Need help please.
Am looking at some vertical and horizontal (slightly sloped…) runs of old cast iron pipe in basement at Mom’s house (about 90 y/o… the house that is). On the underside of the vertical run of the ~3″ diameter horizontal run of piping is what looks to be a lateral seam (?) and along it – there are stalactic-type growths of hardened material is generally, circular patterns. When I noticed it, I reached up to touch it lightly and it is HARD. Kinda like gritty inverted conical peaks hanging down from the underside of the pipe.
Dang. Wish could post a pic but haven’t got the s/w on this work LT I have on this trip with me.
From tracing the lines, it appears this is the waste pipe coming from main bath as it joins up with another (from 2nd bathroom) at a vertical run of CI piping that’s about 6″ in diameter and which ALSO has this weird corrosion biz going on.
What am I seeing? Is this piping corroding from the inside out or what?
Can this be repaired/patched or do all these sections of CI pipe need replacement?
TIA for any help, info and advice!
DUM SPIRO SPERO: “While I breathe I hope”
Replies
got a sawzall with ya...
Lenox makes some really good blades to cut CI...
the white are the cleaning chemicals y'all use fer the last 100 years...
the brown stuff is rusty CI..
dollar to donuts the pipe is rotting out from the inside...
cut it all out .. Ferncos and PVC
or
Vulkem and duct tpe...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"rotting out from the inside"
sigh
my worst fear...confirmed.
oh well - guess can't ask for more than piping to last near as long as this stuff here already has...
THANKS fer your help!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Miz -
That could also be leakage from a bad joint in the line. CI joints used to be packed with oakum then sealed with molten lead.
While you're thinking about failing pipes, do you have any galvanized pipe water lines? Galvanized pipe corrodes from the inside, too. I've ripped out 1/2" pipe that was choked down to 1/4" (or less) channels for the water to flow.
I'll have to relook when I get up there...but it's mostly all CI and some copper and SOME PVC... IIRC!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Yup like merc said it's rotting from the inside.
But I would replace with C I , but that's me.
Do you look to the government for an entitlement, or to GOD for empowerment. BDW
Plumbill,I have always used ABS for DWV. Now I see a lot of pvc .whats with that?
"I have always used ABS for DWV. Now I see a lot of pvc .whats with that?"
Funny, here in MA, most local codes do not allow ABS, only PVC.
A couple of towns allow it, so there is one HD near those that stocks ABS. Otherwise is is generally not for sale, even if you want it.-The poster formerly known as csnow
Mainly I think it's an east west thing.
East coast almost all pvc
west coast still seeing alot of abs
PVC made a big push in the mid 90's on the west that kinda faded out back to abs it went.
PVC is not as noisy as abs, & is slightly more rigid.
We were starting to change to pvc where we would have used abs, but then the inspectors hit us with the no 1 step glue, we had to use purple primer then glue. Well there went our labor savings so we went back to abs.
Do you look to the government for an entitlement, or to GOD for empowerment. BDW
Yeah, if it was my personal house, I'd replace it with CI too....
but it's Mom's and she's 88 now and on dialysis 3X a week, etc etc etc....
AND
the chimney has degraded in a major way and I've no experience in dealing with an item like that especially with the retaining iron scroll rod that's attached to the slate roof that's on this house. (bottom line, got other items to address here too that are gonna take more than a little jingle)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
I just replaced some 90 yo CI pipe, still in great shape, but it didn't go where I needed it to. I wonder if that white stalagtite stuff could be white stalagtite stuff- i.e., hard water deposits of calcium from a slow leak + evaporation. I don't know though. I'd give the pipe some love taps with a screwdriver, just to see if it sounds solid or not. Don't hit it too hard- even when that old CI is in good shape you can shatter it with a framing hammer.
zak
"so it goes"
I gave it some very gentle taps just to get a sense of the relative sound I'd get, on the sections that look like heck...and the other sections that aren't yet looking so bad.
Pretty major difference in how it sounds.
yeeshhhhhhhhhhhhhhDUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Hard to tell since we can't see it; but it could just be 90 years of condensation drips causing those little stalagtites. I have seen that in older houses. Looks a bit like pointy barnacles.
