So you can still get shocked with a GFI?
I was cleaning the cord on my electric toothbrush holder (the charger) today with a damp rag, and danged if I didn’t get a shock when I dragged the rag over a spot where the cats had pierced the insulation with their sharp teeth.
The unit was plugged into a GFI, and it wasn’t a big shock, but enough to get a “dang it” out of me.
I got to thinking that it didn’t trip because I didn’t provide an alternate GROUND, I was more like a LOAD because I was touching both sides of the cord at once.
Now, to extend this a bit, if you were in the bath tub, and it was fiberglass tub with ABS drainline, and it wasn’t full up to the spout, you could be quite electrically insulated (e.g ungrounded) and if the curling iron falls into the tub, wouldn’t you be just as much at risk for electric shock?
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Joe Tedesco has some videos of hair dryers motorboating around in hotel sinks.
The GFCI didn't trip there either, presumably because there was no ground path. Why the immersion detector in the plug didn't trip was another issue.
In your case you may have received a tingle, less than the 5MA to trip the GFCI. Did you try the test button to see if it is working?
I always tell people, The GFCI may save you from electrocution but it won't keep you from falling off the ladder.
Joe Tedesco has some videos of hair dryers motorboating around in hotel sinks.
Believe it or not...Thats beause clean water is a very poor conductor of electricity and distilled water is actually a good insulator.
Thats also why a basement can fill up with water (covering a service panel) from a flood and never loss power in the house.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_conductivity
You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
Edited 8/22/2008 9:10 am by Marv
Edited 8/22/2008 9:14 am by Marv
"...clean water is a very poor conductor of electricity and distilled water is actually a good insulator."You're absolutely right about that, otherwise the Edison Co guys who spray DI water to clean the insulators of power transmission lines would get fried in no time.I was surprised at the low conductivity of sea water in that chart.BruceT
I would not be surprised at what happens in motel/hotel rooms (Electrically, that is). I was once in a motel in the DC area & for some off the wall reason plugged a hair dryer into a GFCI that had been intentionally tripped w/ the "Test" button. THE SUCKER TURNED ON! After that, I started testing every GFCI in a motel bath. TEN percent were either defective or wired backwards.In the FWIW Dept - I've taken 110V across my torso, hand to hand & it had no adverse effect on my pacemaker. I duly noted the time & date of the event & checked the next time I had the PM downloaded - no untoward events at the date & time recorded. OTOH, I once climbed up through my ceiling joists & my chest passed w/i an inch or so of the 220V cable feeding my water heater. The heater was on at the time. The magnetic field momentarily shut the PM down. Darned near fell off the ladder.DonDon Reinhard
The Glass Masterworks
"If it scratches, I etch it!"
The GFCI won't protect you from contacting hot and neutral. In an immersion situation, however, hot and neutral are generally very close together, so the field between them is quite concentrated in one spot and much less likely to produce an electrocution hazard than the more wide-spread field between hot and ground.
Also, the current level that trips a GFI is a bit higher than the minimum level where you'd possibly feel a (non-lethal) shock.
I've tripped a GFI when I was solidly solidly grounded in wet soil. Felt it real good. Fortunately, it's just a short jolt. Maybe I wouldn't be typing this if there wasn't a GFI installed that one time. I've tripped them when not so solidly grounded, without feeling much of a jolt. They are very handy devices, but they do need periodic testing. I don't like the idea of cheap third world parts and labor in a safety device. On that note, I will not even consider a harbor freight GFI.
Some of the best (traditional) circuit breakers are made in China now. Forget safety we want the cheapest labor.
Actually Brian Williams had a Chinese guy in NBC news the other night complaining Chinese workers are being put put of work because they exported the factory to Vietnam ... for cheaper labor.
How does it go? What comes around goes around!
I would change out the GFCI. and the toothbrush.
You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
and the cat...
"Now, to extend this a bit, if you were in the bath tub, and it was fiberglass tub with ABS drainline, and it wasn't full up to the spout, you could be quite electrically insulated (e.g ungrounded) and if the curling iron falls into the tub, wouldn't you be just as much at risk for electric shock?"
the electric field is concentrated around the hot and neutral. Thus even if you where in the tub and couple of inches away that feel much if anything.
and even if you grab it the currents would be low and limited to the hand.
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A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
Would "what is the output of the charger" be a pertinent question? I thought most chargers were some sort of transformer and normally ending up with 9-12 vdc and .5a on the output end. At least that is what a quick unscientific survey here revealed (;-).
Then again I would not expect to feel anything from that. His is probably one of the transformer built in to the base types.For those who have fought for it Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know.
Yes, transformer is in the base and the feeder cord is 110v AC.
Dental records are inconclusive at this time as to which cat was the culprit, but I'm guessing he/she got the message not to mess with the cords any more.
We have five cats in the house (all rescues by two suckers)and can fully understand! We used to have a rabbit and had to keep it in a cage because of that. They don't just make pinholes, they work better than a pair of Kleins.For those who have fought for it Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know.
We have 6 1/2 cats now, and most of those are rescues. The half cat (not pictured in the link below) is one who USED to be domestic, and decided to seek his fortune in the wide world. Started showing up recently after being gone for two years. He can't decide if he's a loner or not. He comes around for food, and even comes into the house now and then, but won't let you pet him unless he's busy eating, so he gets to be the "half cat".
Our cats: http://www.underforty.us/our_cats_2008.pdf
Our kids have discussed having us comitted. Our oldest one is one our daughter got to replace one we had for a long time. She got her from a vet so sort of rescue. The rest showed up at the door. She is on the "bad cat" list at our vet as she bit one of the assistants. Just found out she is diabetic and I have to give her insulin shots twice a day. She is a better patient than I am.
I like the photo essay, I need to do one for our mob. They are like kids, each with their own quirks.For those who have fought for it Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know.
"I dragged the rag over a spot where the cats had pierced the insulation with their sharp teeth."
Better break out the duct tape. :)
"Preach the Gospel at all times; if necessary, use words." - St. Francis of Assisi
"Better break out the duct tape. :) "Just to be clear. The duct tape is for the cats..
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A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
My brother-in-law grew up on a farm. They kept cats around to help combat the mice. To neuter their cats, they would shove them head-first into a cowboy boot, and use a pocket knife to perform the "surgery" and then the cats would just lick themselves and heal up. My brother-in-law is now a dentist. He's better with people than he was with cats.
"Preach the Gospel at all times; if necessary, use words." - St. Francis of Assisi
Did the get a dentist's chair upholstered up like a big cowboy boot?
Too much sanity may be madness. And maddest of all, to see life as it is and not as it should be! --Miguel de Cervantes
Better break out the duct tape. :)
I might get some white electrical tape and give that a shot, actually. If I was tidy about it, it would hardly show and would, for a while anyway, reduce the liklikhood of a repeat event.
Or I could stop wiping off the cord every 5 years. It wasn't THAT dirty....
Edited 8/22/2008 5:49 pm ET by geoffhazel
You and your meticulous, scrupulous cleaning....will it never end?
What's next, the white glove test?
"Preach the Gospel at all times; if necessary, use words." - St. Francis of Assisi