In my work our 2X4 stud walls stand, some of them 2 or 3 months because the buildings are pretty big and it takes a while to get them closed in. This, of course, causes warping. The other day one of the other managers asked me if I had any objections to using 20 ga. 3 5/8 metal stud solely on the next project. Now we build a hybrid: perimeter in metal and partitions in wood. I never thought I would say it but I agreed, Then I got to thinking – We’re paying 11 dollars for a 10′ metal stud. And I think between 3 and 4 dollars for a 2X4. Why not just get a better grade of 2X4. I called two of our vendors today and neither was much help. One suggested finger jointed 2X4 but said I would have to buy units of 300 studs at a time. And he would have to by 3500 studs, a product he normally doesn’t carry. And will these hold up? My question is: Is metal my only alternative or are there some wood products that will hold somewhat stable?
Edited 6/21/2005 9:21 pm ET by quicksilver
Replies
I can't help with your answer but you've got my curiosity up. I'm thinking stopping at my drywall supply and see what their 10's go for. Man that's a steep difference.
I've used the fj studs in the past and would be suspect they could see weather that long and not f.u. too.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
We manufacture and sell finger jointed lumber. But we don't sell tons of studs.
I think it's primarily because they look like hell. As you well know, not every 2X4 is the same size. So the edges of the boards aren't exactly aligned. And weathered boards are often joined in with non-weatherd ones.
And there's always the perception that they're just gonna fall apart after a while.
Personally, I like 'em. Most of them are straighter than your average stud. And once the drywall is on nobody will know the difference.
I tried breaking a couple of them, just for the heck of it. In my highly un-scientific tests, they were fairly easy to break when laid down flat. (Both ends on a block, and my big a$$ standing on them)
But I wasn't able to break 'em when they were standing up on edge. So I think they're fine as long as there's some sheathing attached to them.
I believe I noticed at the lumber dealer that one of the engineered lumber product companies know has a complete line of wood products including studs. TJI maybe? Anyway, it is a lamenated product. Floor and roof joists, studs, headers, the whole package.
Not particularly useful in my old house, but I'll look again next time I'm in there if you want some more details.
quicksilver,
in the standard spf stud group, fir is stronger and staighter than pine or spruce. it costs a few pennies more, but since i see you're in DC, maybe try Gallagher and Hughly on Blair Road, or you could pay a little more and go to Smoot Lumber in Alexandria.
Jack, Thanks for the input. G&H is certainly the place for fir redwood or cedar, you can walk right next door and handpick from Martin Wiegand. Ken Treadway is great to work with. You have to be a glutton for punishment to deal with Smoot, although they do have nice boards. Our everyday vendor is TW Perry. I ws hoping to find something in betwwen a spruce stud and fir, at least the clear fir I'm used to, but then again next to an eleven dollar metal stud, it could be the way to go. I'll call Ken tomorrow. Thanks
"in the standard spf stud group, fir is stronger and staighter than pine or spruce."Fir (mostly Subalpine Fir in the West and Balsam Fir in the East) is the weakest member of the SPF group.Douglas-fir (not a true fir) is far stronger members of the SPF group (except for the Alaskan Spruces which are forced into a weak group even though they are quite strong).Southern Pines are actually stronger than most other softwoods and are not a member of the SPF group. The order from strongest to weakest is basically this:SP (Southern Pine), DFL (Douglas-fir, Larch), HF (Hemlock, Fir), SPF (Spruce, Pine, Fir). Fir is the weakest member of the weakest group.
I frequently use FJs, they are generally truer (with the caveat from BossHog - but ignore his comment about looking like hell. Who'll see inside once they're closed in). And it's a good way to reduce mill wastage. There are ads running in FHB - TrusJoist comes to mind where they proclaim "the best way to get a 10' stud free of warps and splits may be to cut one of our 20'ers in half" - or similar brands.
cheers
***I'm a contractor - but I'm trying to go straight!***
"with the caveat from BossHog - but ignore his comment about looking like hell. Who'll see inside once they're closed in"
The HO sees them before they're closed in. And they frequently have no idea what they're looking at or what it means. All they care about is that they look terrible.
If the HO is paying the bills, you can't completely ignore what they think.
First say to yourself what you would be, then do what you have to do. [Epictetus]
Aren't there something called "timberstrand" studs or something like that that are like LSL joists, but are studs? I thought I saw them advertised somewhere and are often used where straight framing is really important, like in kitchens.
Info on Timberstrand studs here.
TrusJoist Page 2-3 JLC Feb 05
Page 36-37 FH May 05 http://www.trusjoist.com
20' length in mag don't know if you can get specific lengths.
Thank you all for your input. I'll let you all know how things fare.
Metal saves you on the labor."Logic, like whiskey, loses it's beneficial effect when taken in too large quantities." Lord Dunsany
But when I hit it with my hammer claw it makes a terrible sound and my hammer falls to the floor. Although I have ####metal cutting circ saw called an Evolution, marketed by MK. That thing is frickin' amazing. I ripped a 13' piece of 3/8'' plate steel with it the other day. Took about ten minutes. Most of that was do to poor power. What's up with sparky I can't get him to run a circuit that's powerful enough, After that thread on MDF (still up in the air) I'm going to want to run my Festool vac with the plunge cut saw for the base, but that takes a lot of power. He said something like they don't have three wire in the building. I said run some. I NEED MORE POWER.