I just sat here and read all 100+ comments on the framing with screws post and thought why doesn’t someone with some extra money and time (neither of which I have, hint to FHB editors) perform an experiment to see which screw indeed would support more, SR or cabinet screw. Take two identical wall cabinets, hang them with 4 screws each in the same pattern, and load them up, say in 10 lb. increments with free weights, and see what fails first. My guess would be that the cabinets would fall apart well before the screws broke.
Replies
Derr82
Crucifix and silver bullets.
Get behind me satan.
You should be banned for life for suggesting that the cabinet would fall apart before a sheetrock screw would fail. The horror of it all.
If your grandafatner heard you you speak like that.
You're probably right. LOL
Rich
Hehe. He probably is.How's life treating you, Cargin?http://truenorthcarpentry.net
True
Life has been pretty good. Very busy year with work. Most of the work I have lined up is outside work and that can shut down at any moment. Today's high is supposed to be around 75 though.
It would be good to line up some inside work about now. Just trust in the Lord's provision and get back to work.
We made time this fall to go fishing once (and hope to again) and a trip to South Dakota for pheasant hunting. That was good.
Rich
Rich, glad to hear you are busy.Not to derail the thread too much, but we moved from northern Michigan to Colorado Springs in August. 1450 miles! We are just starting to recover a little. It took two full months to get licensed here in El Paso county (no easy task: 6 references, proof of insurance, a background check, a test, a grilling before the building dept. board, and a final approval by another board!) and I'm finally getting a few leads here and there.Take care, TNhttp://truenorthcarpentry.net
Edited 11/3/2008 8:19 pm by True North
True
We will have to call you True West from now on.
I bet Colorado Springs is a beautiful location. I was there 30 some years ago. I have heard only good thing about it.
I will pray for good jobs for you out there.
Rich
Thanks for the prayers Rich, I do need them.Colorado Springs is very beautiful, albeit a bit sprawling. The people are very friendly as well. It took me aback for the first few weeks!We drove through Iowa on the way here and I was amazed at the beauty. I guess I kind of thought Iowa was just... plain and flat, or something.I hope you get that inside work for when the weather gets colder.http://www.truenorthcarpentry.net
True
Why did you move to CO? Do you know people there?
Was there code enforcement and licensing in the UP where you were before?
Or is this a new experience?
We don't have code enforcement in my town yet. Contractors are registered with the state for $25/year. Just send in the money and you are good to go. Plus insurance.
Rich
Hey Rich,We moved because we just weren't surviving in Michigan anymore. The winters scare me to death; if you're not booked till spring by November, you will literally not get one call till April. Things just shut down after Thanksgiving.We didn't know anyone here. We traveled out here in early spring, and decided to pack up and move without having a place lined up or anything. We stayed in a hotel for a week and frantically searched for housing till we found something. It's been a real test of faith.Yes, there is licensing in MI, but it's pretty much a "go and take the test" kind of thing, and only costs about $65 every two years. The test is more of a tricky question thing than something to actually test your knowledge. People don't take the licensing seriously at all, so there are unlicensed tradesmen everywhere.I built a deck in Torrington, Wyoming (about 250 mile north, and only 7 or 8 miles from Nebraska) for a friend of a friend last month. There was no code, no permits, and no inspectors. It was kind of a funny feeling to just START, with no red tape to go through.You can see a few pictures of the deck on my website. I need to load pictures of the finished product still. The deck is made of redwood. I had no idea that wood is so expensive. It costs as much as pre-finished oak flooring!I stayed with the people I was building the deck for. It was a neat experience. I felt like one of the traveling carpenters of old. It was killing me to be away from my family for so long. Gotta have that time with my boys (9 and 3)!http://www.truenorthcarpentry.net
Edited 11/3/2008 11:08 pm by True North
People here don't believe in experiments, even if they could replicate the experiment themselves.
http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=59345.1
Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
I don't feel it's healthy to keep your faults bottled up inside me.
Yeah, Paul did some pretty good experiments with screws vs nails, using a well-designed DIY rig that would have been easy to duplicate. Proved that screws are much superior to nails in holding strength in virtually all configurations. But no one believed him.It would be a good thing for a university to undertake, using ME/CE lab equipment that can do both static and dynamic load testing. The one thing that's hard to do with a DIY rig is reproducible dynamic testing.
Conscience is the still, small voice which tells a candidate that what he is doing is likely to lose him votes. --Anonymous
I didn't need to replicate it because I have a tome that proves the relative strength of nails over screws.. In addition the book sold by Fine Home Building called Framing Roofs has it pretty clearly defined right on page 129. A nailed rafter failed at 208 pounds but a single lag screw held to 2, 783 pounds (even if improperly installed) If you use multiple nails and a Simpson H7 connectors you finnally approach the same strength 2.726 pounds before failure..
There is plenty of proof if people will do even the most causual searching but to a carpenter who is used to using a hammer, screws are foriegn substances and he get's confused..
Why should we let facts get in the way of any of this?
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"A stripe is just as real as a dadgummed flower."
Gene Davis 1920-1985