Can you (gently) chip one or two off and get a lab to tell you what they're made of? Don't whack the pipe for real unless you're ready to replace the whole run; as soon as you start vibrating it, all sorts of scale, rust, and crud build-up inside is gonna break loose and cause ya trouble....
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....
The stalactitetype deposits are HARD...and I gently chipped one off with a chisel and hammer. Looks in daylight like red/brown with some very small amts of very white stuff in there too.
Funky stuff.
Currently just gearing to get them replaced.
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
You're on the spot; you're gonna have to make the call to replace it or leave it alone.
Part of the calculation oughta be, 'Is it busted?' as in, 'Does it leak?' You know the old saw, 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it....' Another consideration is that once you touch that stuff, you are pretty much assured of having to replace it all.
I don't believe you'll be able to cut out bad parts without causing scale problems or vibration fractures in the 'good parts', especially at fittings. But if you leave it alone and pray a lot, I can't tell you how much longer it's gonna last before it goes blooey in a big, dramatic way. Can't guess. I've seen 125-y-o CI pipes working fine...and I've seen 'em disintegrate after 75 years.
Nutz. Wish I could see it....
Best advice I could give you is if you replace it and decide to do it with plastic, use ABS. We use PVC here only for the soil lines once they go underground. PVC doesn't have the wall thickness to stand up to the slings and arrows of unprotected exposure. It also seems to degrade faster than ABS from chemical interaction/ultraviolet/ozone/god-knows-what. We bury it or we don't use it.
As Plumbill & others have said, Cast Iron is the best. Damn near 200 years of track record so we know what it's gonna do in pretty much any environment where it's used. But it is much more bucks. You gotta call it whether the house itself is worth plumbing for the next 100 years.
For a lot of modern types of synthetic piping (PEX, Poly-B (!!), ABS, PVC, CPVC), we simply don't know how long the plastic will last before going teats up. Until they've been around long enough to start failing in statistically significant numbers, we are just guessing. Poly B we all know about. And as I indicated above, PVC is starting to tell us: I've seen degradation failures in a number of older places plumbed with PVC DWV about twenty-five or thirty years ago when it was still legal. (I saw another one last week, as a matter of fact.) But (a) I don't know what caused the degradation; and (b) I don't do enough plumbing for my observations to be statistically significant. Consider it anecdotal evidence and use it for what it's worth.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
the dilemma with leaving it alone...is this is a town of about 11K people...
small place
and as past evidence has shown, some of the tradesfolk in these parts aren't above taking advantage of elderly customers who truly have no idea what needs to be done or what it should cost...
so the leave it alone option then implies if it blows out, Mom will be here trying to deal with a plumber (best one we used to use/know, retired and moved away) and she won't have a single clue what he says, does, or about his charges...
soooooooooooooo...more comfortable just addressing the situation and planning the repairs - or more to the point, replacements.DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Couldn't ya go see the remaining local plumber in advance and explain sweetly that if he screws yer ma, he'll have the entire BT Viking Longship up his butt before he can say 'plumber-look'?
Nahhhh, I hear ya. An ounce o' prevention and all that. Dang; this must be my night for trotting out old saws. (Now where's that Disston...?)
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
BT VIKING LONGSHIP!?!!?
ROAR!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
You knew about the BT Viking Longship! CapnMac invented it: he's the Captain,
View Image
and you're the ship's figurehead.
View Image
Oreo is Snert.
View Image
(I guess that makes me Lucky Eddie....)
View Image
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
Edited 4/28/2006 6:57 pm ET by Dinosaur
LOL!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
As another way of looking at the problem, assuming you won't be covering the pipe (so not making it any harder to replace down the road), if the plumbing is working and not leaking, maybe leave it be?
Could last another 90 yrs. (or could last another week) ;-).
If you're going to be covering it, just replace it now while you still can. Likely already got the moneys worth out of that old pipe. ;-)
"Let's get crack-a-lackin" --- Adam Carolla
Not sure about covering the pipes at all.
They're exposed and readily accessible as they come out the basement concrete floor, do a verticle run with about a 5" OD then EL, then go thru 2 "y"s and branch to additional ELs and then vertically up thru the first floor rafters to the upstairs bathrooms...
