OK all you mechanical guys out there, can this device really do what it says it can do or is a sucker born every minute? I got the link from my gmail program as a banner ad, but I’m awfully suspicious. Kinda seems like those late infomercial type of things that promise increased fuel economy; something obviously the Big 3 couldn’t figure out. Anyway, here’s the link: http://www.hotwaterlobster.com/
Now, if Dino had something to do with this then I’d believe it.
Cheers,
Ken
“They don’t build ’em like they used to” And as my Dad always added… “Thank God!”
Replies
no clue...
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Well, two things come to mind--
--- with the cold water line being used as a return for warm water to the water heater, if you want cold water, you're going to have to opne the cold water tap and let it run to flush the warm water out of the cold like...and,
-- all that warm water recirculating through the pipes is going to waste a lot of energy in a typical house, where neither water line is insulated.
Seems like a stupid way to keep hot water at the point of use. It's a new construction feature but I think a HW recirc pump on a timer makes a lot more sense.
Cliff
Laing makes one as well: http://www.autocirc.com/
Someone on this forum said you can get them at the Depot but I've never seen them there. I believe the price was comparable but this needs an electrical outlet.
It isn't going to be effective (in most situations) without a pump. The better scheme is a pump mounted under the vanity in the remote location. Push a button (or trigger with a timer set for your morning shower) and the pump starts and runs until hot water arrives.
Of course, better still, if you have the space, is a small (eg, 5-10 gallon) water heater at the remote location, spliced into the incoming hot water line. In southern climes this can be installed in the attic.
Well the CONCEPT is good.
Lots of people have thermosyphon systems setup in NEW CONSTUCTION with a dedicated return line.
You need a loop so that the hot water rises to the farest/highest fixture and then as it cools off it sinks and goes through the return line.
Instead of the using a dedicated return line they use a thermostatic valve and use the cold water line for the return.
Now it MIGHT work, but in a lot of cases the hot and cold lines are run so that there is really not enough difference for thermo circulation.
But the ad is full of BS.
"Your existing hot water tank now uses less energy
reheating 85 degree F water instead of cold ground temperature water. "
That is TRUE, but meaningless.
There are two different cases.
When you are drawing hot water then the WH is being refilled with cold ground temp water WITH OUR WITH OUT THIS.
When you are not using hot water and you don't have this valve the the WH is only keeping the tank hot.
With this valve the WH is keeping the tank hot, PLUS reheating ghe 85 degree recycling water.
Makes sense to me. I can't really see that the savings would be all that great. Anyway, that seems to shed enough light on it for me guys. Thanks.Cheers,
Ken"They don't build 'em like they used to" And as my Dad always added... "Thank God!"
Your existing hot water tank now uses less energy
reheating 85 degree F water instead of cold ground temperature water
It may use less energy this time around, but you already paid to heat this water once. Or twice. If you leave home for a week, you might heat the same water 100 times, who knows.
Net savings is a loss. The more it circulates that more you don't save.
Joe H
so effectively you are setting up a massive radiant heat loop in the house? If the pipes are super insulated it would create a "larger hot water storage tank" but, if it isnt uber insulated it will cost lots of money.
I think (someone correct me if I am wrong) that a hot water pump doesnt save money, but it will have hot water out of the tap much sooner.... 5 seconds vs 45....
With the push-button pump presumably you can save money by not wasting warm water down the drain, but the savings would be negligible in most cases.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
Most of the ads that I have seen for recirculation systems of any type have general talked about saving water and no mention of eneergy cost.
We use hot water circulating pumps in commercial buildings all the time for that very reason. Not to save on energy cost, but provide hot water on demand at locations much more remote to the HWH than in your average home. We have ganged electric or gas heaters and hot water boilers with and without storage large tanks.
Dave
Of course in commercial buildings the hot water lines may run several hundred (if not thousand) feet, and since the lines are often 2" or larger it would take someone half an hour to get hot water when the demand is low.
If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. --James Madison
It's nothing mire than a thermal loop (which only loops 99%+/- of the time because of the valve). They work, but, as mentioned a pump increases the flow.
OTOH, what you're doing is constantly circulating hot water which you've paid to heat, through pipes which will dissipate that heat. I suppose in the winter that will marginally reduce your other heating bills, but in the summer you're (i) running your water heater more and (ii) your A/C.
SO is the little bit of a wait for the hot water to reach the tap worth it?
Fighting Ignorance since 1967
It's taking way longer than we thought