“I wouldn’t have hired you guys If I knew that you drove new trucks” was the comment a customer made to me. What gives? We are doing the work for a fair price and the customer is very pleased…my company likes to look professional…
Whats wrong with looking good? Any one else had similar comments?
At my last employer one very important customer thought that we were unprofessional because we drove older vehicles that were paid off.
What gives? Has anyone else had similar comments?
Chris
Replies
I'm an attorney who drives a 10 year old Ford Explorer. I get comments from clients that they wouldn't have hired ME if they knew I drove such an old car.
Can't win!
I'm an attorney who drives a 10 year old Ford Explorer.>>>>>
I knew some guys that were attorneys... and I wouldn't work for them..lol. Alfred E. Newman for president (we'd be better off)
I had a potential client say he didn't think he could afford me since I drove a new truck. I told him he probably couldn't.
His tone told me I was wasting my time so I told him I wasn't interested and drove off in my 3 year old '98 F-150.
A clear case of Dammed if you do, and dammed if you don't.
Consider the client an errant data point. Overall, professionalism will feed you more, better, and more frequently. As the guy said, you can't please them all.
OTH, I get tired of HOs that resent me trying to make a decent living. As though I'm gonna do their work for peanuts, or even free.
Sorry for hi-jack rant.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
Given the skill required to do good work and the liability of any kind of construction...we probably should charge H.O.'s more, not less...
Chris
you can't please every aszhole out there.
I really wouldn't sweat it
On the flip side I guess we could tell a prospective client that, " From the Looks of your old house I don't think you can afford me."
Edited 9/21/2006 5:12 pm by jagwah
a ragged truck.. poor image...
a new or newer truck with 20K in glitter says ya like to live large, have a lot of disposable income or yur over extended and need to (over) charge to maintain that life style or yur a hair breath's away from folding...
or..
practicale yur not...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Never judge a book by it's cover. What counts is the work.
I showed up today in my other car to paint -
(It has a prancing horse emblem on the nose)
View Image
Forrest - lots of overhead
You need ladder racks on the top, chrome of course!
Prancing horse...you mean as in a Tennessee Walker?
Only if it was from Modena!
Forrest
Everybody's got an attitude.
Your own is the only one that counts.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd." Voltaire
i had a customer ask about some extra work when I finshed a job . I gave her a fair quote and she came back with some other guy quoted her about half that so, call him I said I tried and his phones been disconnected ,she says hmmm.. maybe he wasnt charging enough to make a living I let it drop there .
bah. they just want to nickle and dime anyone, anyhow. You're right. Better to look professional than like a toothless hack. Theres nothing wrong at all with a dated vehicle, but when its dented, rusted, and held together with duct tape and fencing wire, one needs to think about the image projected.
Real trucks dont have sparkplugs
I am self conscious about our old trucks a lot and I am sure that customers make a judgement call based on that, oh well. Nothing I can do about it.
I had a woman who we worked for insist that we 'would do good to get a loan to buy new trucks'. Nope, not interested.
I did buy a '79 250 that was painted our company colors and had it lettered up, people don't seem to mind that.
Like others said here, you can't please 'em all. I think a lot of people choose us based on our old trucks because they think we're struggling and will work at a starvation rate. They get a kick in the pants when I present knowledgeably and realistically and present a quote that represents same. They think you are desperate? Prove them otherwise in what you know and how you present yourself.
If a new truck is the only way they make their determination, then consider yourself lucky you didn't get them.
raised hand & guilty
I've been put off by a guy drive'n up in a new hummer with 24" wheels to give me a quote...
I've never been put off but a clean work truck no matter how old or new... but something impressive about a 10yo truck that looks new or very well cared for... just says something...
junky anything puts me off
but... in my youth 21 or near there i happen to have done well in the produce business and owned a few bars.... was working 10-14hr days 7 days a week... and got a heck of a deal on a 930 turbo (was european and factory twin turbo).... for some reason it made me "credible" and "dateable" chicks that wouldn't look twice when i was in my truck would pull me over at 2am to "talk" if i was in the 930... i was always aware that it was the car that got em... but my charm that kept em :) about the same thing when i'm out on one of my bikes... one kinda chick will speak if i'm on the harley... and another if i'm on the zx7... my wife sees the humor in it so i'm cool...
people all people do make an instant judgement at first sight.... some you have to fight some you have to embrace...
p
P
I've been put off by a guy drive'n up in a new hummer with 24" wheels to give me a quote...