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
"3" diameter horizontal run of piping is what looks to be a lateral seam (?) and along it - there are stalactic-type growths of hardened material is generally, circular patterns. "
Could be a leak upstream that chooses to drip here, forming stalagtites, or could just be 90 years of condensation. Sometimes a roof leak around the vent will cause water to run down the outside of the pipe until it finds a horizontal to drip off of.
Horizontal lines do wear out first. Vertical drops will last forever and a day.
Flood the drain wit as much water as you can, and see if you can observe the problem in action.
"Horizontal lines do wear out first. Vertical drops will last forever and a day."Can I get a written guarantee on that.Worked on a house that had newer ABS in the basement and the basin and kitchen sink had been converted to a S trap into the ABS.For several reasons need to change the connections back into the wall and tap in a vent higher up for a washer pump.Opened the wall up and found that the bottom 18" of the CI drain was basically a pile of rust.When they replaced the basement part of the CI they the end when from 3" to 1.5" and there was a piece of pipe that was pushed through the rust so that the old stack vented the basement ABS.Then they had put a rubber coupling over the end of the ABS elbow and the bottom of the CI so you could not see what was inside.
Did I mention that on the verticle drops, the major one - the 5" OD one that goes from under the floor joists to the basement floor, there are additional stalagmites that ALMOST look like rusty colored gobs of chewed gum! and from those "deposit" points, there's a stain line vertically downward... So I now know that not just the horizontal but the vertical section too, need work (i.e. replacement)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Tried flooding the drain and observing - couldn't see anything happening.
Not a roof issue since these are in the basement of a 2 story house with a full basement.
REALLY tending to believe that age, and various "cleaners" used in baths over the years, have simply taken their toll on these puppies...
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
"What kinda blade would you use in a Sawzall, to cut these CI pipes with?"
I think it is easier (and cheaper in terms of blades) to use an angle grinder with a cutting wheel. You do not actually have to cut it through- just a good score, then whack apart with chisel.
You can also cut CI pretty clean with just a chisel. Score around the circumfrence, them whack it apart. I think the angle grinder for the score is easier though.
If you do not need a clean break, go at it with a 3-4 pound hammer. Sometimes you need a second hammer to backup the blow if their is not much support, or you can strike with both hammers opposing at once (sounds funny, but works really well!).
Wear safety goggles and stay clear of heavy falling chunks. The shards are sharp.
-The poster formerly known as csnow
Tks!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Well I have an email from my middle bro who lives in WI...saying "I'll take care of it - you head on back to AR; you've done enough at Mom's already these past 3 weeks..."
So it seems I won't get my first hand chance to tackle CI piping...which I was kinda looking forward to since my plumbing experiences to date have remained solely in the replace and install fixtures arena.
Anyway, I've now copied this whole thread and sent it to him so please y'all know, I really appreciate all the feedback and advice and info!!!!!!!!!!! (Hope brother dear will pay heed to it.)
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
My advice is don't use blade in a sawzall if you can avoid it. Try a cut-off wheel in a grinder. There's a (non-negligable) risk of igniting sewer gasses, but after knocking a vent pipe free in my kitchen but cutting out a cast iron pipe in my basement, it's a risk I'd be willing to take. Looks like I'm going to get to rip open that wall. Joy oh joy.
Looks like I'm going to get to rip open that wall. Joy oh joy.
Well - good luck with that! (better YOU than me! hee hee)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
UPDATE:
Well back on 29April06 I had written:
Well I have an email from my middle bro who lives in WI...saying "I'll take care of it - you head on back to AR; you've done enough at Mom's already these past 3 weeks..."
So it seems I won't get my first hand chance to tackle CI piping...which I was kinda looking forward to since my plumbing experiences to date have remained solely in the replace and install fixtures arena.
Only to now find that middle brother dear...never got there...and likely WON'T as he's now got some issues on his own plate serving as latest reason he cannot fulfill a prior commitment (this happens a LOT with this particular bro...GRRRRRRRR!!!). Anyway - the attached are pics - VARIOUS SIZES due to some here have broadband, and some on dial up... ALL the pics were taken on 25 April 2006 and current situation is NOTHING has been done to them at all.
