I’m working on a kitchen/family room remodel. The house was built in the mid-1990s and has an open floorplan. There is no wall between the kitchen and family room, just a 13 foot opening. As you walk from the kitchen into the family room, the 9 foot kitchen ceiling goes straight up to a vaulted ceiling. The header for this opening appears to be a 3.5 x 14 laminated beam which is dead straight. In this opening, right under the lam header, I’m building a partion wall with an arched doorway to give some separation between the two rooms. The top of the partition wall has to follow the line of the laminated beam exactly or the seams will show. What should I use as a top plate for the partition wall? My concern in using 2×6 is (1) whether I can find a 2x6x14 that will be as straight as the lam header or, (2) if the 2×6 shrinks or moves, my seams between the top plate and the header (which will not move) will separate. If movement is not an issue, should I look for two straight 2x6x8s rather than one long top plate? Obviously, this will not be a bearing wall.
Any suggestions are greatly appreciated. Right now, there’s still a fair amount of demo work to do, but I expect to get to the partition wall within two weeks. I’d like to get the materials in the house as soon as possible to be sure they acclimate before I start building.
Thanks guys.
Frank
Replies
frank, why would you not use a 2x4 for the plate,why the bigger dimension? I would suppose you are removing the corner bead where ceiling meets wall? Your best bet might be to cut the wall sheetrock up enough to get past the corner buildup, install new sheetrock bridging the connection from new plate to beam.
I'm also assuming this beam is flush to the kit. ceiling. If so, and there's no lath catcher or joists holding the drywall away from the edge of the beam (joists run parallel to beam), then you might want to leave the drywalled ceiling alone. Fasten your plate through the drywall and into the beam. Tape your new sheetrock on the kitchen side of the new wall to the ceiling.
or am I not quite there in understanding.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Frank
I agree with Kalvin...why are you using a 2X6? If the glu-lam is 3.5" wide and the drywall is secured directly to it, wouldn't the 2x6 be sticking out 2".
If so, I'm not even sure you need to us a top plate...why not just toe-nail directly to the bottom of the glu-lam you studs on 16" centers, down to your bottom plate?
I also agree that I'd go up a foot or so and cut the old drywall out, tapering the exposed edge with your sharp utility knife, and butt your new drywall up against it..also with a hand tapered edge. Just make sure the new and old faces are on the same plane. Careful mudding and sanding should hide this joint completely.
Now, if the drywall on the glu-lam has been firred out (rather than nailed directly to the beam), you'll have to rip down a 2X6 to just the right width for the top/bottom plates and the studs so that your drywall on both sides sits in the same plane as the existing.
To avoid the shrinkage issue, use kiln dried, and just pick-the-stack for straight ones.
BruceM
Guys,
I originally planned on using 2x6s because both sides of the doorway will be trimmed out as square columns and one side of the wall will have a large opening trimmed with a shelf/counter. To avoid having the columns and shelf stand too proud of the surrounding wall, I thought I would use 2x6s, rather than 2x4s and give the wall more depth. I would extend the 2x6 top plate further into the kitchen side so it would remain flush on the family room side of the wall. As an alternative, I could use 2x4s and just build out as necessary on the kitchen side to keep everything in proportion. Let me know what you think.
Seaming the drywall on the lam header instead of right at the top plate/header joint is a great idea.
Frank R.
Rather than try to make a perfect match, why not creatre a 1/2" or so reveal?
I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.
On the drywall patch, you want to get away from the buildup that the corner bead makes, usually about 6-8"
Could you post a pic of the opening now, makes it a bit easier to visualize.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Here are two pictures of the opening - one from each direction. The half wall and decorative column are coming out. That will leave a 9 foot by 13.6 foot opening. I'm framing in an arched doorway. As you can see, the half wall that is there now (but will be coming out) is about 8 inches wide with about an 11 inch wide shelf. We're going to put something similar in the new wall. That is why I thought about going with the 2x6s instead of 2x4s. That would give the wall a minimum thickness of about 7 inches.
