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First, correct me if I’m wrong but this is a rip-off (no pun intended) not a re-roof.
Second, there are to many variables involved to use a “by the square” price guage. Examples;accessibility, rubbish removal, surrounding ground area protection,weather protection, shingle type, site clean up,I think you get the picture.
My word of advice is to get recommendations, and forget about the three estimate rule of thumb, get ten if that is what is needed to find a competent roofer.
P.S.
Whom the recommendation comes from is as important as the recommendation its self.
Replies
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Tommy B and George W Carpenter
Purveyors of pre-owned bigotry!
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Larry,
I admire your intellect and command of the english language as evidenced in your post. Please enlighten me as to how you reached such a conclusion based on my post. Cite specific examples if you would.
If you mean that I am weary of competitors who have an unfair advantage with the blessing of the government which I support, based on their sex, sexual preferences, color, or religious beliefs, I would not take issue with that.
Want to test your beliefs a little? Interchange the words Amish and English at random with the words, woman, muslim, homosexual, white male, senior citizen etc. and see what you think. Sometimes people like you can't see the forest through all the trees.
P.S. When you wish to make a point, It helps to illustrate it with argument and reason. Otherwise an appropriate reply to your post would be, "Larry D., purveyor of a pre-owned idiot." I think even with your limited vocabulary, you could see how this board would quickly become boring.
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I've got 1400 sq ft roof to rip off asphalt and shake, sheath in 7/16 osb with one valley, no vents, no gutters, #30 felt, I supply shingles.
estimate #1: $4200, #2: $3200, #3: $2300.
Last estimate says 12 guys and done in two days. The first estimate has lousy rep. 2nd is excellent. How can #3 do it so cheap? Should I go with them?
*how steep is the roof? - yb
*You are ripping off asphalt shingles and installing shake? Is that right?Rich Beckman
*RJT,I am basing this all on assumption. You have left out some crucial information regarding clean up (dumpster cost), whether the material will be boomed to the roof, who is installing the osb, etc. Form what I gather, it's a two layer rip (asphalt over shake). If you are supplying the shingles only, I would charge closer to the #2 estimate depending on pitch (probably more if my guys have to carry the bundles up on the roof). The number three guy could be working for just his crews' labor because he is hurting for jobs.As a rule of thumb for myself, I always go with people who are recommended by other trusted friends or contractors. If the #1 contractor has a bad reputation, there is usually a good reason for it.All of my work is through referral. If the contractor does good work, their past customers will tell other people. Ask for a list of references and call all of them!Good luck,Greg
*can't tell you the pitch offhand, but it is steep enough that you'll slide in tennies. They provide the dumpster, putting on and cost of osb. I should mention that the cheapest estimate is an Amish contractor that probably pays his crew 5 or 6 an hour and takes in a minimal profit. Both his and #2 come highly recommended. #2 has the most well-defined estimate.