Mom informs a neighbor came and looked at them and said "leave them be"! Middle brother saw them and when determined he wouldn't get there to deal with them, told Mom on phone "they'll be fine..." (sentiment that suits him, eh?)
Please - would y'all look at these and give your candid reassessment of repair/replace, etc? I have to travel to Mom's in August (soon!) so really appreciate y'all ck'g these photos out. (I'll post them on successive post to this thread so as not to have a truncated post.)
TIA,
Clara
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Here's batch one of the pics; watch which size you open!
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Batch 2 of photos; please note that picture 8 is posted in 2 sizes with the resized jpg attempting to show major concern area...DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
does this segment have galv pipe in it or does it just look that way 'cause of tke lighting..
View ImageLife is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"does this segment have galv pipe in it or does it just look that way 'cause of tke lighting.."Well it does unless they make threaded CI pipe.But I see another galvanized pipe.The copper line on the right looks like it terminates into a galvy rizer. And NO DIELECTRIC fitting. Does not look good. Actually it does look good on the outside, but hate to see what it looks like on the inside.
thought the same...
wondered too if somebody had subbed a piece of straight galv for CI...
WTB that's toast too..
ya feeling better....Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
My very limited experience with CI indicates that it is common to to galanized pipe for drain line; IE 1.5 and 2". Don't even know if CI was made in those sizes.And that is a smaller pipe.
think 2" is as small as I ever saw... been a while since I've played wth it...
if the exposed horz is in that condition... and she does get a decent verticle stub to work back from... there is the in ground horrizontal run out to the street to think about...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
My experience taking old cast iron out of older homes is to use the cutter if the cast iron is solid enough, if not then use the 4 and 1/2 inch grinder. You will be able to tell by tapping on it with a hammer if it is solid enough for the cutter. If you make a mistake and use the cutter on a weak section you'll know quickly enough - - it will crush the pipe and break it into pieces and flakes. I used a friend's 7 inch grinder on the last job and it went faster, so much so that I will buy my own for the next job. In my experience a sawsall takes a very long time. Use ear and eye protection and gloves.
okay...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Tks BilWil; since I have NO EXPERIENCE with replacing plumbing ppg, I'm gonna be plunging into the abyss on (gulp) courage and info gleaned from books and all the great advice from here! Tks for piping in...<g>DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
ALL:
Well I left for WI 3 weeks ago to do an urgent "must install porch railings" task at my mom's. SHortly after arrival, discerned the wrought iron stair railings were in SHID shape, the structural columns holding up the front 2nd story portion of the house were rotted out...and a host of other dilemmas with the porch itself.
SO
although I'd brought all the info from this thread, and my new Bosch Rt angle grinder, etc etc etc, I called old H.S. classmates still in the area, talked to neighbor, got aline on a plumber...and got him to do the job the same week I was their rehabbing the porch.
Here's pics of the Ci ppg removed and in the backyard lawn...and of the new PVC ppg.
Wanted to let y'all know how this issue concluded and say thanks again to ALL who'd so kindly shown the wonderful nature of this Forum, and helped.
Clara
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
yum.... more sausages with your eggs ?
View ImageMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Yeah, was about as appetizing as this was:
View ImageDUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
I'll let y'all know what the inside looks like once I find out myself. (wouldn't want y'all to be left in suspense...<g>)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
YUP, you're right - that IS a section of galvy pipe...
sighDUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
these pics look so much like chemical corrosion at work here...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
and about 95 years of age...?!?DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Family gots to love em, anyways cut the cast out with band cutter(usually a rental item like a chain that rachets around pipe and pressure snaps or ie: cuts cast) leave as much pipe as possible sticking out of fittings so that you can install fernco bands. replace with pvc pipe. From the pics it looks like a easy fix, just your time.
Load all those new tools you have been getting in that new truck and you will do just fine, bring some banding strap with ya to support pipe and fittings as you tear out and replace.
and when you're done with that ... go play 9.. you deserve itMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Gotta deal with her porch's lack of a railing issue while up there too. Am currently trying to go thru files/CDs looking if have any pics of her porch to show you guys and get some advice for pre-planning purposes...
