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OK! I’m going to stick my neck out (put my ass on the line!) and chastise F.H.B. for printing photos of tradesman with cigarettes dangling from their mouths. Rather than get on my soap box about the known health risks, the rudeness and invasivness of cigarette smoke etc. I want to find others who feel that this insidious product (our most deadly and addictive drug) has no place in or on the job site. Having worked in the trades for over twenty years and finally found a nitch that allows me to avoid on-site work, I can’t begin to tell how much offensive second hand smoke I have been exposed to. Do others feel the same? Is it just assumed that all tradesman smoke and that all job sites are open to constant cigarette use. In this day and age where cigarettes are banned in most work places, why are the trades still subjected to this offensive drug?
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Replies
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because we work mainly in an unfinished building,most builders I work with put no smoking signs up after drywall.One builder even asks us to put them out whenever the homeowner or prospective one is on site.
jim"non-smoker"at great white
*Speaking of smoking...James, how's the quitting going? Been pulling for you.Rich Beckman
*You mean smoking hasn't really been banished to the trailer parks and prisons in the U.S. Last time I was there...it seemed there was naary an ash tray to be seen. Why don't they just ban it? If someone else sold a product that defective I am sure they would be closed down long ago...but then cooca coola and mcdonalsd are still in business too! LOLStirring it up....Lawrence
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The reason why smoking isnt banned is that out of the $4.00 a pack that it costs here in NY. The tabacco companies get about .28 cents a pack and the federal govt. and the state goverments get the rest. they will never ban anything that brings in that much money for them. I dont smoke anymore and even when i did i didnt like inhaling someones elses smoke.
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Looks like this could be two distinct threads...
#1 Banning Smoking altogether as in by government decree? FAT CHANCE! IT's ALL ABOUT MONEY!
#2 Job-site smoking? Can't begin to speak for others but my policy is: NO SMOKING in the customer's home. That includes under-construction areas that are still open to the elements. Even if the customer has a carton a day habit any work I am responsible for is turned over in pristine condition. You'd be surprised at how many different visitors your job has, especially when you are not there, and not everyones nose is desensitized to the lingering stench of tobacco smoke.
This could also generate another thread: Daily jobsite cleanliness. No debate here - JUST DO IT!
Comments? Ralph
*Thanks Rich!The quit smoking program I am on is great. I am doing exceptionally well, and I feel great. Man, I can't believe the renewed energy I feel, and the sense of taste and smell is at an all time high for me. I never really knew just how bad an old, stale ashtray smelled until recently. As for smoking on the job site, there are many variables that you must look at before you make any firm decisions.First of all, I do not smoke IN a customers house, no matter what. I do not smoke in front of a customer, no matter what. I keep a can of water for the butts, and NEVER throw a cig butt on the lawn, on the ground, etc... If you hire a smoker, then you had better be prepared to accomodate them. You are gonna have to provide an area for them to smoke (even if it's in their vehicles), and you had better be ready to find them on a smoke break quite often. If you are not prepared to deal with it, do not hire a smoker. Smoking is more than a bad habit. It is a way of life sometimes, and very addictive. These smokers ain't gonna just "abide by the rules". They will sneak a smoke, whenever, and wherever they can. If nothing else, you will see them taking a bathroom break every few minutes. On the issue of smoking in prisons - NOT ANYMORE! The state prisons here have banned smoking, and the Federal prisons have banned smoking as well. You cannot smoke any where on the premises. This goes for prisoners, employees, and visitors. Cigs in a Texas prison are worth more than money. The smoking still goes on, but it is like trying to smoke a joint in the middle of a police station. But then again, prison ain't supposed to be a picnic!Just a thought...James DuHamel
*I hate to admit it.......I am a heavy smoker. Having said that, I don't allow anyone on our crews (myself included) smoke in someones house during construction. We do smoke in open air situations, but as soon as the house is dried in, forget it. We don't smoke while talking to the customer unless they smoke. We don't put out our butts on the ground without picking it up and throwing it away. In the shop, I make the men use an ashtray, and to be thoughtful of their non-smoking buddies. Smoking is a terrible thing. Lord knows I wish I had never started. I aspire to be a non-smoker, and as much as you may think you know about it, if you have never been adicted to nicotine, you don't have a clue as is how hard it is to quite.James, I wish you would share with me the method you used to quite. I am open to all suggestions.Ed. Williams
*I probably have a unique perspective on this.When i was 5 or 6 dad got sick with lung cancer. He quit smoking the day he found out he had cancer (age 37). An operation gave him almost a year more to live. When he got worse it took my 12 year old brother and my mother to help with bathing and toilet. At 7 i din't help much with his care but probably wasn't as much of a brat as i other wise would have been. Finally the time came when he could no longer hold on; i screamed in anguish with his last breath.Smoking on the job is a non-issue for me as i have no crew and don't smoke.Many of my friends smoke and my good friend the barber smokes in his barber shop. The barber shop is one of my favorite haunts and i've learned to tolerate second hand smoke. My wife and i even permit smoking in our home when the barber Ronnie stops by. The obvious lesson of my childhood loss is that we are all going to die. Part of what i've extrapolated from that is that you need to chase your dreams and have some fun while your alive. Smoking? your call. Smoking on the job probably needs to be outside and cleaned up after.joe d