*Finally, A post that I have to respond to, instead of the estimating and billing I should be doing. I can't see how anyone can quote you an accurate price over the internet so I won't even try accept to say that all three could be reasonable. I will respond to how #3 can do it so cheap as a matter of civic responsibility. It doesn't matter that the gentleman is Amish but since you raised that point let me make some observations. I don't profess to be an expert on the Amish culture, but as a resident of PA and having lived next door to a professor of sociology that *is* an expert on them I'll continue. First of all, it is a common belief among the "English" in my area that the Amish do not pay taxes. I am not sure to what extent this is true but I do know that some orders of the sect are exempt from social security. The Amish believe in taking care of their older members themselves and have won gov't approval in this area. This amounts to a 15% reduction in labor cost. I have pulled building permits on jobs that they are on and found that none carry workmen's comp, as is true with many English contractors. This would fit the logic of the social security situation resulting in another 10 to 15% reduction in labor costs. As they do not directly subscribe to or consume public utilities or fossil fuels for transportation, not only are there some use and consumption tax savings but they have reduced overhead as compared to their English competition. I believe this is the case with vehicle registrations, tire taxes, etc. also. As you can see, savings from these items alone could explain the variance in bid prices, irrespective of whether they pay income or other taxes.It is also worth noting that it is common to see children as young as 10 or 12 (I didn't ask for birth certificates) on their jobsites. I assume that child labor laws would prohibit this although this would not be unusual to the Amish community. Another interesting item to note is that by and large, the Amish do not spend a proportionate amount of there income in the English community. There culture encourages them to build wealth only within the Amish community. This separatism would seem to allow them a different requirement for the dertermination of income for both owners and employees. This would not appear to be a strategy that would benefit the English economy. Around here, the Amish as whole have a varying reputation. Most of the builders that use them are extremely cost conscious. I do not know of a high end builder that uses them. Of course, casual observers that are not tradespeople consider their lifestyle to be romantic and stereotype them as excellent tradesmen although none have given me an example as to why they believe this. I would be weary of a people that ends their formal education at eighth grade, and shuns the English culture, when looking for a contractor. With the constant change in construction technology and materials, I believe it is imperative that contractors are up to date on the latest techniques and information that is available in periodicals, technical references and forums such as this. I don't believe it is possible to keep up to date in isolation.Any how, if it sounds like a touchy subject with me, it is. I think there should be a level playing field for all. Its not likely to change soon in PA because the Amish are responsible for alot of tourism dollars. Tom
*Just finished reading your essay on "fear of the Amish"....It's a sad statement of how you are reacting to an unknown group by you...Why not learn to appreciate their differences and find a way to share this wonderful planet with your Amish neighbors...Would you rather live by a thousand clones of yourself?...I wouldn't.Near the stream, lovin, livin,J
*I would do the job for $2,550.00...with a million in insurance and all coverages and taxes...Go with the Amish low bid...The Amish are low bid roofers all over the country and can do descent work...I know many roofers at any price that do horrible work...Price is no guarantee...I trust my own eyes and give someone a shot at a job once to see what's what.Near the stream, pettin Lucy the lobster,JMore than $2800 and your being shaken down.
*RJT, I'll take door number two... it equates to $200 a square plus the dumpster... reasonable for quality work... What's the material being applied? 20 yr., 30 yr., 3 tab or Architectural?
*Tom,I live in PA as well, and from the sound of it, not too far from you (an hour drive to Lancaster county). I am informed about the Amish people, and know that they came to this country to exercise their religious freedom. That's what this country was built on. I will never hold it against them that they choose to opt out of American society. Sometimes I wish I could. In terms of their labor costs, they are definitly lower, but then again, you will never see an Amish name on a workers comp. claim form. They take care of their own.Goerge,For a 2 layer rip, $200 per square is the going rate in this area. With dumpster, installing osb, and that mess of a clean up, the #2 price would be fair.RJT,If both #2 and #3 are highly recommended it comes down to checking references. Many people will even let you stop by to look at their house to see the work (at least my references will).Greg
*the amish quote was barely legible. I'm leaning towards #2, but not for sure yet. 30 yr asphalt, 5 tab (certainteed).
*You're adding specs after we bid ehhh...Typical $3200 at least now and much more if I find out you want to keep adding to the spec...copper valleys double breaked, etc.Near the stream and smelling somethin funny,J
*You have to remember, they stop going to school after eighth grade. I say talk to both of their references. It has been my experience that most customers will be very frank in their description of a contractors work.30 year five tab? You didn't want to go with the Carriage House line? Only $140 per square. Only kidding(not on the price)Good luck!
*Simply stated, shop for reputations not prices. People who strictly price shop and get burned deserve every bit of it.Pete Draganic
*First, correct me if I'm wrong but this is a rip-off (no pun intended) not a re-roof.Second, there are to many variables involved to use a "by the square" price guage. Examples;accessibility, rubbish removal, surrounding ground area protection,weather protection, shingle type, site clean up,I think you get the picture.My word of advice is to get recommendations, and forget about the three estimate rule of thumb, get ten if that is what is needed to find a competent roofer.P.S. Whom the recommendation comes from is as important as the recommendation its self.
*I went for #2 estimate of $3200, $900 more than the low one. thanks for the input all.