Everyone,
I’m renovating a two story foyer and upstairs hallway. The plans include all new door casings (11 of them), base molding, wainscoting, etc. I’m making the casing from from 1×4.5 inch poplar — routing a bead on one side and an applied molding on the face. I’m also using 1x 4 poplar for the rails and stiles of the waincoating which will run both upstairs and downstairs. In short, I’m going to be using a lot of poplar and I’m going to have a lot of joints (butt and miter). Should I run the poplar stock through a thickness planer first to ensure it is all uniform? I don’t need any particular thickness, but I want all of the boards to be the same thickness so the joints are flush.
Thanks in advance for the input.
Frank R.
Replies
It wouldn't hurt but not totally necessary. If your worried about sanding out all your joints then it would be good idea, but it all depends on how you are installing your wainscoting. If you use pocket holes to connect the frame then you shouldn't have to worry to much about it because the pocket holes will allow you to keep everything close to flush. On the trim around the doors and such I would biscuit the corners and sand out the joints after its all installed. Of course if your trim package comes and its in horrible condition then I would plane it or more than likely send it back.
for the bang for the buck , the delta 13" 2 speed, it sounds like your ticket . its portable , its got enough power, buy an extra set of blades . and.... happy planing.
..
If you trying to justify purchasing a thickness planer to the wife then there is no way you can do this job without one. I'm very happy with my DeWalt 12", and quite seriously you need a good dust system with these things.
If not and you're buying pre-dimensioned lumber from a yard, then as a general rule if you buy from the same supplier, and as much as possible at the same time it should all pretty much the same thickness. Sometime when I buy from two different yards a 1x4 can vary by as much as 1/16th.
A good, five-inch random orbital sander makes quick work of any joints that aren't perfectly flush. Can't see this job justifying the expense of a thickness planer, especially since you'll probably be sanding most if the joints anyway.
A planer is one option. So is using a Kreg jig to pocket screw the joints together. Because the Kreg clamp registers on the face of the wood, it automatically flushes the joints pretty well.
Best case? Convince swmbo that you need both the planer and the Kreg jig. I'll vouch for the necessity if need be....
Andy
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig." Robert A. Heinlein
"Get off your dead #### and on your dying feet." Mom
Guys,
Thanks for all of the comments. (I didn't realize my attempt to justify a new tool purchase was so transparent. - did I mention there were 11 doors?) I am going to pocket screw the rail/stiles together. Unless there is some real benefit to planing all of the boards (e.g. eliminating sanding later), I just as soon not add another step onto the project.
Andy, I have the Kreg jig and an assortment of their clamps (which are all great) and I have a fairly complete tool collection/workshop for finish carpentry work. But I don't have a thickness planer. I thought the planer could put a clean face on the stock and reduce sanding later. I recall Gary Streigler mentioning that he ran his window stool stock through a planer to get it smooth before routing a cove/bead edge on it. I wasn't sure if that was standard procedure for him. I like his work, so I thought I would follow suit.
By the way, I just finished remodeling a large bedroom and, for the first time, I pre-assembled the door and window casings with biscuits, glue and Jim Chestnut's clamps. (I used casing from White River.) It is, by far, the best casing job I have ever done. Even my wife noticed (without prompting) that the miters were perfect. I'm certain there are plenty of guys on this site who can navigate an uneven wall and/or jamb one piece of casing at a tme and still get the miters tight. But, for my skill level, I got a much better result by getting the miters glued tight first, then dealing with the wall and jamb when I applied the pre-assembled casing to the door.
Thanks again.
Frank R.
Well, I know Gary pretty well. He's one of the nicest people on the planet, and he's also one of the worst tool junkies I know. So of course I quote him often to my wife. <G>
Mini-planers usually do a pretty nice job, but they don't completely eliminate the need for sanding. Nearly, but not entirely. If you're using paint grade poplar, I'd have to say that 80 grit disks on a R/O sander would do you just fine. Eighty grit might seem a bit coarse, but according to the Forest Products Lab, it produces the best "tooth" for paint adhesion. And the sanding goes quickly, and if you use a good paint, it will flow out smooth with no problem.Andy
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig." Robert A. Heinlein
"Get off your dead #### and on your dying feet." Mom
Frank
I've yet to see perfectly planed material used for doors or faceframes that did not need to be sanded once put together. I've built 1000's of cabinet doors, maybe 50 to 75 man doors and boat loads of face frame and all of it needed to be sanded once put together.
