My daughter is purchasing a 1949’s house. Since good ole dad is retired, guess who has been asked to “help” with some remodeling projects? We are considering replacing the original windows with newer more energy efficient ones. Any suggestions? Also the flue pipes for the heater appear to be covered in asbestos. I really don’t want to remove them. I just need some ideas on a way to stabilize the pipes so the asbestos doesn’t become airborn. If I leave it alone, no problem, but we want to add blown in insullation. Some kind of wrap?
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dave.... ask around locally... about asbestos abatement.. if you ever want to do it , now's the time.. in some jurisdictions it's not as big a deal...who knows what the regulations may be if she ever wants to sell
as to the windows.. since your labor is "free".. i'd think about new prime windows.. 1949 era windows will be single pane, high maintenance, requiring triple track storms in most locations..
if i could swing it.. i'd remodel one room at a time... replacing all the windows in that room..
now.. if she's not going to keep the house for long.. then paint it..
insulation ?... need a lot more info....
I've heard hair spray makes a good encapsulating agent.
I didn't look in the attic but we did have a home inspection. As he described it to me, the duct work is a round sheet metal tube with asbestos insulation attached to the outside of the tubes. I don't intend on replacing the duct work. I just wanted to encapuslate, if that's the right word, so that I wouldn't disturb the asbestos. As I understand it, you don't have to remove it if you don't disturb it. Maybe there is some type of insulation I can install around the tubes that we keep it intack. As far as the windows go, we may have to use replacement window but I would like to keep the original ones if there is a way to weather strip and install insulated glass. It appears that I can remove the existing windows from the outside and install new ones without having to tear too much out. Of course I will fill all voids with non expanding foam. This way the only wood I would have to replace if it tears out is the brick molding. How's that for a plan?
where do you live ?.... i've never heard of ducts with asbestos wrap..
heat pipes , it's quite common.. i was a slit cover with a linen wrap.. and metal bands to keep it in place..
good luck with the windowsMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike, I seem to remember having seen a gravity fed furnace with insulation on at least some of its basement ductwork. Spongy stuff maybe 1-1.5" thick. May have been asbestos, don't know.
Its more typical to see either a fabric covering or just bare ductwork with the big 'ol gravities. Did you say the fabric was some kind of linen? I never knew what it was, but usually it's very brittle.
Dave, Mike is a good source of info on renovating/adding-on. I haven't had to encapsulate asbestos (yet, but might end up learning on BIL's basement rad pipes), so I don't have any good information for you, but here is some general info and links.
http://www.encasement.com/safe.htm
My ignorant opinion would be that it would be cheaper to encase it than to remove it (assuming the expense of "legally" removing it).
http://whitelung.org/pubs/aith/4.html
However, if the asbestos is in good condition and not likely to be disturbed, there are several methods of managing it in place: Encapsulation: spraying the asbestos with a sealant (like paint) can temporarily keep the asbestos fibers in their original material. As long as the original bond remains in the material, encapsulation may be used. If the material is crumbling and deteriorating, encapsulation can do more harm than good. This is because the sealant pulls down the loosened asbestos material and can allow additional fibers to be released into the air. Encapsulating with a penetrating sealant can also make future removal of the asbestos-containing material more difficult. Since the encapsulant may begin to deteriorate, it must be regularly inspected. Enclosure: isolating asbestos material from potential damage by using a sturdy, airtight barrier--a suitable, but temporary remedy for some asbestos problems. jt8
john.... i premised my response on wether she intends to keep the house or not..
as your site pointed out..
<<<Encapsulation: spraying the asbestos with a sealant (like paint) can temporarily keep the asbestos fibers in their original material. As long as the original bond remains in the material, encapsulation may be used. If the material is crumbling and deteriorating, encapsulation can do more harm than good. This is because the sealant pulls down the loosened asbestos material and can allow additional fibers to be released into the air. Encapsulating with a penetrating sealant can also make future removal of the asbestos-containing material more difficult. Since the encapsulant may begin to deteriorate, it must be regularly inspected. >>>
notice the emphasis on TEMPORARY...
if it is indeed asbestos... AND it's wrapped around an AIR DISTRIBUTION system.. then i'd pull the ducts out and replace them if it is possible...
one home inspector says it is..?????
my mom's house had hot water radiator heat.. all of the pipes in the basement were wrapped with the split style linen wrapped ( hey , ok.. it was probably cotton... looked like linen ) pipes
we misted it, took it off , bagged it , and had it legally disposed of .. that was in the early '90's.. regulations and techniques change...
what is required in his jurisdiction may be as simple as what we did..
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
In our area it used to be a common practice to seal duct (heat runs) seams with asbestos tape. Where the boot turned up a lot of guys would wrap the whole thing from the round pipe to the floor. Really sealed well. Good idea then, not now. DanT
I'll check on the ducts Saturday and get back to you. Thanks for all the comments.
Dave,
I've recently installed encapsulation material that has to be the easiest option. Basically, it is a plaster cast fabric material that comes in a large roll, you dip in in water and wrap around the aesbesthos insulation. It makes a mess, but man, it is easy.
And for windows- tough one. I just learned of Lincoln Windows (they came to my office to present their product). Seems like an option to replacing windows:
http://www.lincolnwindows.com
I was not able to get into the house until today, It was not the duct work as I had thought. Instead it is a rigid tube about 4 or 5 inches in diameter that comes up through the top plate of an interior wall about 12 inches, makes a 90 degree trun, runs about 15 feet, makes another 90 and exits through the roof. It seems as though it may have vented the original gas stove. The material is white and has a textured surface almost like burlap cloth. Altogether it probably runs 20 feet. Hate to think what that would cost to have a certified asbestos removal company remove and dispose of the pipe. It really isn't in the way but I would like to do something to isolate it. Incidently, the house is in Clovis, New Mexico, on the eastern side of the state and my daughter plans on keeping the house for some time.
Dave:
so , you think it's an abandoned flue pipe ?
it seems like the choices are:
remove it
or encapsulate it..
it's really your choice....if you can remove it without releasing a bunch of friable fibers that's what i would do...then, it's gone...
i'd make some discrete inquiries about removal and disposal....
one of the above posters had some info on an encapsulation system / product that might bear looking into...
it's a risk / reward choice... you have to evaluate it..
removal.....risk: spreading fibers reward: done
encapsualtion..... risk: partial/temporary success reward: less danger / cost
and then there is still the POSSIBILITY that it isn't asbestos at all
what about the windows ?
i'd still buy the house... and solve the problems
keep us posted
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Your material is made of portland cement and asbestos. It's commonly called by a brand name, Transite. It was used a lot for venting floor furnaces and water heaters, especially. Normally, it is easy and safe to remove because it usually does not break as you take it apart. Use good respirators, bag it in heavy plastic bags, and it will never bother anyone again.
/up the road in Canyon
FHB ran a feature article on replacement windows within the last few months, and it's quite informative.
I've had good luck using sash packs, specifically Caradco/Jeld-Wen "Zap-Packs." If the existing window trim is in good shape, you can upgrade to Low-E sash and airtight tracks for surprisingly little money and labor. (For example, a 3/0 by 3/2 low-E insulated package with the exterior pre-primed costs about $160.)
In most cases, the only thing you have to do to replace the windows is remove the stop molding, yank out the existing windows, install the new tracks, snap the new sash in, and replace the stop. It literally takes longer to dispose of the old window parts than it does to replace the sash. Highly recommended.