Ok, I am not asking for make/model suggestions, but rather just trying to understand drywall guns in the first place. What is it about them that differ from a more traditional (or common) driver/drill? I have no experience with drywall guns. I’ll be drywalling the basement around Xmas. I have ~3.5 tons (~120 sheets) of 1/2″ DW to hang. What would be a missing feature of a drywall gun if one budgets for </=$100? I’d prefer corded since I will not have to worry about torque deminishing as a battery runs down.
Discussion Forum
Discussion Forum
Up Next
Video Shorts
Featured Story
The RealTruck AMP Research Bedsteps give you easy access to your truck-bed storage.
Featured Video
Highlights
"I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." - M.K.
Replies
Well, I know that most of the major tool makers produce drywall versions of their drills, but I've never used that type. I have used Senco's line of auto-feed screwguns a few times, which basically have a plastic strip of screws that slides into the nose piece of the driver. To use the gun (which can honestly take a little while to get used to) you have to hold down the trigger, then press the nose piece against the drywall to drive the screw into place. It sounds easy enough, but I wouldn't be surprised if other people have had trouble getting the hang of the driver - I ended up with screws that weren't driven in all the way some of the time; I guess in short I would call the system "finnicky"
by the way, I used the corded model and it made me insane. I swear the cord was always caught underneath a sheet of drywall or hooked up something right when you need it most. That's an annoying spot to be in when you are trying to hold a heavy sheet in place and de-snag a cord at the same time.
Justin Fink - FHB Editorial
Nuke,
A drywall gun does several things for you.
It will have an adjustable nosepiece which controls the depth of the screw setting. When the pre-set depth is reached the driver point cams out of the screw head.
Drywall guns incorporate a clutch / gear arrangement which disengages the driver point until pressure is applied. The motor can be running full bore, point does not rotate until pressure is applied. This allows the gun motor to be locked "on" and screws placed on the magnetic bit and "stabbed" into the drywall. Most people who use the stab technique hold the gun from the rear rather than by the grip. You can still start and stop the motor with each screw if desired.
Missing features? My guess would be longevity and perhaps consistancy of depth.
Corded will be good for your basement as there will be a ready source of power. Before you buy a real cheapo look into Milwaukee, DeWalt, etc. You could always sell a lightly used quality gun for a decent price.
Jim
Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
Justin, I didn't see any auto-feed system while in the big box today. Admittedly, I probably overlooked it/them or must be a non-standard product for them. I'll look again. Do you mind my asking what their system was running?
Jim, you have a good point about buying and reselling post-project. I should probably consider this wisely since I got a used drywall lift, which I had planned on selling post-project. I think the lift and gun would make an attractive pair.
BTW, anyone know what the rule of thumb is for drywall nail length if I am using 1/2" DW and going into a mix of 2x4 and 2x6 studs? I'll be doing a bunch of 2x4 framed soffets as well.
Typically 1/2" DW is hung on wood studs with 1-1/4" coarse thread screws, or 1-3/8" ring shank nails ( I don't recommend nails, others do). Stud size is not a factor. I like 5 fasteners across the field or ~16"oc.
BTW, I always use drywall adhesive in addition to screws on ceiling applications.
Drywall , by Myron Ferguson, Taunton Press, is an excellent reference book.
Jim
Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
Edited 12/13/2005 11:24 am ET by JTC1
Although I own a Dewalt drywall gun (corded), I guess I've never really got the hang of it, cause I've lately been using my lightweight impact driver with a drywall dimpler bit - works pretty good.I use the adhesive as well, and like to use nails on the tapered edge and screws in the field.The nails on the edge seem less likely to blow out the drywall if you are close to the edge than the screws.Drywall guns are one thing I've seen go for very little on Ebay - seems like you can always pick up a quality model for about $55 or so.JT
Edited 12/13/2005 1:27 pm ET by JulianTracy
I think the corded Senco Duraspin sells for $99 at the Home Depot. Cordless versions start at around $140 on
Amazon...http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref=nb_ss_hi/104-2803579-9069547?url=search-alias%3Dtools&field-keywords=duraspin
Justin Fink - FHB Editorial
You might consider recon models as a way get a name brand and stay within your budget. Amazon currently has the DeWalt DW272R for $64.94, the Milwaukee 6742-80 for $74.94 and the PC 6640R for $99.94. All have a factory warranty and free shipping.