I'm going to cut away the drywall about 6 inches up the lam header and seam the drywall there. I'm also going to take the new drywall all the way into the corner. That was a great idea. I just need to finalize what I'm going to use to frame the wall and I'll be ready to go.
Thanks Calvin.
holy crap frank. Please reduce the size. I can't live long enough to load those. thanks, somewhere in the neighborhood of 100kb, or whatever "b"/s are the small ones.
thanksRemodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Sorry Calvin. I'll post again tonight with a smaller picture.
Frank
Couple thoughts:
The new wall will enclose the entire opening from side to side, is that right? With a new arched opening for passage?
You sure the column in the middle isn't structural? I can't tell from here, just asking.
A 2x6 finished wall flush to the LR wall will crowd the closet door casing, I'm guessing, just be looking at the (real LARGE) photos (thank God for DSL.) Shaving down the casing to accomodate a wall IMHO always looks funny, and that kitchen would deserve better.
Strip drywall 6-12" from (at least) the LR side to better blend in the new rock. The kitchen side probably isn't as critical, and you could probably cut it close to mimimize additional patching. For a seamless transition, that means stripping back the rock on the side walls as well, as well as that half wall.
How is a 2x6 wall gonna go with the half wall that's already installed? Can't tell what's on the other side, whether or not there would be immovable interference with the 6" depth.
Is this your house, or have you been hired for the project?I never met a tool I didn't like!
Nick,
The half wall is coming out and I confirmed on the plans that the post is not structural. That said, I still have some concern the header will sag when I remove the post so I'll continue to support it until the new framing is in place. The casing, doors and jams on the closet are being removed. Cabinets/countertop to match the new kitchen are being installed in the closet space so that the front of those cabinets will be flush with the wall. It will look more like built in cabinets than a closet. The lack of casing around the opening will give me more room between the new wall and the cabinets.
Everyone seems to like the plan, but they question the use of 2x6s. If it seems like a better (and easier) plan, I will go to the 2x4s, but use trim build outs to get the same scale for the square pillars. As you can probably tell, I have not done framing. I spend most of my time on finish work (built in closets, window seats, wainscoating, chair rails, molding build ups, crown molding etc.) But, I think I can handle a partition wall. This is my house. My plan is to get all of the structural work and drywalling done now, then take out the kitchen.
Thanks for your help.
Frank
Build the new wall flush to the sheetrock, add new sheetrock up to the ceiling.6 16 17 97 99
try these for size...
Thanks Rich. I'm technologically challenged and that exercise would have taken me two hours.
Even with a 2x6 as a top plate, if you pick a fairly straight one, you can persuade it to match the existing beam using blocks and clamps.
Start by marking the position for the sole plate plumb down from the beam on the sub floor. Face nail the top and sole plates to the studs, working on the floor in the room with the higher ceiling. Tilt it up and shove it into place using blocks to hammer against. Bending the studs a little as you go can make that easier.
Working from one end to the other, pull the face of the top plate flush with the face of the beam on the side facing the big room, and nail it off. Persuade the sole plate to the line on the sub floor and nail it off. Finally, put in the blocking.
-- J.S.
John, Calvin and everyone,
Thanks for the help. I'll post pictures in about a month.
Frank
Best of luck Frank. Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Calvin,
I'm attaching a few pictures of the completed project (along with a picture of the mantel I built). Thanks for your help. If you know a way of getting this to the other guys that pitched in their advice, I would appreciate it.
Thanks.
Frank R.
The first picture is of the original set up. The following three are after the work was completed.
Your not holding your tongue right. Must be slightly extended and to the right or left with just enough moisture to glisten in the light. :)
Frank, do a search for your original post. Post again to it and perhaps send msg's to the responders you wish to thank.
And, could you resize the pics smaller. On this system, tho a bit slow to load, they are appearing like an abstract painting.
And you'd better refresh my memory too, I'm at a loss as to how I may have helped. Remember, I'm older, feeble and just a dumb carpenter.A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time