Hello: If prices were the same, which would prefer real stucco or brick and Why . We live in central Arkansas in the Little Rock area..
When I say real stucco, I mean the three(3) coat system using wire mesh, felt paper, etc.
Thanks in advance
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That's a personal design choice.
What criteria are you asking about? Longevity? Style?
I'm used to seeing brick but have now moved to a state where stucco reigns. I prefer brick. I'm the minority here.
What do you prefer? What is the predominant style in your area? Will you look odd using either?
Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
Hello: thanks for your reply. Our area has a mix of brick ,stucco, all brick, brick/stucco combo, etc.
What I'm mainly interested is performance. Our house will be a two story and the upper level will be stucco. The main question is, do I go with stucco on the remainder of the house or place brick on the lower level.
Having lived in Tucson in an all stucco home for more than ten years and in multiple brick homes in the midwest prior to that, I would always prefer an all brick facasde exterior home. However, I would not want a brick home in this ungodly hot place. One big drawback of the three step stucco exterior is that it is redicuously easy to break into. Just cut through the wall.
wouldn't it be easier to go thru a window?
It may be that it would be easier to go through a window. I am not a professional thief but it seems to me that windows are designed to resist breakins. Breaking the glass is noisy and would attract attention. Punching a hole through the stucco and cutting the chicken wire would not be so noisy as to attract the attention of neighbors.
I have seen news reports of this happening.
Whacking a hole through stucco is as noisy as breaking through a window. Safety isn't the issue here though anyways. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
This is perhaps the most specious argument I have ever read on BT. bwahaha
No, they've used that same argument when discussing vinyl siding. It's an old argument that has some partial value. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
It's an old argument that has some partial value
But mostly only in those rarer cases of buildings built without sheathing.
The same case can be made for "pure" adobe buildings, a determined person could dig through the wall. Ok, that's punching through an inch or so of cement plaster or stucco, then 12-14" of well-dried adobe, then another plaster coat (or, possibly, a partition wall).
Door or window makes an easier target.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Anyone else remember the old lime based soft stucco's? What happened to them. Proven for centuries in cold wet climates (and hot).You
just painted a white wash of lime on them when they got tired.I
have heard that you can tint them very whatever color you like.
Probably our aversion to maintenence I guess.
If my experience in cutting a hole in my traditional stucco house (circa 1957) is any indication, punching a hole through stucco is not easy. I used a hammer drill with 3/4" masonry bit to drill a series of holes and then broke out the area in between. That stucco was hard and it took more than a little effort to make a 5" diameter hole. It would take quite a bit of effort to make a hole big enough to crawl through.
stucco is basically a 100 year material. Brick might be a 200 year material, but I'm 48, so my daughters, and their kids will have to deal with the failures, if there are any. ok maybe you will need a topcoat after 40 years, but the performance of stucco is not to be underestimated. I find the bad press for stucco is unfounded or based on folks who don't to it properly ( 2 layers of felt is critical...) Scratch coat is hard, 3 to 1, brown coat soft 4-5 to one ( sand to masonry cement) top coat very hard 2 to 1 ( silica sand to white portland). with these different hardnesses the chance of a crack permeating the whole structure is low. It's not rocket surgery, just cement done right.
Cloudbuster.
Even the best stucco jobs will have issues over time, However well done Brick lasts seemingly forever..
No one uses brick anymore in Calif except for trim purposes. Earthquakes are not kind to brick. You will find cinder block but it has been reinforced with rebar and cement
90% of what I am posting here is pure bullsh*it. The other 10% is made up because I don't know anthing aobut this. So take it was a grain of salt followed by a carload of salt.
From what I understand there stuccoing needs lot and lot of specialisted details for it to work correctly. And that there are lots of people applying stucco that don't know what they are doing.
And lots of problem with walls rotting after 5-10 years. And you are not in a specially dry area.
http://www.thestuccoinspector.com/index.html
Brick veneer has a drainage plane behind the brick that IN THERORY is more forgiving.
However, as reported by Nuke's baywindow leaks and the "near disaster" of Guner's new house there are lots of people installing brick that don't know what they are doing.
.
