In the trades in their such a thing as a remodel designer or wannabe architect?
I’m a pretty serious doityourselfer. I have remodeled one house and sold it and am now remodeling a second house. I very much enjoy this work, especialy the design part of it. But I don’t think I can go to 3 years of architecture school, then a couple a years working an an arch intern and still support my family. I currently have a desk job that pays very well, but it is not satisfying? Is there another path to follow to help others remodel and get paid very well, atleast $75k?
Replies
no
Brownbagg:Granted my question is likely nieve and even stupid, but could you elaborate so I may benefit from your experience. Thanks in advance.
no
no?
I don't exist then. I'm just a figment of my own imagination, which is very possible. Dad once told me I had a vivid imagination. But maybe Dad was a hallucination...;)
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no?
I don't exist then. I'm just a figment of my own imaginationyes but you are real good with metal roofs
and drywall screws
Some folks are just "designers" and the very top teir do well. They (mostly) have went to school, and work with archys or GC's.
What do designers get a degree in? Achitecture or something else?
I graditated HS, does that ccount?Do they offer a degree in reading customers minds to satisfy them?
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If you want to get rich, don't think about being an architect.
Other than that it's ok.
Edited 8/2/2006 10:00 pm ET by arrowpov
3 years of architecture school
try 6
couple a years working an an arch intern
try 3
then a minimum of a year working through the 9 part exam
and get paid very well, at least $75k
15 years into it, and i'm about 2/3 that
whatever you're doing now . . . keep doing it
Hi there. I don't have a whole lot to offer, but a little bit of experience. It's my belief, that if you don't go to school for architecture, you should really at least consider taking some classes and going out in the field and actually building stuff for a few (10?) years or so. I really don't think you can wrap your head around what it takes to effectively design homes or parts of homes for both style and function without more experience than a few of your own remodels.
I'm not trying to sh1t on your idea, but I'm just trying to answer realistically. That being said, I do know of 'designers' who are very good at what they do and are often a more cost effective solution than architects for some projects. I also know a few that do quite well at it too. But I don't know what is actually required, if anything, to call yourself a designer. Maybe it varies from region to region. I wouldn't guess the kitchen designers at Home Depot and the like have much experience other than a familiarity with the software they use. But then again... their designs often reflect that experience, or lack thereof, too.
I wouldn't plan on a couple night classes, two remodels under your belt..... and a 75K salary though.
In some states, it is illegal to even use the word designer in describing yourself unless you are licensed or certified.AIBD has a program for certifcation as a buiding designer.
The Kithchen and bath Asso has similar fdor specialistsin those specialties
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Thanks all for the reality check. I will continue to make a hobby out of it. The DW gets annoyed everytime I start ripping some part of the house apart making a mess. It would be nice if other people can volunteer their homes so I can make a mess there instead.
"In some states, it is illegal to even use the word designer in describing yourself unless you are licensed or certified."not designer, but architect or any variation (i.e., architectural designer, intern architect, etc.)'designer' is actually o.k. a silly rule, IMO . . . the stamp is what is legally binding
Check out Nevada. It's the first state where I couldn't have my name on the prints. Anywhere. They said it'd have to be listed as owner-designed. Made me nervous re copyrights, but the contract covers it and the design is pretty unique to the site and not easily reusable (he says with fingers crossed). Every other place me as "designer" has been fine, especially because we have stamped engineering on all projects.
part of the AIA's tilting at windmillseach state is different, but they're all heavily influenced by the AIA chaptersmore concern about bureaucracy and nomenclature rather than genuine improvement in the professionbtw -- i don't think anyone will ever confuse your designs with someone else's <g>
Edited 8/3/2006 11:29 am ET by draftguy
You'd be very wrong in the case of Nevada. It was instigated mostly by a small group from the American Society of Interior Designers, as part of protecting the "right to practice" for Interior Designers. Licensing Nevada Building Designers helped their coalition. It is one state where a very small group of practitioners has pretty much taken over the whole turf. You can't even be much of an independent kitchen designer without getting licensed, unless you work for a contractor.
interesting . . . it's a name game here for non-registered architects to figure out what to call themselves (building designer, project manager, intern graduate, etc.). As long as there's no 'a' word. 'Designer' is a common substitute.i know interior designers have been lobbying for years for some kind of licensing/registration requirement.do they have to pass a state exam?