I had a guy stop by my house about a month ago driving just that rig, tried to sell me a new driveway coating, his talk was about as slick as his ride!
Doug
so how long of a contract did you sign with him *G*
It's just me but I make snap decisions all the time. Every time I see Hummer anything, my first thought is the driver's got a screw loose somewhere. Same goes for trucks so far off the ground you need a ladder take stuff out of the bed.
I agree--I might not hire the hummer driver not because he's flush, but because he must be an idiot. who wants to drive a hummer? in the end, it can work both ways: old truck, low fees; new truck, must be taking care of the customers. whichever, how's the work look? drive a ferrari, I don't care. just do a good job.
I HIRED A DRYWALL FINISHER FOR MY BASEMENT. ASKED HIM WHAT THE PRICE WOULD BE FOR A GREEN CASH PAYMENT WHEN HE WAS DONE. AGREED AND HE DID A FINE JOB. DROVE A 23 YR OLD RED RUSTY DENTED BALD TIRE PICKUP. YOUNG MAN JUST TRYING TO GET BY. WHEN FINISHED, HE ASKED IF HE COULD MEET ME THAT NIGHT AND GET PAID. NO PROBLEM. HE DROVE UP IN A BRAND NEW METALLIC BLUE CHROME WHEEL TRICKED OUT PICK UP !!! SMART MAN
so you're advocating under-cutting the price because you pay with cash and assume or suggest he's not paying taxes on it?
Nice
>ASKED HIM WHAT THE PRICE WOULD BE FOR A GREEN CASH PAYMENT WHEN HE WAS DONE.Why would a price be different for cash than check?
Your question is rhetorical... right?
It's bait. :)
it worked...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!<!----><!---->
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
NO PAPER TRAIL AT ALL!!!
Why wouldn't you want a paper trail? What difference does it make?
Some people do not like to pay taxes to certain other people !!
So,BTW, is your caps key stuck? Maybe you need a new ketboard.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
>>>>>Maybe you need a new ketboard.matbe tou need a new ketboard too.sorrt, couldn't resist.
"Let's go to Memphis in the meantime, baby" - John Hiatt.
http://grantlogan.net/
My "ketboard" (sp?) is fine..... I have a vision problem, it helps me and I am sorry if it hurts your eyes..... Either way, the written word and the message is still the same
You can change the screen size in a number of ways to help the reading and typing.
Assuming you have Windows XP:
Click on Start, All Programs, Accessories, and then Accessibility for some options.
Sorry then about the all caps comment, but if your written word and message are as implied that the lack of a writtn record makes it easier to cheat and not pay taxes that are due. the man you are dealing with is a cheat, and a crook, and you can expct that he will not hesitate to cheat you any more than he will hesitate to cheat the government. Do busainess with those who are of like mind as yourself....honest to honest, cheaters to cheats
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I agree. if I know you cheat on your taxes, who's to say you won't try and cheat me too? heck, the i.r.s. has an enforcement arm. all I can do is make a phone call.
why is it when someone suggests paying in green money, people automatically assume something sinister? the dollar bill is the currency of commerce established by the we the people, and is legal tender. checks and credit cards are convenient at times, but we are not obligated to use them.
because most of the time they say so. something with a grin, like, "tryin' to keep uncle sam off my back." or just a some dissembling, etc.other than that, I know few people that want to be paid in cash because not too many people want to walk around with several thousand dollars in hard currency.I don't like paying in cash unless I get a receipt and they're usually reluctant to provide those for the same reason they want the cash to begin with.but otherwise, yeah, if you'd prefer cash I've got no problem with running to the bank the day before.