I've bisqueted, pocketed and mortised doors together, not any method mentioned will not need sanding, no way are you going to get pefect fitting joints everytime.
If your lumber is within 1/32-1/16" then planing it would be a waste of time.
Not telling you not to get the plane, hell by all means get it, you can always use it for other things.
I think Andy E mentioned it, you can put 80 grit on a ROS and sand after assembly, if your off by 1/16" it will only take a few seconds to sand it flush.
Doug
Doug and Andy,
Excellent advice. I'll skip the planer for now. I'll pick up a new blade for my scms and a few other items before I start the project, so I'll still get some new tools out of it.
Thanks again.
Frank R.
Get the Norton 3X disks. Homer carries them, and I've found them to cut faster and longer than most others.
And if you ever finish your house, for God's sake don't tell my wife.Andy
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig." Robert A. Heinlein
"Get off your dead #### and on your dying feet." Mom
It might be more critical to check your wood for cupping in addition to the surface roughness and thickness. One board cupped slightly one way, mated to another going the other is too time consuming to sand out.
Rather than take a deep cut, I'll often take a shallow cut on less critical baords that only takes 3/4 of the cupping out, and almost every board with have some. This 3/4 cut is quick to sand out, is easy on the planer, and gets the board close enough to work with.
You'll also find the planner speeds up a number of time consuming operations. On boards that aren't too wide, a quick trip through the planner will get rid of any saw marks. It may not be recommended, but I've never had a problem smoothing the edges of jambs for 2x4 or 2x6 walls as long as the cuts are straight.
Making door stop with only a table saw and router would be much harder since sanding these edges before routing isn't as easy as it sounds. The planer makes quick work of it. Many times you can alter the cut sequence when making parts so the planer can be used inbetween saw cuts to minimize the amount of sanding.
Personally, there is an inexpensive 12-1/2" Delta planner sitting next to the table saw on every interior finish job. The blades for this model are inexpensive, with some tlc it cuts very good for occational use. Home Depot sells them for under $250.
Having said all that, planning a house full of base doesn't sound fun.
Another tool that I recommend to all finish carpenters from beginners to full time veterans is a 6" porter cable sander with the psa disks. This sanding is available at Lowes for $110 or so and sands twice as fast as a normal orbital. The psa pad combined with this sander's larger orbit also sands much flatter. Finally, the variable speed allows it to be very gentle when needed.
For large flat areas, such as your jambs and base, I couldn't imagine not having the porter cable sander since it will litterally cut the time those jobs take in half. Half!
Good sanding
I agree about the planer, they are very handy. I've used them on timbers where we'd stick the planer on the end of a beam and somebody would walk along with it to make sure it didn't unplug itself. (and to catch it at the other end, snipe) gotta disagree about the psa discs. 'bout useless junk in my book. I use glued on paper discs I cut mostly from 100 grit floor paper. sand fast , don't plug up' cheap, and as the saying goes "last a long time". Jim Devier
...the psa discs. 'bout useless junk in my book.
The first sander I owned that had psa disks didn't seem to work for me so it was given away and that was that. Then a coworker who spent years building custom cabinets with air-powered 6" ro sanders let me in on the secret--just don't let the paper stay on the sander any longer than neccessary.
I would let the paper sit over night or longer and the disks would always be a nightmare to remove. Now I'd rather use PSA than hook and loop since the PSA sands so much flatter and isn't any harder to apply or remove. Bought in rolls of 100, the disks are also much cheaper.
:-)
i agree with the other posts, just sand your stock. on the other hand a new planer could be justified! by the way, the planer shavings work great on icy sidewalks and steps, doesnt mess up the carpeting the way icemelt does and it floats! just another advantage in case you need to persuade the wife!