I'm not sure about other states, but in Minnesota interior designers have to be certified. From the Minnesota Board of Architecture, Engineering, Land Surveying, Landscape Architecture, Geoscience and Interior Design:
The board examines, licenses, and regulates the practice of architecture, professional engineering,land surveying, landscape architecture, geoscience, and use of title for certified interior design. A person must be licensed before being permitted to offer professional services to the public, or certified before using the title "Certified Interior Designer."
They have a quarterly newsletter, and in every issue there's a list of people who got into trouble for various infractions. One of the more common offences seems to be people calling themselves architects when they aren't licensed.
" in Minnesota interior designers have to be certified. "Un fortunately, I've had to work with some interior designers who were certifiable;)
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Why do Interior Designers need to be licensed? What is the worst they can do, mix pastels with earth tones? Its not like they are dealing with anything structrual.
I find it interesting that many states now require a M.Arch to be licensed. but yet a few years ago you could be licensed with a B.S. Arch. And before that you needed even less formal education.
How are Frank Lloyd Wrights buildings, and other architects of his era, still standing considering may of them dident even go to architectual school? Its seems more politics of AIA and the universitys that want your money.
"Why do Interior Designers need to be licensed? What is the worst they can do, mix pastels with earth tones?"lol . . . not picking on the profession, but if you ever want to raise the hackles of an interior 'designer,' use the term interior 'decorator.' Not a big difference but hooeee . . . you'll see the carpet samples fly.Used to be that you didn't even need a degree to sit for the exam. You had to work in an architectural office for a dozen or so years, but you could sit for the test. Now they've made the restrictions harder, but dumbed down the test and doubled the price to take it . . .
Actually, there is a huge difference between an interior designer and a decorator. An interior designer determines the interior flow of a space - how everything fits together, and what's needed to make it work. A more precise definition of what they do might be interior architecture, in that it often involves structural decisions. They also have much to do with the aesthetics, including colour and textiles, but that is a much bigger job than that done by what my DXH (an architect) refers to as "the ladies in big hats", who generally have strong opinions on wallpaper and whether to go with a dining table from Hendredon or that nice little number from Ikea. I'm not an interior designer, but I've worked with many of them over the years -- they are very rarely flakes, and the flakes that are in the profession tend not to last very long. An example of what they do: right now, I work for a university that is moving an entire campus into its new, permanent home in a Bing Thom building (with luck, this link will take you to a spectacular aerial shot of the building: http://www.bingthomarchitects.com/home.html). The interior designer on this project started with the bare floor plates, and spent nearly three years planning and designing spaces that range from media-rich theatres to research labs to library to classrooms to where to put student lockers. Not a trivial job. Along the way, yes, she specified carpeting (space-age material, being used for the first time in Canada, chosen for many factors including moisture resistance, since the buildings electrical services are all carried through the floor), colours (as a path-finding strategy, as well as aesthetic considerations, and, in the case of the theatres, multi-media studios and some environment-controlled labs, for pigmentation characteristics) and furnishings - library, for example, needs seismically-braced bookshelves that Ikea just doesn't carry). Does the whole thing look nice? You betcha! For $70 million it had better look nice! But more importantly, does it function well? Don't know yet - the doors don't officially open until Sept. 8. Ask me in a year.
"Once you institutionalize thinking outside the box, it turns to dust in your hand." .
Gen. Michael Hayden
"Actually, there is a huge difference between an interior designer and a decorator"i know . . . just meant in the terminology (why i said i wasn't pickin' on 'em) :)Have worked with several in the past who have been great. They tend to get an unfair share of abuse in the pecking order of the construction related industry tho' . . .
that's OK, they earn it
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"Why do Interior Designers need to be licensed? What is the worst they can do, mix pastels with earth tones? Its not like they are dealing with anything structrual."If Interior Designers earn licensure, they will then be "Registered Design Professionals" under the building code. This is important for them because large interior design firms can then compete against architects as the Prime Professionals for large commercial space planning projects. HUGE money is at stake for large firms, and it's not surprising that there is a turf war, and millions have been spent on lobbying efforts.Certification and other title acts only protect usage of the term "Interior Designer" or "Certified Interior Designer", although anyone can still practice interior design under a title act. Practice Acts, which actually restrict those who haven't passed the official exam from working (as in Nevada), are the ultimate goal. The message that licensure of interior designers is necessary to "protect the health, safety, and welfare" of the public probably is convincing only to interior designers, but it's a necessary prerequisite to obtaining status as licensed professionals. Certification is just a step on the road to full licensure.ASID and other interior design organizations have convinced many members that the AIA is out to "restrict their right to practice" and licensure is absolutely necessary on that front. In fact, licensure (such as in Nevada) has put far more designers out of work than the AIA ever has or wanted to. (BTW, I am saying all of this as a full professional member of ASID who has even been president of an ASID chapter with more than 500 members. On this particular issue, I don't happen to agree with the diversional smokescreen that's being created.)