*Well I live in Maryland now and for several years there has been a law in place that bans smoking in all public work places. That is defined, after several attempts to overturn the law as any workplace tha has access by the nonsmoking worker. All right someone had said, "I will only hire smoking employees." and the response that was issued was "if you are in need of a public servant(i.e. police, ambulance, etc.) and they do not smoke then you cannot allow smoking on the premisses. The only exceptions to this have been to alchohol serving BARS, and private HOMES only. Of corse to protect the rights of smokers asmoking area has to be provided 50ft away from public entrances and workers who smoke are to be allowed no less han one 15 min smoke break every 4 hours. Non-smokers get a 15 min break as well.Now if you as me getting the government involved causes more hedaches than its worth. I feel that it should simply be that if everyone is accepting of a smoking workplace than it is ok. They know he risks and if they say yes than so be it. If however one person says no then set up a smoke area.Dave (K.I.S.S.) Rosendale
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Go James! Best of luck, from a "reformed" smoker. Ed, just quit, hang on, really want to quit. I haven't smoked in about 4 years, and I still get a craving every now and then. hat is the amazing part for me.
As for on the job, we can't smoke indoors in the Air Force. But,we do have smoking areas. I like the ideas of no smoking in a customers house no matter what. After all, if it ain't yours you shouldn't stink it up.
I'm not a professional carpenter, but I do DIY alot. In the old days, when I'd need to stand back and think a problem through, out came the smokes. Now, I just stand there pickin' my nose. I still figure things out, but it's alot more embarrassing when someone catches me "thinking".
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fIRST, To Ed and all those that want to stop, I wish u all the best. if you can not see others reasons and lessons and nagging to stop, then you need the reason in yourself. For me I would miss all the imput you have given us here at breaktime.
Jobsite smoking. We have the same rules as many of you. No smoking. But we can not always control the subs other then post signs or ask them, no tell them, we are not smokers. If the homeowner smokes we put up with it, dah of course,. After a building is "dried" in (as we say in Oregon). Then we will not even let subs come on that smoke. But we have been at it long enough that the only people we need to talk to are the temps and a rare new sub.
But now the real reason I post a responce here is one that will piss me and some of the guys off even faster, even if we are outside .CHEWING TABACCO and spitting. that has to be the worst. Standing and talking to someone who is spitting every three seconds. Or finding a tool or a piece of lumber yu need to pick up and it has wet brown spit on it.
that is my soap box for this thread
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Wow!! I am truly impressed with the feedback on this topic. Seems it's kind of like sex, not really ever talked about honestly so come on all of you smokers out there in the work place--you may have a right to trash your own lungs but you don't have the right to inflict the stinking things on anyone else and as several have said, it's trash, have the decendy to keep your butts under control (oops--sorry, no pun intended!!), and kudos to the reference to chewing tobbacco--doubly nasty!!! As one of the most impressive builders I ever worked for put it--it's all about consideration--if you consider the guy coming after you-- every one's job goes much easier!
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Larry,
I can really relate to the "thinking out a problem smoke"......Your "nose picking" solution is about the funniest thing I've heard in a long time. I hope when I quite that no one catches me "thinking" either. LOL. (Laugh out loud)
Thanks,
Ed.
*Hey josh,Thanks for your support in my battle.....Double ditto to spitting.Not on my job...no way.Ed.
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This past fall, I was startled to receive a call after work that day that the custom home we were building was on fire! I rushed to the job to find the Fire Dept. putting out the fire. Seems that the lather had "flicked" his butt earlier in the day. It landed under a tree next to the house and smoldered all day. Only after we had all left did it finally catch fire. We got lucky. Only some of the foam on the house melted. This is yet another reason not to allow smoking on the job. In reality, though, we would have no subs to do our work if this was enforced. We put up the signs after drywall. By the way, guess what is the most prevalent type of trash left around the job? Cigarette butts, wrappers, and empty packs.
*Is smoking a protected right? Is it o.k. to not hire someone just because he/she smokes? I prefer to not be around it, myself, and am just wondering.
*
No, smoking is not a protected right. In fact, smokers usually find themselves the constant source of violating someone else's rights by subjecting them to smoke.
If you do not want to hire a smoker, don't. There is nothing they can do about it. However, I have found that a great number of sub crews, GC personal crews, and crews of just about every trade available have smokers in their midst. If you truly wish to avoid all smokers in this industry, you are going to be hard pressed to find help/subs.
