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I will be installing 10″ – 12″ wide pine t&g flooring in new construction. Question is in my great room. Room is 17′ x 30′. floor joists run long way underneath, resting on girder in middle. Sub floor is 3/4″ OSB. Flooring supplier tells me that I should face-nail planks this wide as well as nailing into tongue to prevent cupping.
My original intent was to run planks long way in room. Problem is that this keeps me from face nailing into joists. Will OSB hold face nails without popping? Or will running planks short way (perpendicular to joists) give a better visual effect anyway. Maybe running length of room will make it look too long and skinny?
Your thoughts are appreciated.
P.S. Though about blocking joists below with nailers, but really don’t have time. My better half doesn’t want to wait much longer to get into house, and I have insulation contractor coming in within a few days.
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Johnny, Your flooring supplier is correct on needing to face nail your floor. Wider flooring also has more movement across the grain than narrower flooring so be prepared for edges opening a closing seasonally. You cannot rely on OSB as a subfloor; it does not hold nails well at all, either faced nailed or edge nailed. It does not hold screws either which would be another option, screwed and plugged.
The reason for running flooring perpendicular to joist has more to do with support. There can be a detectable sponginess between floor joist with the flooring, as well as the eventual loosing of fasteners due to increased movement.
One solution would be to run your flooring diagonally or maybe a herringbone pattern. You could edge-nail it for install purposes and come back and face nail into your joists when completed. I would spline my end joints and edge-nail them as well. If you wanted you could run a border first around the room and at entrys which could be screwed and plugged, especially on your border running parallel to the joists. The herringbone pattern would help deflect from the linear feel of the room.
walk good david
*I agree with David. I'd lay it perpendicular to the joists if it were my own home. Or, if you really have your heart set on running it the other direction for visual effect, you might consider sleepers on top of the subfloor.
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Eureka! Why didn't I think of sleepers on top instead of blocks underneath? I guess it's too logical.
Now it is a question of aesthetics. Do you think laying planks long way will make room look too long and narrow?
Will 5/4" sleepers suffice?
Many thanks,
Johnny
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What one person considers to be too long and narrow will be different from the next one's perception. Your room is plenty big, I wouldn't feel that way at all.
If you put down sleepers, gunk them down good with construction adhesive and screw them tight. If the floor is out of level at all, this is the time to fix it. 5/4 should be fine above your subfloor. How will you deal with the extra height at doorways?
*He could add the thickness of the sleepers to his trimmers. 'Dog - you got any suggestions for a flash attatchment for my camera? Thanks - Jim
*Yes Jim, but what about the floor being so much higher in this room than adjoining ones?give me an 'e, I'll try to help with your camera question.'Dog
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Actually a step down into adjoining rooms, with 5'-6' wide entryway. No doors there, so transition would not change drastically Only a 6' sliding patio door to outside to contend with. If I do it that way, I will have to raise that door. This wouldn't be that tough, because rough opening was originally for a higher door, and then I chose a shorter one. Carpenter then filled in gap with 2x's.
Your suggestions give me at least more time to breathe and think about what I will do (at least until kitchen cabinets arrive).
As I go through this project, I realize the importance of "beginning with the end in mind". That is why I am glad that I found this site. I have been reading for 1+ year, and have become a fan of you guys. As one who does some projects himself, but leaves most "big stuff" to the pros, I appreciate the information/advice that you (and my tradesmen) have given without charge. Helps make a "house" a "home"
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I'd consider either dropping one set of joists, or furing the others so that all floors are level.
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This is a renovation project. Center of house is original, on slab. Rooms on each side are new construction, with full basements. Foundations were poured on each side of slab with top of foundation wall at same height as top of slab. We were going to lay p.t. sleepers on slab, and then joists to bring slab up to level of new construction. (Sounds crazy, but many changes occured in the field). Building inspector rejected this premise on the grounds that this constituted a crawlspace, which by code must be 18" from top of slab to bottom of joist. So we ended up with original slab floor about 11" lower thatn new construction (after 2x sleepers and 3/4" subfloor.
The result: a sunken living room in center of house with 9 1/2' ceiling, which actually doesn't look bad at all (a friend thought it was planned).
I hope that this description explains to you, Jim, that while your suggestion is perfectly logical, that it doesn't apply here. Had I known in advance what was underneath the onion once I began to peel it, I would have torn the whole darn house down and built new. Instead, I was left with an incredibly good case of hindsight, and a wallet that was about $8,000 thinner very early in the game. But so it goes.
If I add 5/4 sleepers (and perhaps 1/2" underlayment?) to one side, and adjust one door height, I just might be able to pull off your original suggestion, and no one would be the wiser from one side of the house to the next. But I have to take a closer look in the field, and see what else might be effected. Or, just say frig it and run floor planks perpendicular to existing joists.
Some lessons learned are expen$ive, and the most difficult part of the ordeal was having to make a quick decision in the field, else lose a framer, roofer, plumber, etc. in middle of one of the busiest seasons ever, and leave the job at a standstill.
A word of caution: if a pro recommends you tear the whole thing down and build new, give it serious thought. You may end up saving a whole lot of money. What's left of my original house isn't worth spit, and saving it probably delayed move-in by about 2 months.
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A word of caution in return - don't be quick to take the advice of those who say "tear that thing down and start over". In many cases, they are saying that because the very thought of a total remodel is daunting to many folks while the idea on building new is fairly straight forward, albeit not easy.
Old houses have a charm and flavor that only the very best of designs can emulate. Even an ordinary home from the 40s, if well maintained, or tastefully refurbished, makes us take notice by striking some chord deep within us, some type of societal echo or something. God help us when all that's left are the tracts that sprang up after WWII, with their assembly line faces and garage dominated designs.
Give me an old timer to fix up anyday. You might be able to build a new house cheaper, but you'd be hard pressed to build a new one with the flavor or style of one of the old timers cheaper.
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Agreed, Jim. I should have mentioned that my house was basically an old hunting shack made of cement block, with 0% character. Turned out that it didn't even have footings under slab! You would laugh if you saw what was left of the original structure. I was basically too stubborn to listen to the pros, and it cost me (I thought they were only telling me to demolish because it would be easier for them).
I too would take an old-timer to fix up, provided it were structurally sound.
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I will be installing 10" - 12" wide pine t&g flooring in new construction. Question is in my great room. Room is 17' x 30'. floor joists run long way underneath, resting on girder in middle. Sub floor is 3/4" OSB. Flooring supplier tells me that I should face-nail planks this wide as well as nailing into tongue to prevent cupping.
My original intent was to run planks long way in room. Problem is that this keeps me from face nailing into joists. Will OSB hold face nails without popping? Or will running planks short way (perpendicular to joists) give a better visual effect anyway. Maybe running length of room will make it look too long and skinny?
Your thoughts are appreciated.
P.S. Though about blocking joists below with nailers, but really don't have time. My better half doesn't want to wait much longer to get into house, and I have insulation contractor coming in within a few days.