forgot to add . . . Ohio now requires a master's degree for registration (or a professional degree equivalent). A friend of mine here with a bachelor's took the exam (same exam), only for an Illinois registration, just to get a stamp. He passed it with no problems.He can theoretically stamp multi-story towers in the heart of Chicago or New York, but can't stamp a kitchen addition here. More craziness . . .
A few years ago, in PA and a couple three other states the archy association entered lawsuits to preserve that word design for themselves. Do you know if they failed? It had been their domain up until then when independent designers started getting popular.
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"A few years ago, in PA and a couple three other states the archy association entered lawsuits to preserve that word design for themselves. Do you know if they failed?"hadn't heard about that. i would be surprised it it passed though. Not so surprised if they attempted it, however. More puffery.
A few years ago, in PA and a couple three other states the archy association entered lawsuits to preserve that word design for themselves. Do you know if they failed? It had been their domain up until then when independent designers started getting popular.
They were all over the word "design" here in NJ in the early 90's- we got several "cease and desist" letters from the State Board of Architects because our trucks have the phrase "project planning and design" on them. So, we just pulled off the vinyl lettering for the "and design" part, and continued doing what we were doing. Everything we did the preliminary design work for was eventually given to an architect for construction drawings and sign/seal, but they wanted to keep us from even doing the preliminary stuff.
Once the marker picked up, they stopped harrassing the contractors. Who knows what'll happen if it ever slows down again.
Bob
the way I did that was to spend thirty some years in the trades, then startremo/reno some very nice homes because people trusted me and knew my quality of work. After awhile, they learned that my solutions to design needs and requirtements were often more satisfactory than proposals from fully versed and vested architects.
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Entry level pay for a remodelor/designer is 100k.
who would want to take a paycut?
I won't pizz on your fire dude... do'n what you enjoy is worth alot... I'm not sure how much but it has to be worth something...
I hate say'n never but... I never have (yet) done construction work for anyone but me (except the few times I've built out spaces for my tenants at their expense and that was just cause i hated see'n em get screwed) and one time a contractor friend called me and begged me to do 2 jobs he'd way over bid because he was working out of town and had no one else to turn to, and he knew i was a whore when it came to jobs i could knock out in 2 days and clear 6 figures....
I happen to like every phase of construction from the dirtwork to the finishout... I like complete design control, I like the planning I even like see'n if a bank will lend me money to do what i like to do...
so over the years i aquired everything from dirt move'n equipment & dump trucks, trowel machines to asphalt pave'n equipment, hammers, nailguns, metal working equipment, welders to zeroturn mowers to cut the grass when i'm done...
I'm maybe a designer, I'm not a contrator... i like to think I'm a builder... but since I have no real title or training I stick to one customer... me...
I'm not a fine craftsman like those on this board who can make wood do things that only god knew that it could... but I'm better than most who claim to be all that i know i'm not... I'm slow at times... real slow other times...
so i guess I'm just a blown up DIY er and i've managed to feed my kids do'n it...
p
If you've decided that "at least $75K" is the threshold for you to be comfortable? Stick with what you do. Maybe keep the hobby going and growing until it either becomes too much and you have to scale back, or it becomes a full fledged remodeling company that can pay the bills.
If you could corner a large sample of Contractors and ask some pointed questions, you would learn that for most, it was a long and winding path to actually making $75K a year. SOme never do and some blow right by that and the sky is the limit for them.
Don't be fooled by cashflow. When I worked for myself, if I generated about $80K a year, I made about $55K a year.
Here in Michigan you could become very sucessful doing design work. You could start today with no training and probably do well, if you have a talent.
Designers have limits that Architects don't.
Most of the plans that we build off are done by designers. For the most part, they are very buildable.
Many of the plans that I've built off that were done by architects had serious problems. I counted more than 50 instances of poor design or poor techinque by one architect on one set of plans. Every one of the 50 items would have cost ME money (as the framer).
blue