Replies

1. 
   Guest_ | Mar 28, 1999 07:06am | #1

   *
   Cost difference? 13-18% more in CT.

   Do they make it easier to square a wall? I don't think it's too tough to square a wall as it is. Just save some of the straighter stock for the top plates.

   Are they "better"? If you have to frame one of those cookie-cutter 2-story "great rooms" that seem standard in todays houses, sure, a dead-straight 18' 2x is a thing to behold. A wall of them is in plane, no bowing/twisting to worry about. That's an application where I feel they are worth it. If you really want to get picky, you could use them in the bath for walls to be tiled. Consider also in the kitchen for flat walls to hang cabinets on, although the drywallers will take some of that flatness away when they mud.

   The longer and straighter the required stock, the more their "value" increases. IMO, a whole house application may be overkill.

1. 
   Guest_ | Mar 29, 1999 01:41am | #2

   *A while back, someone tried to sell us some Laminated studs. I believe they were made by Truss-Joist corporation. They cost almost exactly twice what typical studs were going for at that time. They suggested using them in kitchen walls only, as Gabe suggested. I'm sure there are more than one brand of these out there. But I've never actually seen one used.

1. 
   Guest_ | Mar 30, 1999 01:55am | #3

   *Don't start with that straight stuff. Soon, everyone wilwant straight wall everywhere!enjoying the rolling seas,Blue

1. 
   Guest_ | Mar 30, 1999 09:23pm | #4

   *A local yard has finger jointed or Timberstrand stud for about 1 or 2 dollars more than regular studs. For walls where you are hanging cabinets or for tall walls it would be cost effective, especially if straight conventional studs are hard to come by. Out here on Long Island, the material quality varies a lot from week to week even at the best lumber yards.

1. 
   Guest_ | Apr 16, 1999 09:38pm | #5

   *Gerald,"...these studs make it easier for the framers to square a wall..."What?"... and when the wall is squared, the rest of the construction ends up better..."Duh! But only if the foundation is level do perfectly square walls work perfectly. (that "duh" is directed at the program, not you Gerald)Theoreticly, the only studs that would have any bearing on squaring a wall would be the end ones... and I hesitate to say that because you measure from plate to plate anyway. Toenail the bottom plate to the line snapped on the floor showing where the wall goes. Make sure it's on the line along the entire legnth of the wall (not just on the ends and wavy in the middle).Make sure all the studs are tight to the plates. You now have two parallel straight lines. Measure diagonals. Tap to square, toenail the top plate in a couple of places. Check it for square again and sheath it.Maybe these guys "square" a wall with a four foot level after it's standing. Meaning that they were refering to plumbing the wall. Don't use a four foot level to plumb walls, use a plumb bob or at least an eight foot level. Plate to plate.Perhaps ecologicly, engineered studs may be better -- the Pacific NW is pretty torn up. As well as the rest of the west. They are straight, so they'd be great for cabinet walls. Also great for long spans as Mongo says ("My, what a great room -- what do you call it?"). I usually have someone cull through the lumber when it arrives separating the studs into perfect, good, ok and crappy. The crappy ones go back. the perfect ones are used for door trimmers and king studs, the good ones are for wall studs, the ok ones get used in the garage if we haven't returned the crappy ones yet. Next bundle arrives, good ones go to kitchen walls and interior doorways...They may save labor in that you don't need to cull through your lumber, but I usually have someone do that at the beginning while I'm checking the elevations of the foundation and doing preliminary framing stuff. PBS you say? Which show?Dan Morrison

2. 
   Woodchip | Apr 17, 1999 05:46am | #6

   *
   Plumb bob? Who has time to wait for a plumb bob to stay still.. I hired a guy who started to use a plumb bob to hang a door and allmost fired him because I couldnt stand to wait for his darn bob to stop movin. Took him allmost half an hour to set a bare frame with that dopey bob. I have a plumb bob I never use, the strings gettin tangled up in my other hand tools.. bought it 20 years ago. Get a darn stick level and be done with it. Well......unless your gettin paid hourly like my assistant was.