A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
Bill:
Your B***sh*t is quite accurate. I have dealt with some ugly Stucco here in the east.
I have also dealt with leaking brick, but far less as the 1" fingerspace tends to be more forgiving of bad workmanship and incorrect flashing details.
Cloudbuster: If it is longevity, I am sure that both, if installed correctly will outlast me. Stucco needs a drainage plane to drain which means 2 layers of drainage. 1st layer is the layer that keeps water out of the house. The felt or wrap needs to be over the top flange of windows, under the bottom flange of windows, windows need a pan in them that drains to the exterior, the felt or wrap needs to continue from roof sheathing (not the gable trim woood but all the way up) down to the weep screed at the bottom of the stucco which should be about 2" below the sill plate or would drop into the finger space of the brick or flashed to drain out.
The 2nd layer of wrap is to keep the stucco from sticking to the 1st layer. Then you can put on your wire, etc.
Brick is not as tricky but still needs attention to detail.
I would use whichever will make the home look better and then make sure I researched then flashed then double checked then triple checked then installed!
Stucco houses are pretty common in Minneapolis. There are plenty of them that were built 80+ years ago that are still in fine shape, so apparently the old style stucco composition was pretty resistant to extremes in temperature. On the other hand, there also have been plenty of synthetic stucco houses built in the last 20 years that have rotted away.
Stuart,
Look carefully at some of those old stucco jobs here in Mpls.. some are still holding on but clearly need attention. I had one such a place.. there were a couple of spots that the stucco was starting to come loose 60 plus years after it was done.. In addition the near impossibility of replacing rotted/worn out windows in a manner which ensures solid water proofing makes replacement windows a real risk. More than a few homes a decade or so after the windows are replaced start to loose the stucco..
Hello: Thanks for the info. All the stucco applicators in our area staple the wire mesh directly to the house wrap. I know that is a problem--but trying to convince them to use the system you described is falling on deaf ears.
Question: When using the 2 layer felt paper approach how do you prevent the stapling of the wire mesh from bonding the first layer to the underlayment.?
Thanks:
Cloudbuster
Wow! I am glad you are thinking about it and engaged. Most of the time when I talk about this stuff I fall on deaf ears.
Make it 110% mandatory for them to put on the 2 layers! Tell em you must inspect and verify the entire thing. (best way is to use 2 different types of product for the two layers. (I actually make my framer put on the 1st layer and lap properly when installing windows, doors, etc.
Anyway, to answer your question, when you staple the 2nd layer to the 1st, the tight area will still allow water to run thru.
Try it. Take a 2'x2' piece of 1/4" luan or something, staple 2 layers onto it and run some water down inbetween the 2 layers. It will come right thru to the bottom.
I use stucco wrap as the 1st layer but felt really does work just fine so long as it is lapped properly, esp. under the window flanges!!!
Good luck.
J
I have a brick house now and am thinking of breaking it up with something else. To much brick is, well, to much imo. I like the clean lines of well done stucco. But it has to be well done. And brick has a more traditional look.
How about both?
I agree that most of what's on this thread is BS. I lived in a stucco house for 20 years, stuccoed my small barn 10 years ago and it's a great material. Plus it's alot less expensive than brick(if you do it yourself---nothing cheaper!). A fine sand float (vs the texture that one frequently sees) is a beautifull finish and looks great. Breaking a hole in stucco is not easy. I put in a 5' by 5' bay window in and cut the stucco with a diamond blade and had to use a 10# sledge hammer multiple times to put a hole in it. The wire mesh is difficult to cut through and you should have some sort of sheathing behind it anyway. When properly done you have 1" of cement all around, plus the mesh, plus two layers of roof felt.
I agree that the break in argument doesn't have much merit, if they want in that bad they will get in somehow. I think the beauty of stucco
goes with out saying, it's the longevity that is the question.Here in upstate new york it will fail eventually. Granted deep overhangs,proper installation, favorable location, and proper maintenance can mean a very long lifespan, but water will get in and freeze someday.
Not to say stucco is bad but it does have drawbacks.
Where #### Brick is also beautiful in it's own way. It is more expensive. Yet with the same care (proper installation,maintence, etc.) it can last indefinitely in any climate.