Just my humble opinion...
James DuHamel
*People cannot be discriminated against because of their sex, race, national origin, or religion. These things are considered protected rights. No, smoking is not a protected right. Of course a person has a right to choose to smoke, but, other individuals have the right not to be exposed to secound hand smoke. I feel that anyone chewing tobacco on the job should be shot.
*i Butif you're going to not hire because of a smoking habit,i be consistent!Person number one wants a job, but you don't hire because they smoke. Later, after much trouble finding someone, you hire person number two even though they do smoke. Person number one, a green female tree worshiper from Mauritania, now has a great case against you.Rich Beckman
*I happen to agree with most of whats been said here. I smoke but due to the type of work I do (mostly indoor remodeling) I am restrained from exersizing my habit a great deal. No problem. When we do happen to have a isolated work place, I smoke more, so its probably a healthy compromise. I try to be considerate to others, keep the job clean ect. But I must admit that if some rabid anti smoker was working with me and complained about secondhand smoke in an open air building, I would have to laugh. With all the noxious fumes dust and odors of a typical jobsite, some times cigarette smoke is pleasant by comparison. I'm sure the non smokers are going to attack me on this, but its the opinion I carry. Its a poor, unhealthy habit that I have attepted to quit before. Until I do I don't feel I have to Apoligize to every non smoker who comes along or consider myself a second class citizen. Only my humble opinion. STEVE
*Well Steve - some of the rabid posts here are pretty clear. Any of you who have that sort of fear of second hand smoke might want to excercise a little more tolerance in your life. Your anxiety will GET you before my smoking GETS me!It's really easy for these guys to grab the soap box and spout the truisms they read in the papers. Till you've been where I've been and done what I've done - don't tell me how to live my life. (PERIOD) I left my parents behind a long time ago and you (whoever you might be) certainly don't fit the job description.Extremeism in any form is harmful - watch what you say!Buz
*I don't smoke, and don't like the smell much. But I feel like I'm in a breakthrough position if I can keep people from smoking in my truck. That pisses me off, because fresh smoke is one thing, but old stale smoke in my truck really stinks.My wife smokes, but only late at night. She gets one room for that, but her cigarettes (Marlboro lights) really smell bad. Sometimes it drifts, and I don't like it.On the job I try not to be around anyone who smokes, it has affected who I work with. Last year I worked with a trim carpenter who smoked. This year, the owner-GC smokes. Two big jobs with smokers. Just don't smoke in my truck!MD
*My wife smokes, but only late at night.Like after your hot Valentines gifts? lol
*Caught again (blush).
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Recentlry a guy flicked on in a dumpster filled with old wood shingles. needless to say the fire department was involved.
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I don't smoke, never did, but this anti-stuff is truly crazy. They are trying to regulate EVERYTHING. Enough of the laws already. We realize everyone has rights, the right to, the right not to whatever. There are lots of things that offend the nose, cause cancer, whatever. Use some common sense. But please quit the bitchin' already.
If everyone stayed healthy, we would have alot of doctors and nurses and the ba-zillion support staffers out of work. Not to mention the drug makers, and on and on. Plus think about the population problems. THIS IS THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, born free and all that yada yada.
Another thing that gets on my nerves is all this drug stuff. Caffeine is a drug, nicotene, why do they call these drugs anyway. They are not mind altering drugs are they? Do you get high on coffee and see things, smoke cigarettes and drive your truck into oncoming traffic? Little kids see you having a cup, and can call you using drugs?
