I am installing a tile shower stall and I have some questions. Is the vinyl liner placed on a sloped base? How is the liner kept from “bunching” at the corners as it climbs the vertical sides? What is the recommended thickness of the mud base for the tile? Do I need to be concerned about the weight of the mud base?
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"Is the vinyl liner placed on a sloped base?"
No, the liner is on the sub-floor, then the concrete is floated to pitch toward the drain.
How is the liner kept from "bunching" at the corners as it climbs the vertical sides?
you have to fold it. kind of like when you're wrapping present, the way you fold the corner. It still ends up overlapping so you have to be careful when running your hardi-backer, or the bottoms will flare out.
What is the recommended thickness of the mud base for the tile?
Depends. What the drain height is, how big the shower pan is. You have to slope the mud towards the drain at 1/4" fall/ 1' of run, just like any other drain line.
In Pittsburgh, shower pan liners have to be installed by a licensed plumber, and inspected before the mud is put down. This is not something to be taken lightly. Water will penetrate the tile/grout, and concrete. I've torn out a ton(literally probably) of old pans, and most were soaked all the way to the old lead pan.
Edited 5/9/2005 8:20 pm ET by dustinf
"No, the liner is on the sub-floor, then the concrete is floated to pitch toward the drain."
WRONG!
The assembly is: tile over thinset over 1" of mortar over liner over sloped mortar over felt over subfloor.
This is not a DIY project unless you are very skilled and have done a lot of complex projects already.
Thanks for the information. I did check Deflecto and it appears that ceramic tile is OK but not natural stone. I am building a 5 ft. x 5 ft shower directly above a garage.I have a question about loading on the joists. Directly under the shower is a joist structure of: 2- 2x8; 1-2x8; 2-2x8;1-2x8 all spaning 12 ft.. The entire floor is made up of this double & single 2x8 technique all 16 OC. I calculate the shower weight to be about 1600 lb. Any thoughts?
I use SpanCalc. You can, too, by Googling "rafter span tables."
Plugged in "floor joists, SPF, #1, 16" centers, loading 40L/10D," and SpanCalc says you are good to 12'3" span. Seeing as how you have a doubler at every other one, you seem more than safe.
Showers are routinely built over a floor frame designed for 40/10.
This is not a DIY project for most folks, and certainley NOT something learned at a 1 hour seminar at HD.
And no, at least arguably, the liner does not go on the subfloor, it goes over pre-slope.
And there are better ways than that.
Ask yourself how long you wish this to last. Then get educated and or hire a pro.
Go here too..............
http://www.johnbridge.com/
Eric
I Love A Hand That Meets My Own,
With A Hold That Causes Some Sensation.
[email protected]
If you have a standard "manufactured" shower, one that is assembled and you plop it in the new bathroom, does that require a pan as well? Or is it just in tiled showers?
Excuse my ignorance.
Thanks-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Have you seen my baseball?"
Unit showers, typically gelcoat fiberglass, are just plopped in. No pan required.
The "pan" in the topic is one that is built into a ceramic tiled shower.
What Gene said.
Unless you are referring to the Schluter sytem.
Schluter-Systems
EricI Love A Hand That Meets My Own,
With A Hold That Causes Some Sensation.
[email protected]
Yes, the liner goes on a sloped base ... it's called the pre-slope. Then there's a layer on top of the liner. The purpose of the preslope is to keep the liner pitched toward the drain, so any moisture that does get to the liner will seep into the drain. Be sure you use a drain body that is designed for a liner. Buy a good one ... there isn't that much difference in price, and this is one area where you don't want to take any chances.
I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.
go to the JLC website and search the topic... I found a few good articles on showerpans for the one I did a few weeks back... and Ed is right...the pan is sloped..
"knowledge without experience is just information." Mark Twain
Get yourself a copy of Michael Byrnes (sp?) Setting Tile. Your local library might even have a copy. It's not rocket science, but you MUST be methodical in following directions and having patience. Be sure to put in the lattice strips to hold out the durock. Always water test after installing the liner. Mike
I just finished my first tile shower and pan. You can do it but you have to think about what you are doing. I found many different opinions on what methods to use. You have to settle on one. I picked John Bridges, because I could go back and reread how to do it and I liked his logic. After you finish you will appreciate the work of a pro. Now every where I go, I look at the tile jobs. Most of the ones in motels, public restrooms are pretty sloppy. When you see a good one, you will find yourself in awe of the artist. You can take a lot of short cuts and maybe get away with it but don't do it. Use hardi backer not dry wall etc. Go to the John Bridge page. I repeat, go to the John Bridge page. Lots of good info with pictures. I bought John's book after I finished. I wish I had gotten it first. It will not be perfect the first time but it is still very satisfying.