Everyone keeps talking about what type of nails to use for ACQ lumber for decks and foundation bolts touching the ACQ sills. I’ve heard nothing about what anyone is nailing the sills together with and what nails are you nailing your floor joists to the ACQ sills with.
I started using the paslode nails that have the ACQ stamp on it for nailing the floor joists into the ACQ sills. Is anyone else doing this?
I’ve mentioned it at the lumber yards and to the Architect that I’m framing and addition for and they all said that it’s a good point.
Joe Carola
Replies
Absolutely a good point. I'm starting to frame a house in a couple of weeks, and to avoid the issue, we're going with borate treated mudsills.
Andy
Arguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
Absolutely a good point. I'm starting to frame a house in a couple of weeks, and to avoid the issue, we're going with borate treated mudsills.
I'm going to ask about this stuff and see if anyone looks at me like I have two heads like they do when you ask about ACQ.
Joe Carola
You could also use western red cedar STK 2x or 3x for sills and avoid the issue altogether.
The developing consensus seems to be that the corrosion issues are minimal or nonexistent in dry conditions... which is presumably what you have where the floor joists sit on the sill. Most of the discussion has been re galv fasteners/hangers and ACQ, but not much if any about bright steel framing nails and ACQ. I assume the lack of zinc in bright nails to react with the copper in ACQ changes the equation.
You could certainly buy stainless steel nails for your gun or use stainless deck screws for that connection. By the same token you might want to consider what you're using to nail the bottom edge of the plywood at the mudsill, or the pony wall studs if you're framing that way. I picked up a piece of ACQ on a job and drove a bunch of different fasteners into it as a test. It's been sitting in my barn several months and nothing's corroding. When I finish the deck I'm building I'm going to stick it under there and see what happens.
Most of the discussion has been re galv fasteners/hangers and ACQ, but not much if any about bright steel framing nails and ACQ. I assume the lack of zinc in bright nails to react with the copper in ACQ changes the equation.
That's a good point also but I guess the real question is can we still use bright common nails into this ACQ?
By the same token you might want to consider what you're using to nail the bottom edge of the plywood at the mudsill
Another good point. Also if your framing a basement with wood and using ACQ for the bottom plate or nailing garage studs to the ACQ sills.
I see contractors all over the place and everyone is still confused. I told the Architect the other day that with all the confusion with this stuff that they should start specking it out on the plans what type of nails and hardware to use since using the wrong hardware and nails and everyone talking about going back and looking at decks they built and the hangers are rusting and nails rusting if this is al true then there could be some serious problems with these decks falling down and so on.
If I'm makining more out of this then where's the actual proof that we can use bright commons into ACQ and still I say that the Architects should speck it out on the plans and not leave it up to the contractors and lumber yard suppliers to try and figure it out because this could be a serious structural problem down the road.
Joe Carola
I use round head hot-dipped galvanized strips, which sell for about $82.00 a box at HD.
Joe,
How have you been doing? Well I hope. Is little Joey big enough to pin you yet? It won't be long. My sister is due to give birth on the 13th and I am going to spoil her little girl rotten :-) I'm looking forward to it.
There is a Tools of the Trade article in last month's issue, you may be able to get it at the website (http://www.toolsofthetrade.net/2004/marchapril2004/online/corrosion_0304/corrosion_final.asp) that talked about this issue in some detail. We've been using Bostich Thickcoat nails and Halsteel True Hot Dipped (http://www.halsteel.com/prod_nail_coatings.html) 10d stick nails. The Bostich are 8d coils and are about $60 a box and the Halsteel were $70 something.
Yesterday we put on a floor and our lumberyard gave us a box of Simpson double dipped galvanized bearing washers. I had to ask repeatedly for them to start ordering this stuff in galvanized. I'm having a lot of trouble getting this through to some carpenters too (Joe, it's the same guy that gives me problems about the roof too :-(
What we are doing is to just use the Halsteel nails on anything that touches the treated. This one box has gotten us through 2 floors and it's still more than half full. Since it is very wet around here, except in the summer, I think we'll be using these nails from now on.