3. 
   Guest_ | Apr 17, 1999 09:27pm | #7

   *
   You probably should can anyone who uses a plumb bob to set a door...

   But It doesn't take that much time to plumb your exterior walls with one. Then you know it's right.

   Dan

1. 
   Guest_ | Apr 18, 1999 03:22am | #8

   *Do you blokes cripple your studs?

1. 
   Guest_ | Apr 18, 1999 03:56am | #9

   *Not intentionally , but if a stud is badly crippled we usually shoot him (just kidding Mark ). Seriously we call the short studs under window sills cripple studs ,at least where I'm from .I think the terminology is kind of regional.For example what we call trimmers alot of people call jack studs etc. Chuck

1. 
   Guest_ | Apr 18, 1999 06:46am | #10

   *Yup. . . first we king em', if it's too(o) short then we jack em', and if it's still too(o) short then we cripple em'. . . makes the day move along.

1. 
   Guest_ | Apr 18, 1999 06:12pm | #11

   *Dan, I apprenticed with a guy who culled too, but not too the degree that you do.I now have learned to cull, "as I go". I can feel a bad stud, as I begin to nail it. If it is landing on a door, I switch it, to and intermediate stud.Carrying these around to another room is carying it too far for me. Thank goodness, I was sane enought to resist my mentors training! Oh yeah, about the bad ones: One thing that I emphasize to the rookies is that a good carpenter knows where to use the inevitable "bad stuff". As you probably know, mills are allowed to include a 20% error in their grading. That means that 20% will be "bad". If a stud is truly bad, it gets whacked in half, on the spot. It will then become a block for something. Bad linial is used for bottom plates. After toenailing the plate to the line, it miraculosly becomes "good"!Real bad linial is reserved for brick rack blocks (usually 12" or less in length). I have noticed a tendency for the posters to try to make the kitchen's perfect, at the expense of the rest of the house. I prefer the mixed method; nothing too perfect, nothing too bad.fence sitting again,Blue

2. 
   Guest_ | Apr 19, 1999 08:45am | #12

   *I don't cull them, rookie does. I'm usually busy thinkin' at that stage of the game. It's good way to keep 'em busy... Since I'm paying for the lumber I prefer to return it if possible. Crappy lineal does bend wonderfuly into straight bottom plates though doesn't it?It also seems like there's always enough crap for blocking without cutting perfectly crappy studs in half...Doesn't sitting on the fence kind of bother your better side?Dan

3. 
   Guest_ | Apr 20, 1999 12:41pm | #13

   *Sorry different terminology again. We call studs under sills " Jacks ". Crippling refers to straighting studs by partialy cutting through them, then driving a wedge into the cut to pull the stud straight and finally cleating either side to reinforce the stud.

4. 
   Guest_ | Apr 21, 1999 06:30am | #14

   *MarkBleu would call that a i waste'o timeAlthough I've done it a time or two meself, I won't say what I call it. . . this being a family show and all, what with some ladies present

5. 
   Guest_ | Apr 21, 1999 07:42am | #16

   *Here's tip to teach your rookie how to be more productive. Show him the plans and have him start laying out the garage wall, and then build it!Do that the first day on the job!Blue

4. 
   Gerald | Apr 21, 1999 07:42am | #15

   *
   While watching a PBS homebuilding show, the framers were touting the benefits of engineered wall stud. Supposely, these studs make it easier for the framers to square a wall and when the wall is squared, the rest of the construction ends up better.
   The program did not discuss the costs of the engineered studs. While I have not compaired prices yet, I am sure that the engineered studs cost more.
   My question..Does the benefits ofter by the engineered studs outweight the added cost? And, what is the difference in cost between a 2x engineered stud and the traditional stud? Thanks