I DO however, see some R&R being in order after get these next batch of issues at her place...dealt with, or at least: progressed! LOL!
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
So that's a vote for "replace"! (I still don't know how they can look so bad - in my eyes - and others say leave them be...which is why I posted the pics.)
Anyway - do ya think I should use this to justify adding a band cutter to my collection? ;-)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
"Anyway - do ya think I should use this to justify adding a band cutter to my collection? "No, that is a rental item for sure unless you want to be come a plumber. And even then, in many places it would still be used infrequently.I can't tell fromt he pcitures, but that last one, of the what appears to be the main stack, does not look too back except for that one glob on the back side and that might be from "stuff" running down the outside.But the one horizontal looks bad. In fack it looks like there is a pin hole all the way through it in one spot. That might fall apart from just the weight of the cutter.Also in the background there is plastic plug. Might be in a drum trap. But I see some corrosion around that area.
Hey Bill -
I was only kidding about buying the band cutter - which is why I posted the " ;-)" at the end of that sentence...
But hey! Tks for telling me you think the pipes are due for replacement too. AND yup - that sure looks like a pinhole in that one jpg, doesn't it? (but other than stalactite type deposits, nothing landing on the basement floor beneath - at least, not back in April when I took those photos)
Starting a list with: What all supplies and tools will I need?
- hanger straps
- replacement pvc
- rental band cutter
- AND AND??? (I'm heading back to beginning of this thread to pick up that additional info again)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
A saw to cut the PVC is about all yoiu need.Fits, fermco's, cement, etc you can get most anyplace as needed.Wait untill you hear from someone with more expertise them me, but I think that with some LIGHT tapping with a hammer you can tell more about which pipes are good and which are bad by the sound.
I'm going to throw a little rain on this parade. I think if you try and use snap cutters on those pipes, you are going to crush, not cut them. Then you have to adapt to the hub. They look rotten from here.
Whoever said cast was forever?
Personally, I would use a side grinder with a cutting wheel.
If you want a temp fix, JBWeld can fill pinholes and cracks and lasts a long time.
Not that I've ever done that. :)
Edited 7/30/2006 11:48 pm ET by rich1
A 4.5" Bosch right angle grinder do? (what type wheel/blade would ya recommend if I go that route? anything in particular?)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Just ask for a zipcut wheel. Safety glasses and a face shield are a good idea. The smell can be interesting.
Tks Rich; and I'll be sure to pack the safety gear. (good reminder!)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
I just happened to see those pictures, don't have time to look at all the posts, and I'm wondering if you have checked for a current ...I I have worked on a couple of places were some idiots grounded a circuit somewhere upstream to the water or waste lines...ouch! OWW! my wife just said get off breaktime and get back to work....bye...good luck!
Ck'd for a current? Nope...(not yet).
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
welding supply house will have what ya need....
http://www.abrasives4sale.com/slice-it.htm
http://www.amflexabrasives.com/shop/customer/home.php?cat=319
10 Pack of 5-5246 4.5 IN.X1/8 CUT OFF WHEEL
$20.801 Used & new from $20.80
In StockLife is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
one more..
sawzall this time..
http://www.lenoxsaw.com/gritrecp.htmLife is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
A million thanks Marty!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
bookmarked! (tks)DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Unless you got 26" pythons for arms, you're going to want to rent a ratchet style cutter verses a regular snap cutter.
What the difference?The ones that I have rented have the "chain" with roller cutter. You put that around the pipe and lock it in place.Then take a wrench and start tighten and moving the handle back and forth a little and then repeating.
Standard snap verses ratchet here are some pics.
these two are ratchet great for pipe that is in place.
View ImageView Image
& here is a standard snap cutter that uses straight pressure great for pipe on ground , but can be a bear when doing a pipe that is vertical.
View Image
Thanks.The one that used was like the first picture, except the handle was straight.
Yeah the straight handle was the older version --- I have both.
That new "U" shaped handle helps carrying it around
Pictures! I love pictures... especially when y'all start talking about something I don't own and haven't used before.