Did you notice he didn't only say he was paying in cash, but that he expected a discount for doing so, specificly because there was no paper trail. That lack of a paper trail is only beneficial when there is intent to hide the transaction on the part of both parties. That implies a conspiracy to defraud the govt of taxes.That's how I follow it anyway. i've beeen paid in cash too, and I record it like any other transaction and pay the proper amt on up line.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
"That implies a conspiracy to defraud the govt of taxes."<best Cpt. Renault / Casablanca voice>
I am shocked... shocked! to discover there is a grey economy happening here!
The levity is great, but what cheats the govt cheats all of us.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
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But they bought a $4000 bath tub. my tub was $185 and I get wet just as good. ~Brownbagg '06
I had a Woodstock soapstone woodstove installed couple of weeks ago. I didn't have the time to take off from work, but now I can check off that project for this year.
They showed up in box truck with a company logo on the side all setup to do the job clean and efficiently. They were dressed in matching Carhart jeans and logo t-shirts and they were all business.
Right above where I signed to accept the quote were these words "Ask me how to save 5% on your installation". So I asked and they told me. Pay in cash and we'll take off 5%. So I asked why and they told me. People bounce checks and it take time to do collections. They are a small business and didn't want to offer credit yet because of associated costs. Whether that cash went to the bank or into their pockets is not my concern. From all that I observed it probably went to the bank.
Mark from Boring,ORAnything I put my mind to, I can do..... given time, money, etc....
Just had a guy who's done work for me say a huge draw on a new house just bounced and had the ripple effect of causing several overdrafts. Maybe he'll require cash in the future! Come to think of it, last time he did offer me a different price for all cash, but it was clear that his intentions were to avoid taxes, and not a bounced check from me. I declined and paid by check. I don't like that he intended to avoid taxes, and I don't suffer cheaters easily, but he's always treated me well otherwise.
Good for you. it pizzes me off when people are willing to cheat uncle sam to save a buck. it just cheats all of us who do pay their fare share
then theres plenty of good reasons to keep your business above board that success and experience will reinforce
to avoid writing a book on the subject, look at it from the clients perspective. cross the line and you look like a fly-by-nighter and you cant expect to charge full rate.
as long as...
when you find a $20 bill you make note of it and claim it as income
when you sell anything you have used... you either collect or pay sales tax on it
when someone tips you for a job well done... you report that $100 bill that was slipped to you
just make'n the point that there is alot of grey area in CASH... I have no problem offer'n it or pay'n it if asked... i still handle my records the same and keep track of it... I'm not upset or eager to judge why someone wants/prefers cash... it is the only legal tender and by law people have a right to demand it as payment... just as no one can refuse it for payment... BTW if you refuse cash payment you might have a hard time getting paid after.... you can refuse to take someones check or credit card but in the USA you can not refuse CASH... that's the law....
very rare do i worry what others do in their personal life... I know you can argue that people not pay'n taxes does affect me... but it's just not one of those things that gets my shorts in a wad... with 20 million mexicans in the US work'n for cash I won't be the one worry'n about a guy working and just getting by who likes cash... MY guess is most that partake wouldn't be pay'n much anyway...
I like many here.... feel at times like i pay more than my share... but i sleep well
p
If I sell something I have used I already paid sales tax on it when I bought it. its up to the next guy to pay his share.
theres too much talk of offering a discount for cash on this sight. we all know whats going on here.
I've been paid in cash and sometimes I get checks written to me personally. It all gets reported as income. theres no advantage in not reporting it
" theres no advantage in not reporting it"absolutely true. I just had a conversation with a banker about that. People trying to get loans always claiming more income to him than they can verify on their 1040
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
some guys just dont realize what impact their business practices have on potential clients. I dont want to do business with a cheat and I'm sure there's plenty more people who feel the same way.
same thing goes for the way some guys pay their help. paying in cash tells me one thing, those employees are not properly insured. where's the advantage there? they could withhold taxes, pay insurances and deduct the whole thing.
Amen to that!
I don't take to cheaters either. A lot depends on how the contractor presents himself. Has he invested in himself in the way of paperwork, logos, business name, equipment, vehicles, etc. ? These things say that the contractor intends to be around longer the his current job.
