I’m trying to install a slop sink in my back porch. The problem I am running into is the porch is an add-on. I cannot run my drain or incoming water lines without exposing them to an unisulated area below the porch floor which I believe was a cold storage space. The house was built in the early 1800’s with a stone foundation and dirt floors in the basement. Up here in NY we get some pretty cold winters, especially last year, so I’m most worried about my pipes freezing. The wall I was running my pipes down splits the kitchen from the porch and at the bottom of the cavity between studs is one of the main beams for the foundation, approx. 6×8. I don’t have a perpendicular wall to run along on the inside, kitchen side, to access the basement that way either.
Thanks, Dave
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You have to keep the pipes inside the building envelope, or install them so that they can be drained for winter. They've got to be pitched correctly so that no water lays in there after you've drained them for the latter method. Can't you go right through the wall that the porch and kitchen share, though, keeping the pipes in heated/conditioned space? As long as the trap isn't in the freezing air, drainage pipes are fine.
You will need to run the pipe into the house through the wall between the kitchen and the porch. The trap must be inside the house or it will freeze. So you need to come off your tailpiece with a 90-degree elbow and then run through the wall with a slope towards the kitchen so it will drain to the trap.
To hide it the trap and pipe that runs down through the floor of the kitchen, build a chase around it. Make sure you 'sheathe' the chase on two sides with some sort of perforated material so the warm air from the room can get in there to keep the pipe from freezing. Also, since your P-trap and cleanout will be in there, build an access door into the chase.
You should be able to conceal the supply lines to this slop sink in the same chase. You might consider using freeze-proof hose-bibs instead of standard faucets for this. These are constructed with the valve body 8 to 12 inches back from the business end, so that it stays in the heated space and thus won't freeze. You install them with a slope towards the unheated space, so that after you turn off the water the section of pipe beyond the valve (which is in the unheated space) drains downhill into the sink.
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
Maybe it was a wierd dream but I think I have seen a rubber trap from Fernco.
Went ahead and went to their site. Guess it was not a dream.
http://www.fernco.com/FT.html
I would probably add a "quick el" to connect to the horiz unless it was well drained as you suggested.
The link talks to vacation homes/freezing.
Edited 9/11/2005 10:44 pm ET by rasconc
Interesting line of stuff they've got on that site. I don't use much except the hubless connectors from time to time. But ya never know when something could solve a weird problem....
OTOH, I would not put a trap directly under that sink, even a 'freeze-damage resistant' one, since it would guarantee keeping water in the unheated environment. It shouldn't be that much trouble for the guy to slope the horizontal section by say half an inch. That will make it drain to a warm trap an eliminate any potential freezing problems....
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
Certainly agree! They do have some real neat problem solvers. I wish I had taken a picture of a bathtub trap I removed. It was a radiator hose and a lot of silicone caulk, along with several other bits and pieces. I think it was "early eclectic".
I also wish I'd taken a picture of the vent stack behind the kitchen sink in my old apartment in NYC, lo these many years ago. There was an old Shæffer Beer can (a steel one) with the top and bottom both can-openered out, spliced into the CI stack pipe with electrician's tape. Damned thing is, it worked fine for the 15 years I lived there, and is probably still working today (knowing the landlord as I do...).
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
thanks for the info guys. I think I might try to come throught the wall into the kitchen and down throught the floor and case it in that way as someone stated. That, I think, is the best way. I'll you know how I make out thos weekend.
Thanks
thanks for that, I'm going to need one of those - fits my needs perfectly
I'm no plumber, but I thought I remember hearing the PEX is somewhat freeze tolerant because it has some expansion-ability. So if there is still water in it, you might not crack it during a freeze. It also has some memory so it it would go back to the normal shape at thaw.
But you should get a plumber's opinion on that. I'm not sure that PEX is legal everywhere, anyway.