I started doing my house (280 1/2" sheets) trying to use my 9.6V Makita cordless. About 10 sheets into it, I realized that there is a reason god made drywall screwguns. So I got the DeWalt gun (sorry, don't have the model #), but it makes all the difference! Once I got my rhythm down, I found I could drive screws very quickly and more important, accurately, with just the right depth setting.
To expand this point, I think there are 4 things that make drywalling possible for the non-professional in today's world:
1. Drywall is delivered and stacked on each floor for you by these young guys who are as wide as they are tall.
2. Drywall lifts for placing ceiling drywall
3. The PC 7800 drywall sander.
4. Drywall screwguns
BruceM
I never spend more than $79.99 on a drywall gun.....Makita makes one with a "soft" nose, and a nice flat top for getting in corners and up against ceilings.
Haven`t met a gun that costs more that offers anything else.
That drywall lift is gonna come in HUGE. You may find yourself taking on some drywall jobs after using it.....it makes it THAT easy.
I use 1 1/4" screws for 1/2" rock....coarse thread for wood framing.
1" fine thread for metal framing.
I always use electrical tape to connect my gun to the extension cord. Knotting them together only increases what you get caught on.
Recess your screws just a tad.....if you break the paper, you`re setting them too deep.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
Typical drywall guns have a clutch that engages when you push in and an adjustable cup nose that gives you the depth control as mentioned above.
Drywall guns (not screwguns) have a much higher rpm as well, usually around 4000. They are a little difficult at first if you've never used a clutched tool like this, but once you start to get the hang of it, you can really fly. You feed the tool with a fist full of screws with the one hand and operate the tool with the other. When you really get good you can lock the trigger in place keeping the tool running while you just feed screws and let the clutch grab and zip them home fast as you can load them. I've seen some rockers keep up with the auto feeds.
I would get a corded screwgun if I were you, usually it's around 2500 rpm making it easier to use, the torque is higher on a screwgun and so you can use it for driving longer screws into wood or whatever, not just drywall. If you do decide to get a cordless, get the 18v and not the 14, it's a world of difference.
It took me a little while and practice to get the hang of using my drywall gun (DeWalt). I had previously used one of my cordless drills with a drywall bit and it worked well. No complaints. The usage difference between the two, for me, was quite substantial. The drywall gun was harder to get the hang of. The balance is different and initially I had problems setting the screws straight. A couple of times I thought, "Why do people like this stupid thing?!" Then an additional learning curve was learning to feed screws from a bunch in my hand. Overall, it took me quite a bit of practice before I felt confident. Now, I like it better. My point is that it may or may not be easy for you to get to where you feel comfortable with the gun. 120 sheets gives you a good bit of practice though. If you get too frustrated, the drywall bit in a drill isn't a bad option.Of course, once it's all hung, then the fun starts.
I am curious about the "drywall bit". I've been surfing the Internet and see drywall screws that are both sqaure and what appears to be standard Philps-style methods for bit-screw mechanics. Can I assume you are talking about the square-head, or were you refering to something completely different?
I was also looking on Senco's website regarding the autofeed system. I think someone mentioned they've used this. Anyone else try it? Anyone else make such a system? I thought DeWalt did, but could find info on it yet.
The drywall bit may go by another name, that's just how I know it. Dewalt makes one, others do also. You can buy them at Home Depot and Lowes. They're inexpensive. The bit is a regular Phillips head bit but it has a collar that's set so that only about 1/8" of the bit tip protrudes. When you use it to set a screw into drywall, the collar acts as a stop and automatically recesses the screw. No practice needed. Works nearly perfectly every time. With reasonable pressure, you can't overdrive the screw with it. If you don't let up when the screw is recessed, the collar just makes the bit chatter on the screw but it doesn't go in any farther. As I mentioned, until you practice a lot, the bit is easier than the drywall gun.Regarding the Senco Duraspin, do a search on this board for it. You'll get a variety of opinions. Most agree it's good for overhead work. After that, it seems like a toss-up. It's screws are a lot more expensive than regular ones.Just remembered....another thing that was hard to get used to on the corded drywall gun was the hand fatigue that resulted from the balance difference between it and the cordless drill. I'd run some screws in, then stop and let my hand rest before starting up again. Never had that problem with the drill because of how easily it balanced.Edited 12/15/2005 6:06 am ET by jdarylh1
Edited 12/16/2005 5:20 am ET by jdarylh1
I'll sell ya an older ... maybe 8 yrs old? Might be 10 ... DeWalt model ...