Anything I put my mind to, I can do..... given time, money, etc....
How do you like that stove? I've got their literature, but haven't been able to pull the trigger due to the price of them things.
jt8
"Success is not the key to happiness. Happiness is the key to success." --Albert Schweitzer
We've had a soapstone for a few years and the wife just loves it . Am thinking of buying another for a master bedroom remoldel if I have the bucks left.
The stove is not only a great piece furniture in the soapstone but it also heats very well. The soapstone releases heat over a much longer time than cast iron or steel.
Anything I put my mind to, I can do..... given time, money, etc....
Yeah, I'm sold on 'em, just need to find the $$ in the budget (it ain't there). They're usually a couple hundred $ cheaper if you buy them in the off season.
Looks like you got the big-daddy. Isn't that the Fireview...Fireside...something like that? That sucker will do a whole house. I was just looking at the Keystone.
Bet the dog likes that woodstove too!
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jt8
"Success is not the key to happiness. Happiness is the key to success." --Albert Schweitzer
Edited 9/25/2006 11:53 am by JohnT8
I used to sell and install Woodstock Soapstone stoves. That retaining heat after the fire is out jive is deceptive. They take an equal amount of time on the front end before they start putting out heat. There's only so many btu's available. They are nice stoves, but once you start burning them, they'll never be as pretty as the day you get them with out massive amounts of time dusting, cleaning glass, and repainting.
"Let's go to Memphis in the meantime, baby" - John Hiatt.
http://grantlogan.net/
When people go shopping, they go to nice, shiny, extravagant stores, expecting to pay more and get quality. They also go to rundown old hardware stores and Goodwill. In these cases, one doesn't think about the owners, just the product.
I think when someone comes to their house it gets more personal and they may resent a vehicle driven by a person they think they could be.
They know mall workers don't make much money. If they could see the wealth of the people who actually own the malls, they might feel the same way they do about the contractor driving the shiny new dually.
Sometimes I think it would be nice to have a shiny new truck, but it is also nice to own the one I have.
Now tools is another story. If I see a contractor with a set of beatup tools, I think it affects quality. You know what I mean. I am not talking about wear and tear, but REALLY beat up tools, cords, truck, clothes, etc. In some cases it could just mean hard times or divorce or illness, but I tend to be suspicious if it looks like all the stuff was bought at a pawn shop.
That makes no sense. I see a new, clean, neat truck and I think that this is a professional that can pay his bills.
...that's not a mistake, it's rustic
I"m not sure of the author, but the proverb is
"Never buy anything from a salesman who is better dressed than you are, or take legal advice from someone who isn't"
I once had a client blow his stack because I bought a new truck towards the end of his job. He assumed that I had overcharged him enough to afford it [ despite being low bidder]. Explaining to him that I had saved for two years to afford the downpayment did nothing to calm him.
Yeesh. I'd say that's a sign to find a new client. One that's more interested in your work than your vehicle.
I once had a woman ask why my tools looked so new. truth is I just bought a new chop saw and drill set 'cause the old ones burned up. instead I told her that hers was my first job, waited for the silence, then I said just kidding, recently upgraded some old tools is all. Never had a new vehicle but like to keep the older work trucks and vans in decent order. I think people want to see you drive something reliable at the very least and having something clean and organized is a sign of caring .
"it aint the work I mind,
It's the feeling of falling further behind."
Bozini Latini
I moved to an upscale n/hood and bought a 'new' van (2006, but 11k on the clock) 'cuz I didn't fancy my 20 yo patchy window van sticking out like the proverbial. It feels damn good to have a new vehicle, and I spent a few days fitting out the inside. That gets some attention, too. I guess that where I used to live it was only retired folk could afford new vehicles. Oh, and plumbers (we know how much they charge). But I did it for me as much as anything - I feel good in it. And if I feel good I shall attract clients that respect me as much as I do.
The downside is I daren't kick the doors shut, slop paint inside it, or drop bathtubs on top of it.
All the best...
To those who know - this may be obvious. To those who don't - I hope I've helped.
