response is "why, what's wrong?" I love being able to say, "nothing, quite the opposite, I wish to complement exceptional service". To see someone's face light up as the result of being recognized for doing their job thoughtfully, and with care, is a wonderful sight.
>>>>is a wonderful sight<<<<And it didn't cost ya a thing !!!=0)
The destination is not the point. The completion is not the point. Enjoy today. If you can't enjoy today, then what is the point ?
You sure you weren't in central Ohio. I am sure I live near that very yard. DanT
Wow, I thought I was alone in my experiences of late. It seems that Customer service has gone down the drain on all levels. I wonder what it is that has changed the attitudes of many yards?, Part of me wonders if too many HD/Lowes overflow customers are coming through the doors with how to questions and no purchases, or if volume purchasers ( they are dissappearing with the decline of the boom ) are their main priority. One thing I have realised is there is an actuall person behind that counter, not an apron and a birdhouse. Be blunt and ask them if they want your business, tell them how they are presenting themselves to you. If the attitude doesn't change, move on. There is a good chance it will though, everyone would rather do business with the little guy. Even the guy at the counter realises the small stuff is what can hold them over in bad times.
Are you in Montgomery or PG County? If they're used to the big buyers placing $M orders for McMansion development in Potomac, they may have little time for the Laurel prole with his piddling little deck.
Around my area I've found the guys in the lumber yard very helpful, especially when they're sifting through the stack of warped moldy dimensional lumber for something they won't be embarrassed to give to me (where do lumber yards get a reputation for having better lumber than HD/Lowes?) or ripping down stuff and telling me not to tell the front office.....
I've ranted about our local yard for years. Can't stand them. The floor salesmen have a commision deal. If you don't look like a good sale when you walk in, they walk the other way. They hover in the center isle, and watch people walking in the door and rate them, then they will literaly turn down an isle and hide if you don't rate.
The guy that owns it is also a developer and has a lot of big developers locked in so the little guys business isn't a big loss to him.
Wake me up before you go-go.
Good to hear that I'm not alone. I agree with the notion of being courteous even if they're being a-holes, to a point that is. I know how hard a service job can be, so I'm always polite to sales people, waiters etc. I recognize that they're real people, earning a buck like me. I was nice to the guys at the yard yesterday, and didn't really get super pissed till I got home and chewed it over.Living in NY for ten years, I'm used to attitude. I guess I expected it to be different down here, like when I grew up (I'm from Rockville, MD). Whoever said that this has turned into part of the NE megalopolis has got it right. Despite the fact that the guys at lumber yards and stuff still have a southern tang and will talk about NASCAR and such with their buddies, it feels alot more like NY than the rest of Maryland around here. (And yeah, I think they're thriving on the McMansion builders)The best part of the whole experience was that I was picking through 2x6's with my 4'11" mom, and the stock guy came and yelled at us because he said we were stacking the boards up in a messy pile (which is bullsh2t, cause we were stacking em neat as can be-they guy there before me must have thrown em around, like every crew that I see there during the week) I should have said to the guy, "hey buddy, if you want them stacked neat, maybe you should help me out instead of making my dear old mother do it while you shoot the sh2t in the warehouse."About me--I worked desk jobs for ten years before deciding that building for a living was the thing for me. Now I shower at night, not in the morning. I love it. Nothing I'd rather do. I'm still learning alot, but I think I do great work and give my customers a fair price (though I haven't learned to sell myself at all). In general I like the people I meet in this line of work, but there's a definite butthole sniffing that goes on, sizing up the other guys hammer, so to speak.I'm building this deck for my mom cause her old one was rotted to the point of being a serious hazard. Plus, well, she's my mom, and hey, it's mother's day.Thanks guys for your thoughts, and thanks moms,Dave
Rockville MD, Mastic Beach NY
On the one hand there is a lumberyard so close to me if I climb a tree I can see it yet I haven't bought anything from them in15 years because I had a bad experience with how they treated me way back then (it's so long ago I don't even really recall what it was).
On the other hand their are two yards (or I should say chain of yards) that I prefer, Ring's End and Dykes Lumber, and even when I am not at my primary purchasing yard and I'm not recognized I get friendly personable service no matter what the quantity or triviality of what I am getting is. I think it depends more upon the company culture that the management decided they want to build into their companies rather that it being something common to all types of lumber yards.
I've never been pissed off or annoyed at any one of those two companies' yards.
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i'd say company culture is about right.. leadership comes from the top
hey, how 'bout those red sox ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
By Red Sox are you per chance referring to that Boston baseball team that is currently in 2nd place in the American league east?
