Current job is a remodel of 150 year old home. Master bath has cathedral ceilings. Rafters are only 6″ deep so we added 1.5″ rigid insul. air continuous to underside. Client insisted on recessed lighting even though they compromise envelope. Only the baffle fits between top of housing and deck. Am I right o be concerned?
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If the sides/top of the can are exposed to cold air, you can count on condensation occuring on the can metal. In a slant orientation, you can also count on the water to become heavy enough to run down the side of the can and collect on the drywall, running down that too until it drips down.
In a bath, you can bet the farm on the above.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Calvin
I'm currious here, I have a vaulted ceiling in my living room and want to add cans, I'd like to do it right!
I have vaulted ceiling with roof framing over that, meaning that I can go up in the attic and I can see the insulation over the vault and then the roof over that, there is about 4' between the two. Hope that makes sense? If not I can get a pic.
Can I add the IC cans and insulate around them?
Doug
You just described my preferred method for vaulting a ceiling--separate fro roof framing altogether.
Can I add the IC cans and insulate around them?
Yes. Be advised, though, there's a bugaboo in the IC cans. The wattage ratings are very critical. The IC can has a thermocouple which turns the lamp off if it exceeds the design temp (assuming it was not a low-ball junk t/c from Indonesia installed in the for-the-big-box cheapo cans--don't ask me how I know).
If the can is rated for a 40W, then, that's all you can use. If the t/c is good <ggrrr>, it'll run as long as the switch is on. Put a 45W PAR flood in there--it'll run for a while, longer with a dimmer, but only until the t/c opens.
This can be anoying for all parties in service calls (particularly if the service call is early, or is late, when the roof & ceiling can be cooler, too).Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Be advised, though, there's a bugaboo in the IC cans. The wattage ratings are very critical
Yea, tell me about it, I was trimming out a house this summer and the lights kept shutting off in the great room! They must have had a T/C in them, duh......
I think we were just screwing any wattage bulb in them so as to have light.
Now that we have some respectable weather around here I can go up there and do some work!!!
Thanks
Doug
this summer and the lights kept shutting off in the great room! They must have had a T/C in them
It can be even worse after completion when the lighting "person" (designer, showroom sales, whatever) advises them on "perfect" lamps for the space, but not the luminares. So, the very spiffy cathedral ceiling under the south-facing roof with eight cans punched in it will drive 60W pink ("flesh tone" or "rosè" some are labeled) lamps on a dimmer. Just for not very long with the dimmer all the way up, though.
The freaky bit is when the t/c close again at different rates--this can be the only actual evidence to "prove" it's the t/c's in the cans (or that it was the junk t/c <grrrr> in the cans).Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
"The IC can has a thermocouple which turns the lamp off if it exceeds the design temp "Technical correction.It ain't a thermocouple.It is a type of thermostat, or more accurately a thermo operated switch.A thermocouple consists of a two junctions with dissimilar metals. A voltage is generated proportional to the tempature difference between the 2 junctions.
You will be able to install the ICT cans. I would use the Juno cans as they have sealed units and are a decent can with many options for trims. I think they have some new Low Voltage trims.
You might be able to put the box over the fixture to help isolate it from the cool.............wait a minute. You're in texas. You shouldn't have a problem. Up here in Ohio it gets cold enough to cause a problem with cans in cathedrals (not in a scissor truss) outta rafters. You might have heat loss, but not the condensation I've seen here on some installs.
But do check out the options on the juno (I hope that's what I'm thinking I saw the cool new styles) cans.Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Thanks Calvin, I'll check them out.
Doug
I've used recessed lighting in my home with a can that was insulated. Made by 'Halo.' Now, I'm sure the R-value isn't all that great. But hey, it works!
Chief,
I know about cans (ICT) allowed in contact with insulation in the ceiling but have never heard of "insulated" cans. Could you give us some more information on them?
thanksRemodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
yeah, i'd be interested to hear about insulated cans too.
Know about IC's, but insulated? I wonder if there are any available with some type of plastic bodies?
When in doubt, get a bigger hammer!
I think you're right. They maybe just the ones that are allowed for contact with insulation. I think I purchased them at Lowes.Chief of all sinners.
ok, thanks chief.Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Possibilities:
You might fir the inside surfaces of the rafters to give you more working depth.
Look into shallower recessed fixtures: Halo's 4" H99ICT airtight housing is 5 3/8" deep (from the living side of the drywall). Maybe a 3" fixture is even more amenable. I know, these are small lamps/fixtures, but the client insists ....
The real deal is number of fixtures, IC and wattage. The amount of light that would satisfy the customer is in my opinion the first hurtle. If the appearance of a fixture is what the customer desirers then your job is not as difficult. If they want both high illumination and a totally flush fixture then you need a miracle. Try Lightolier Lytecaster series for recessed incandescent 120v and 12v. They also have trims that extend the fixture to a simi recessed set up that can be very attractive. One to see is call the Bedroom trim, it is carved wood stained or painted that can add some adjustment of the lamp to get it out of the can to reduce heat build up inside the can that could lead to nuance thermal coupling tripping.