If the customer really is pleased, I would chalk it up to a guy with poor interpersonal skills making what he thinks is a joke. Suppose I go to my mechanic, and he quotes me $900 to fix my car. I respond, "Oh, so youve got another boat payment coming up?" Should he be offended? Probably not, I was just kidding.
On the other hand, I was once getting estimates to remove a tree. Guy drives up in a brand new red convertable Corvette with a busty blond girlfriend. His quote was double the average of the others, but I probably wouldn't have hired him anyway. There are times NOT to flaunt it.
I agree that a more professional image gets you more work...and more respect...(more self respect too...I think it improved the way I approached my trade and dealings with customers)
A few years ago I swapped my beat up Toyota pick-up for a slightly used F-150, and things definitely began to look up!
A better truck sends a message that you're successful and good at what you do...(a truck is a tool after all, and I've heard of completely clueless guys being hired for a job just because they had a shipload of tools) you have a better chance of getting hired on a crew if you pull up to a jobsite in a cooler truck...if it's not too fussy, with fancy wheels and a bunch of cheap looking accessories all over it! ;)
Jen
Whatever works...
Edited 9/23/2006 11:12 am by Jencar
I used to do carpentry / cabinetmaking on the side and often met clients after work in a suit and tie. That raised some eyebrows occaisonally.
Last week I saw the owner of a roofing company deliver whole load of shingles and paper for a re-roof in a Hummer towing a trailer.
Went to talk to the foreman, he said they only do hail/storm damage insurance jobs.
Great, my HO ins. premiums bought him a new truck.
I have at least a dozen business cards from roofing companies willing to pay me $150 for referrals they complete. Hail damage ins. jobs only.
And if I'm not in the pretty white car, I'm always in this. All my clients know me, and I think they like that they're not paying a lot for my truck.
View Image
It runs, normally!
Forrest
Edited 9/27/2006 1:18 pm by McDesign
Man, I feel for you guys that gotta keep up (or keep down) appearances. One of the great things about doing e-designs (term came from someone else via M Smith) is that I don't have to dress or drive a certain way, and my house was built before they contract me, so they don't have to contemplate how I spend money. That whole concept of how I spend what I earn, as though they have a say in how it's earmarked, is offensive. I'd be tempted to tell someone that their $$ weren't going for my ride...they were gonna be wasted paying my damn income taxes.
I find the whole topic some what offensive. It's somehow the h/o's choice to decide how much money I should make or what kind of trucks the company has?
It's pretty stupid if you ask me.
IMO that comment translates to "you're skill/talent are not worth that much money to me because anyone can do your job"
well if that's the case then fine, screw you, and good luck finding someone else.
all that should matter is the bottom line, how much is it going to cost, do they find or can I sell enough value in that number to have us do the job. If not, then I wish them luck with their project, but I'll be damned if someone is going to talk down to me because they think that somehow we don't deserve to earn a decent living just because we're a carpenter, or electrian, or plumber, or whatever...
I don't have to dress a certain way
He probably sits nekked at his computer
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
My secret's out...and those new Macs with the built-in camera may be my downfall.
I have had that all through my life Electroman.
The key is balance. I new $40,000 truck is not only bad stewardship but a waste and it only feeds one's ego. An old beater says one isn't very successful.
The path to balance is found with a truck that is a couple/few years old. Nicely maintained, no rust, but not all decked out. a solid work truck. Remember when truck makers sold WORK trucks? They were long bed, regular cab, no options and solid as a rock. Not so today.
When you fall into the trap of what my dad calls a "Yuppie Truck" you end up with giving the wrong impression.
Today I drive a four year old F150. Not a die-hard Ford fan, just happened to be a good deal. It is a solid vehocle and I keep it looking good, but it is not a four-wheeled testament to my ego. It works well for me and does what I ask it too.
Good luck!
My rusty old truck has a new 300" six cylinder, will be a new transmission, new brakes, most rotating parts, new LT tires, air springs that let me carry 4000 lbs on the highway for hours . . .
But, it's a secret - I've left it unlocked, with the keys in the ignition, since 1992.
It's a darned useful appliance!
Forrest