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yeah... dose guys... da ones that lead the series 3 outta 4Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
LOL.Hate me today, hate me tomorrow, hate me for all the things I didn't do.
jerrald.. lessee.. yankees lost today.. red sox didn't play..
so , they're both at 21 & 14.. but the sox are up 3 to 1 in their series.. so... now who's on first ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Calm down Mike there are 127 games to go! (and 15 more between the Red Sox and Yanks. And you of course remember a few years ago during something called the playoffs that the Yanks had the Sox down 3-0 and the tides turned. Being up 3-1 at this stage doesn't mean much.)
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" I think it depends more upon the company culture that the management decided they want to build into their companies rather that it being something common to all types of lumber yards."
I agree with that statement 120%. I firmly believe that customer service and treatment start at the top. As do all managment related activities. You have a boss that mistreats people, his people will do the same to the customers no matter what they are told.
The local yard we have has a moody, surly owner and that is exactly how the help is. So we simply don't shop there. Tried a number of times. The last visit I stopped at the stop sign where it says "wait here for service" and the yard guy yells in a sh*tty tone "you gonna make me walk all the way down there or what?" Our conversation about that went down hill to say the least. I haven't been back. DanT
I moved to Pa about 8 years ago and I really miss Dyke's Lumber. Their service and moulding selection was absolutely tops.
well, dave ... there it is...
<<<Now I shower at night, not in the morning>>>>
hmmm... ifn we cud onny see ousels as others see us ..
hah, hah, hahMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Dave,I gotta' know, seeing as how I'm from Rockville myself, and seeing as how I'm a contractor whose work is all in lower Montgomery County.....which yard did ya' go to? Perry's....Mizell....Fisher....Barron's......?Mike
Mike,It was Fisher's. In the past I've had great experiences there, which is why I've been going for this job. At Barron's I couldn't even get the guys at the desk to help me, too busy chatting with eachother, so I just walked.The first time I went to Fisher this past week the guy who helped me was extra nice. The second time, the guy was a little condescending when I asked him to describe the different grades of cedar they carry. The third time, the guy got miffed cause I asked him to run two different pricing options, cedar vs. PT. Then the jerk in the yard huffed at me cause I was picking. These were 2x boards for stair treads, I only needed 10, so I wanted nice lookers. If I let them put crap in my truck and sort through it at home, I risk another trip to the yard to return junk. No thanks.Also, I needed a kicker board for my stringers (landing on a concrete pad). I asked yet another counter guy if they had 2x's rated for ground contact. He goes, "They're all #1 pressure treated". Now i'm not smokey the bear, but I know that ground contact rated lumber has more preservative in it than above ground. Shouldn't he know that. I mean, he works at a lumber yard.All in all, frustrating. But I'm still gonna go back there and give them another shot. I tried TW perry in Gaith. Somewhere in between Barrons and Fisher. Not very knowledgable guys at the desk either.I'm moving down to Rockville soon from LI, so I'll get this sorted out eventually.Dave
Dave,I do most of my business at Perry's, at the Chevy Chase location. I have an account at Barron's, but they're pretty much as you described them. Handy though, if I'm headed straight down 355 (I live in G-burg).So far, I think Perry's at CC is the only place not entirely staffed with redneck a-holes!Good luck to ya'Mike
Jeff's dad is one person I'd like to meet!
He Sounds like my grandfather. Says what he means and means
what he says
We see in this thread & several others what is the underlieng problems in busness of all kinds today (including the trades). Management attitude sets the stage for how employees deal with tasks and customers. We need to look at the focus of a business' clients if theiy are oriented to DIY or quick & dirty (read cheap); if so pass them up. They will be an agrivation in the long run. But, just as important look to the businesses that are prosperous themselves because there is generally a reason they are sucessful related to their customer relations attitude.
Jim Andersen
Great responses. I especially agree with those who try to befriend the lumberyard folks. This is surely the best way to get good treatment no matter where you are.
We do business with six yards, one box and five local. We usually use whichever is closest to the job, except if a particular yard has a specialty that they excell in.
We get good service from all, partly because they know that they are in competition for our business and partly because we are good customers.
How are we good customers? We plan ahead, we are courteous and patient in the face of frustrations, we pay our bills on time, we don't argue price, we help unload, we don't pick through lumber (as long as it comes from an unsorted pile), and because we view the yards as our partners in building.
Every lumberyard has its strengths and weaknesses. Do your shopping with these in mind, not thinking you can make them change and you will have generally good experiences.
I think it is a local thing that just happens to be in the majority of the country - :)
I live just outside Portland, OR in a small community and there is a small local lumberyard that has been here at least 50 yrs and gives excellent service. First time I went there, I was picking up a small order of 5 boards to make a planter with and they did not have one of them in the size I wanted and they gave me one that was ft longer at no charge and no calls to the office. They also made sure to select nice straight boards for me. And this was a piddly $25 order
The price was reasonable and the service great - treated me like a regular big time customer. They will be getting more and more of my business from here on.
