Replies

1. 
   FastEddie1 | Oct 03, 2004 10:50pm | #1

   Ignore the format of the form and write what you want.

   If you bid the work on T&M then you're obligated to show each.  But if you say I'll fix that rotted door trim for $300 then just show the total price, regardless of the components.

   Whenever you are asked if you can do a job, tell'em "Certainly, I can!"  Then get busy and find out how to do it.  T. Roosevelt

2. 
   dIrishInMe | Oct 03, 2004 11:00pm | #2

   I say lump it together into 1 price.  Makes for less scrutinization on the part of the homeowner. 

   Next time you get a complaint about your prices, ask them how much they pay for their family's medical insurance.  Then ask if they know how much liability insurance, disability insurance costs.  Then ask them how many "free estimates" they have given lately, and mention advertisement expense, business cards, office and phone expenses.  Then hit them with tools, vehicle expenses, deprecation, accounting fees, tax prep fees, etc, etc, etc

   Matt
1. 
   channelock | Oct 04, 2004 12:39am | #4

   With all due respect, he does not care about all that. The collective consumer wants a good job at the best price he can get. He is really not interested in the overhead of Wal-Mart, the insurance company, Krogers, or the handyman.

   He also does not understand what his options are in most cases.

   He doesn't want to get ripped on quality but doesn't want to pay more than he has to to get it done.

   There are different levels of quality that still fall within the scope of doing a proper job.

   Best thing to do on a small job is to qoute the best price you can for the quality of work that you determine is expected. Have a clear understanding as to what you are going to do and what you are guaranteeing. Then if the amount is questioned explain why that is a good price for that level of quality and extent of work. Keep it centered on the quality and extent of work aspect rather than the cost breakdown.

   If you feel comfortable suggesting an adjustment in the extent of work or level of quality with acorresponding cost adjustment then do it. Most consumers will appreciate the options.

   This is my opinion and my "take' on a subject that has been discussed a lot in various threads in this forum. I respect you viewpoint and definately understand the agitation most trades people feel in this area.

   Hope that sharing this opinion helps.

1. 
   Snort | Oct 04, 2004 04:26am | #7

   The deal is that even folks doing work on your house have to shop at walmart, buy insurance from farm bureau, and groceries at Krogers(ok, maybe if that's your only choice). We're providing a service and giving the HO a value. Usually a repair/handyman is called in because paint and caulk has stopped hiding the HO's neglect.

   After I've been hired to fix stuff that's has nothing to with my work, and the bill is questioned, I don't get embarrassed. 99.9% of homeowners know they've put off fixing something damaging,and they're hoping they can find some idiot to fix it like the one that put it in the first time.

   Sorry, explanations cost extra<G> May sound cold, but I've been doing this for a while. Don't worry, we can fix that later!

3. 
   Mooney | Oct 04, 2004 12:00am | #3

   I know this H&A contractor that bids total price and nothing else . 5 tons cost you a total price to install. Period . He sticks to that price and hes the most successful. If he runs ionto a problem or many problems , its still that price . That total price never changes ! Hes a trusted man because of that principle. Of course he also enjoys the profits. Hes a little higher than anyone else.

   Tim Mooney

4. 
   trimmer | Oct 04, 2004 12:43am | #5

   The reason Labor and Materials are listed separate is that in most states labor is taxable for repair/remodel, the sales tax is usually already paid when purchasing materials.

   As has already been said, if you have given (quoted) a lump sum, then there is no reason to itemize, otherwise if you happen to be in a state that requires sales tax on repair/remodel labor.....

1. 
   RW | Oct 04, 2004 12:49am | #6

   And not that I think you will care much, but your tax thing give me the opportunity to vent a tad . . .

   Two years ago, no construction labor was taxable. A year ago, it was, but only on a remodel. Turns out nobody could decipher the tax law, and people ran into problems - an electrician wiring a new addition legally had to not tax the labor of the addition, but tax the labor for whatever he had to do once he hit the original house wall to the panel.

   This year they "simplified" things by saying everyone pays tax, on a portion of the total bill, regardless of labor or material cost. Try telling Quickbooks I said I'd do it for a grand, now figure out how much is taxable, how much isn't, and what portion the tax is so it all adds up.

   *groan*"If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain

5. 
   taekwon | Oct 04, 2004 04:32am | #8

   This is something I have typed up for customers who may question my hourly rate (read below).  I use a slightly different format.  Some people, particularly those who are not self-employed just don't understand that a contractors hourly rate is not actually what they put into their pocket.  I once had a customer say "I've never made $60.00 an hour in my life!"   

    

    

   Contractors liability insurance;  for our customers protection we carry a $2,000,000 policy. 

   Contractors license; yearly renewal and continuing education.

   Construction Trailer and Equipment; over $60,000 invested, equipment depreciation and maintenance.

   Vehicle; Purchase cost, insurance, gas, vehicle depreciation, maintenance etc.

   Telephone; phone line, fax machine, Internet / e-mail and cellular phone.

   Advertising;  phone book, newspaper, web page, business cards, signs etc.
   Warranty work;  guaranteeing customer satisfaction.

   Job estimating;  time spent on estimating generally is not income earning but is time consuming therefore is a cost of doing business.

   Office time;  tracking accounts receivable/ payable, payroll taxes, business taxes etc.

   Office & storage space; rent, utilities and insurance.

   Office supplies; computer, furniture, paper, contractors forms, postage etc.

   
   Employees and Sub-Contractors

   Employees; Payroll expenses are approximately 40% of employees wages which include… workers compensation insurance, federal and state unemployment insurance, social security and Medicare.  Not included is a medical and retirement plan.

6. 
   Piffin | Oct 04, 2004 01:50pm | #9

   If youwork and charge hourly, you have to tell them the rate right up fron. That is the right time for them to squak and you to walk.

    

    

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