Sorry for the rant, must have had to much coffee this morning, should maybe check ito rehab I guess. Keith
*MD, I don't smoke in my truck if a non smoker is riding with me! Wouldn't dream of jumping into someone elses who dosen't and light up. All about courtesy I guess. Steve
*Hi Ed,I know this may sound smart alecky, but if you really want to quit, then put the damn things down. To really quit, you have to quit "cold turky." Patches and stuff may help some people. "Cutting down" never works. Clips in the ear get pulled out by the next day. No.... to quit, you have to quit; period. I know this is hard. I've smoked for twenty years. I quit smoking 2-1/2 years ago (though in that time period I have fired up approx 12 cigarettes.) First time I quit I was smoking 3 packs a day. Quit for a year solid. Took a new job where everyone smoked. Soon was back at it for another 2 years and then quit again (for about 2 years). Changed jobs again and wound back smoking. And now , like I said, I quit 2-1/2 years ago for my third time (though I have sneaked some.)People find it hard psychologically to quit when they think they will never smoke a cigarette again and that this puff is to be their last. Its tough! Instead, don't think that you have to quit forever, but rather you choose not to smoke at this time. I kept a fresh pack in my pocket whenever I was trying to quit,and told myself that "I have the smokes if I felt like I had to have one, but that I chose not to smoke one at this time; but perhaps later." "Later" kept getting post poned until after about four days the urge to smoke was leaving me. I felt like s**t the first 3 days! But in time I felt better, and only on those rare occaisions do I now ever get the urge. Like I said earlier, a few times I have thrown off that urge, and a few times I haven't. But even when I did smoke one,(or two) I didn't "beat myself up over it." Instead, I told myself that that one was "ok" but tomorrow I would choose not to start back up smoking simply because I smoked one; and I knew that I could "let go" of that urge because I was able to suppress it in the past.Of all my friends who have quit, the ones who did it cold turkey are still non smokers today. Those with the patch and ear clips lasted less than 6 months (most only lasted 6 days)If you chew tobacco, or rub snuff, then quitting is almost impossible. To get rid of the urge, you have to get ALL NICOTINE out of your system. The first 2 times I quit, I stilled chewed, and that was why it was easier for me to go back to it. This last time, I quit chewing the same day I quit smoking and I beleive that has made all the difference. In the past, everyone I worked with smoked, well today practically everyone I work with still smokes; but it has not posed such a big problem to me this time.Going out to the bar for a few drinks is what can get me into trouble (something about a beer and a smoke together!), and so I have to be extra careful in that situation.It is a terrible addiction. And yes if you quit, you will gain weight; about 15 pounds or so. Most of my friends who put on the weight have never been able to take it off (including me). But, overall, I do feel better and I can run better and climb stairs easier; even though I am a little heavier.I'm glad I quit, and hope to stay "quit" this time, but you never know. Give it a try Ed and good luck. Simply take it day by day and those days will turn into weeks, and the weeks into months, and hopefully into years....but if the urge to smoke wins out on occaision....so what?.....one or 2 smokes won't kill you so long as you don't let it to lead you to carrying a pack in your pocket again. Wish you the best.Davo
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In the woodworking shop where my husband works, there are no smoking signs everywhere! And yet he is constantly barraged with second hand smoke. We think the signs are just there for "insurance purposes".
*Remodeling is my main stay and i find most customers tell me up front NO SMOKING in my home. I can stand the smell (would vote against it) but its the trash that comes with it! drives me nuts! wrappers , ends, boxes and the like. Keep the trash where it belongs! And don't smoke in my truck!!
*Nice to see all the concern for the rights of non-smokers here.My own experience: My home is 14 years old, and while the signs went up when the sheetrock did (at my request) there was still some smoking down in the cellar.14 years later, if I do any remodelling than involves drilling or cutting framing members, I can still smell it!.Thanks to all you NON smokers!Steve
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I havent smoked for 11 years now, and am glad I quit. I cannot stand the smell of it especially when it sticks to you, I never realized this when I smoked. It stays with you until you shower and wash the clothes. I do believe everyone has their own rights to do as they please, but I dont like smelling it or having the smoke in my face bothering me, and looking at the trash/waste it brings to the jobsite.
*I have found that the last way to get someone to quit smoking is to gripe about it all of the time. I smoked for four years in high school and college and when I was 40, met a wonderful woman who smoked and thus started smoking again for about nine years. Both times, when I decided to quit, I started buying the small cigarette size cigars, Between the Acts, Swisher, etc., and would only smoke those. Since I could not inhale them, I eventually quit inhaling and when I got to that point, I could really quit smoking. No patches, no bitching---just quit! Good luck. By the way, we always ask for smoking in a restaurant, because there are more places and we like the people better! Neither my wife nor I smoke now!!
*
I am new to this board but I do have a story about smoking on the job.
It doesn't include me but once I was working in Maine and we were
ripping out a roof.
There was a woman helping out and she would be up on a ladder at 20
feet with a sawsall in one hand and a cigarette in the other. I was
not sure what was more important, the cigarette or the job.
Nonetheless, safety was my primary concern and being a lowly worker I
didn't comment. Next time, I will not be so quiet. I haven't had too
many problems with other carpenters since then.
She had been in the trades for a while and I was amazed that she was
so unaware of the possibilities of an accident. Still I believe that
smoking should not be allowed on the
*
OK! I'm going to stick my neck out (put my ass on the line!) and chastise F.H.B. for printing photos of tradesman with cigarettes dangling from their mouths. Rather than get on my soap box about the known health risks, the rudeness and invasivness of cigarette smoke etc. I want to find others who feel that this insidious product (our most deadly and addictive drug) has no place in or on the job site. Having worked in the trades for over twenty years and finally found a nitch that allows me to avoid on-site work, I can't begin to tell how much offensive second hand smoke I have been exposed to. Do others feel the same? Is it just assumed that all tradesman smoke and that all job sites are open to constant cigarette use. In this day and age where cigarettes are banned in most work places, why are the trades still subjected to this offensive drug?