On the other hand I have had your experience at other lumber yards and will not go them unless I absolutely have to. I will usually give them the benefit of the doubt and will try a place 2-3 times before writing them off. I would rather go a bit out of my way and get treated well, even if it costs a few extra bucks, than get looked down on or ignored or treated like sh1t. For that I have family.
One thought about surly service. I went to HD to buy a power hand planer yesterday. I went to HD because I had store credit.The girl who rang me up was surly as all hell, but man was she smokin' hot. If the staff at the lumberyard looked like her, I think I could handle the crappy attitude.Testosterone gets the better of me every time.Dave
The girl who rang me up was surly as all hell, but man was she smokin' hot. If the staff at the lumberyard looked like her, I think I could handle the crappy attitude.We got a couple like that running the commerical desk at Lowes, you can tell they are eye candy only. Pretty as hell but down right mean. I stay away from that end of the store.
use them early and often.
they're too good to not go nation wide!
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
I love my local yard. I have never had a need they couldn't fill. Longest lead time is 3-4 weeks for Anderson orders, most other things are 3-5 days.
They beat the big boxes to death on price, servive and quality.
Last year I spent over 300k there so I guess my business is worth their taking the time but I have waited behind a totaly lost soul before who was being led by the hand through the processes of trying to find out just what he needed and he was well taken care of even for the 50 bucks he ended up spending.
bigwagon,
I think 1/2 is the attitude one goes in with, and 1/2 region. I go into my (small) supplier(big for this region) in northeast Vermont, and load my truck Go to the counter, tell them what I have, and they bill me.. No counting, no yard guys going over the invoice etc.
Northeastvt
sincer yer on board ... here's another one.
possibly my favorite "dad moment" ...
we're working somewhere ... head to a diner for lunch.
Dad orders a hamburger and fries.
the order comes ... and it's the smallest pirce of meat on the smallest bun I'd even seen ... and I swear there were no more than 4 or 5 fries.
I was shocked Dad didn't have anything smart to say to the waitress. He just looked at the tiny meal ... and started eating.
10 minutes later ... his plate is clean.
I'm not even halfway thru mine ... for some reason .. I got a normal sized meal.
The waitress comes over and asks if everything is alright.
Dad just looks up and says ...
"yeah, but I'm still waiting for the other half of my lunch"!
as I was finishing up ... he got his second plate!
another hamburger and more fries.
(second half was normal size food too)
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
speaking of small food, I got those ruby mini at ruby tuesday today. They was good.
Old man sitting at the outskirts of town. Man walks up says "what kind of town is this?" OM say, "What kind of town you come from?" Man say,"People were mean." OM say, " Just like that here".
Another man comes by asks OM what the town is like. OM asks what the town was like where the man came from. Man say they were nice folk. OM say "We got the same kind here." See what I mean? Another words, If you get to pick thru the lumber, what does the lumberman get to sell to the rest of the people??? Or should he just throw that stuff away?
Rich
What????
So you're saying that I should stick my customers with junk just because that's all the yard is willing to give me??? I think that you have got that backwards, I think that I should get what I pay for. I'm just going to try and not be a jerk about it.
There's no way that I am going to settle for junk if I can get better, it's not what I pay for, it's not what I sell my customers and it's definitely not what I am about...
Just perhaps, the lumberman shoud find better product.
BILL
No. I don't think I said anything about sticking anyone with junk.
If your lumberyard gives you junk, you should find a better lumberyard. My lumberyard works hard to give me top lumber, delivered and stacked at my jobsite. And they are nice guys, too. On occasion I will get a stick that is not so good, and I use it for blocking, backing, etc. Hope this helps,
Rich
Actually, my yard does throw the bad stuff away. They have a wood recycling dumpster on sight for just that purpose.
They are also very willing to make good on any problems with warped, damaged, or defective materials- just one of the many reasons I spend my money there.
Our local yard is fantastic. I'm always friendly with the sales, yard and delivery staff. I can honestly say when we order lumber it's hand picked for the best of the pile. I think its because I show how much I appreciate it and treat the staff with respect. I listen to their problems and really get to know them. Some I even know their kids and wife's names. I know of some other contractors who a real a-holes and their needs get put on the back burner. And I like that.
It's interesting. Before they relaxed the dress code where I work it was dress shirt and dress slacks. When I'd go into, say, an auto parts place, I could wait at the counter until I took root and no one would pay any attention to me.
The dress code is not quite relaxed -- T-shirt and jeans or shorts. I go into an auto parts place and get served right away.