"slightly used" ...
picked it up years ago for one reason or another ...
it's been riding around in my van for at least 5 years of very limited use.
$50 ...
money back guarantee ... I'll even plug it in and make sure it still runs before I box it up!
if ya like ... I'll dig it out and check the model number ... at the time ... it was the top of the line model.
email me if U want the extra info.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
Not all drywall guns are created equal. I had the less expensive corded model from Dewalt--the one with a plastic nose. Then while working next to a buddy who had the upgraded model with the aluminum nose we switched and the difference was incredible. The clutch in mine demanded more force to engage the clutch and it was more difficult overall to get good results. His smoothly slid the screws into place with little effort. The difference was so dramatic that I bought the better gun and love it. If I didn't like you I'd offer to sell the crappy one.
Also, it hasn't been mentioned yet, but screw length is very important. To function properly, with little frustration, use the shortest screws that will get the job done. For 1/2" rock you'll be fine with 1-1/4"ers, but stay away from the 1-5/8". The extra torque required to fully seat the overly long screws makes uniform seating depth a problem. On hard framing lumber it can be a major problem, easily taking twice as long to go back and fully seat a large number of screws that should have been seated correctly in the first place.
Cheers,
Don
Also, it hasn't been mentioned yet, but screw length is very important. To function properly, with little frustration, use the shortest screws that will get the job done. For 1/2" rock you'll be fine with 1-1/4"ers, but stay away from the 1-5/8". The extra torque required to fully seat the overly long screws makes uniform seating depth a problem. On hard framing lumber it can be a major problem, easily taking twice as long to go back and fully seat a large number of screws that should have been seated correctly in the first place.
Glad to hear that 1-1/4" will work. I tried looking for 1-3/8" as someone else suggested, but they don't seem to exist. BTW, what about for 5/8" drywall, and if there is a room I am double-hanging? I think someone suggested using glue in addition to screws for ceiling application. Liquid nails?
When double hanging, it might interest you to know that wide crown staples can be used....meet code and are approved by the Gypsum industry.
I raised the Q. about staples here about 3 years ago after demo-ing a kitchen that was double hung (3/8" over 3/8") with staples. The board was a chore to get off....had been on the walls and ceiling for over 40 years.
Didn't get any significant input here, IIRC, but did finally get input from the Gypsum folks.
I've never put the method into practice, but it sure seems like it'd speed things up a tad.
On the screw guns; I don't do much DW, but went through the learning curve on the guns a few years ago...for some reason I caught on pretty fast....once you get it down, you can certainly drive screws faster than you can nail...I just use nails to set the board and, sometimes in tight spots where the gun doesn't allow a straight shot.
I bought a top of the line Milwaukee Screw shooter 10-12 years back. I got the super heavy 0-2500 model. I use it for the occasional dw job, but its great for all purpose work. I have driven tons of deck screws, and done a bit of drywall. I don't miss the speed at all, and its like having two tools for the price of one.
Glue = drywall adhesive, I use the version made by OSI and labeled simply as "Drywall Adhesive"; go with whatever your local drywall supply house recommends.
Double hanging - I hang layer 1 vertically with screws, layer 2 is hung horizonally with glue and screws ( glue beads go vertically between the studs). This will stagger the joints between the layers. Don't know exactly why the glue, but it's how I was taught and produces a very solid wall.
Screw length - I like at least 3/4" screw penetration into wood framing, so if hanging double 5/8", I would use 2" screws (5/8" + 5/8" + 3/4" = 2"). 1/2" DW = 1/2" + 3/4" = 1-1/4" screw. 5/8" DW = 5/8" + 3/4" = 1-3/8" - I err to the longer readily available screw length of 1-5/8".
Note: I am not good enough to use 2" screws with the "lock on and stab" method, so I have to do this one screw at a time, just me. This is obviously slower, but generally only a small area like a furnace / utility room.
Jim
Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
Nuke,1-1/4" coarse threaded screws work fine for 5/8" drywall to wood. Have some longer available for areas with punky wood or more than two drywall shims (cardboard strips, if you are in an area that does not have them).Bill
Most of our drywall subs, and the other guys who are better at hanging rock use a rock hammer and nails to tack a sheet in place, followed up by the screwgun.
Cheers,
Don
Nuke, I've owned a Hilti drywall gun since the mid eighties. They work great.
They have a very high rpm and get the job done quite efficiently. A good hanger (not me) can screw faster than a guy can nail. Those guys find a rythem that is unimaginable in my mind.
blue