As we say here in the south: BLESS YOUR HEART for those pics!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
As others have posted it's a rental item, go for the rachet type that was mentioned in previous posts. I,am sure somebody will be along to tell you to cut it with sawall, go with the band cutter faster and alot cleaner, plus it won't vibrate the heck out the pipe that you are saving, which would lossen all the rust and scale existing inside the pipe to cause further problems down the road.
The vertical stack looks like some damage but not as bad as horiz. runs. A cheap clean and dirty solution for this one could be cutting a fernco on one side and wrapping around damage area and tighten the beejesues out of it with the clamps. You can buy ferncos in various sizes, your call. A little dish soap will help in getting fernco bands on pipe, and leave yourself a little slack between cast and plastic and let the fernco bridge the gap.
I have in the past put the band cutter on and it veritually crushed the pipe as soon as I applied pressure. If you get a real raged edge use a crescent wrench to nip the edges clean, cast will snap off pretty easy using this techinque. Tighten up the jaws of wrench for it will slide over end of pipe and nip little pieces as you go around pipe. Doesn't have to be perfect just close.
vote for replacement... a lot of that CI is toast...
if ya use a cast cutter ya may crush or break the pipe before it cuts like it's suppose to... fractures may travel into places you may not want to go... you could get lucky too... WTB that won't be the case...
sawzall or a rt angle grinder to cut where you WANT to stop or begin with a clean cut... use both or at least have the choice for both / either when ya start...
small sledge to bust out the rest of the snot...
Fernco CI/PVC connectors for the change over...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
I'm old enough to work with cast iron pipe, I even learned how to do Lead and Oakum Joints ('m running out of old timers to look up to).
Cast iron pipes would start rusting on the edges as soon as you cut them. The black paint was all that kept it from rusting away. Sand holes was common and was the reason why Plumbers had to have a minimum test of 10 ' of water. Tar was used all the time to patch holes in them.
Hey "old timer"! nice to see somebody who remembers working with this stuff.
What kinda blade would you use in a Sawzall, to cut these CI pipes with?DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
rent a band cutter for CI, looks like a bike chain that wraps around pipe. It is a handtool not electric. If the pipe is real bad chances are it will just crush it. Don't fret that if it happens. Take it back to where it is solid. If you get some jagged edges which is highly possible. use the jaws of a crescent wrench to nib off pieces, (take little bites) to get fairly uniform end.
Install a fernco band, CI to plastic and away you go.
Sawall ain't going to cut CI. Rental is approx. $15-20
Sure, a sawzall will cut CI.
hmmm?
Tks Danusan - sounds like good advice to me!DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
? My sawzall takes offense- it's cut many a CI pipe before. I use a boring old milwaukee or lennox blade for steel, ~18tpi if I remember right.
Personally, I would cut it off as near to the next good hub as possible, chip out the stuff left in the hub and remove the oakum and lead, then put ABS in with a donut gasket. Less moving parts than a fernco, so that's what I prefer. Those donuts are hell to get in though- that junction is tight!zak
"so it goes"
As sungod said, CI is Cast Iron, key word "cast" pin holes in the casts can cause minute leaks, barely noticable, they evaporate quickly but over time can cause you stalactites, the stalactites almost seal the pin hole so no problem. If the area will stay open, leave it alone, if you're going to cover it maybe think about replacement.
I hear ya. But with Mom's age and health issues...we're (me and siblings) collectively both maintaining and - getting this house ready for a subsequent owner...and the inverterate (sp?) House Inspector that prospective buyers use to make their purchase decisions.
DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"
Yeah, I've seen this sort of thing many times on old CI. No obvious connection to the overall condition of the pipe.
To check the pipe condition, tap the bottom 1/4 of the pipe at various places. If it sounds like you're tapping a soda cracker then the pipe's gone. If you're really daring, use an ice pick and see if you can puncture it in spots (but have a "bandage" patch ready). If you can't puncture with an ice pick then it's probably good for another 5-10 years at least.
That said, if this is original pipe, it's pretty well past it's "design life".
I didn't know how to describe the sound I got when tapping on this piping...til I read your post.
I'd be really depressed now if I werent' already mentally prepped with the believe they gotta be replaced...
And BTW, the house was built in 1915 and yes, it's the original piping.DUM SPIRO SPERO: "While I breathe I hope"