Borrowing: How do you feel about it?
I’m usually pretty cautious about lending or borrowing tools, trucks or other equipment. In general, I’ll only loan to relatives, close friends or the guy I’m working with at the time.
And I follow that path when I need to borrow something. There have been acceptions when I’ve made a barter deal in order to use a machine for a specific time but that’s a bit different…no favors owed in the end.
So my question is…how do you feel about borrowing or lending and what do you expect in return?
For instance: Your boss decides that he wants to ride his bike to work as a regular effort to become fit. So now, when he needs a vehicle to go get lunch for the crew, he asks to borrow your van or he asks you to go pick it up. Let’s say that this happens two-three times a week. Do you go along with it? If you do…what, if anything, to you expect from the boss?
Replies
FREE LUNCH!!
No you can't borrow my van. yes I'll drive you to lunch as long as you buy mine too.
"Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
No you can't borrow my van. yes I'll drive you to lunch as long as you buy mine too.
Any particular reason that you won't loan the boss your van? Is it based on some bad experiences, loaning a vehicle, or what?
If it is a company supplied van, then he can borrow it. If it is a personal vehicle, maybe I'll let you borrow it once to get out of a pinch, but not on a regular basis."Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
"You're Buyin', I'm Flyin'!"
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I have worked at a job site where I would make runs for materials or what have you.
At first I liked it but after a while I realized I had really been demoted in the pecking order of the crew. You don't send the guy you like to work with or the guy who's the money maker off to get stuff.
Besides they always think you were goofing off when you get back. I say bull.
I'd talk to him about it. He should come with you and then you aren't demoted to the gopher guy but promoted to the bosses friend.
At first I liked it but after a while I realized I had really been demoted in the pecking order of the crew. You don't send the guy you like to work with or the guy who's the money maker off to get stuff.
That may not have been the case. Maybe the boss was sending you because he thought you were reliable and smart enough to know how to "plan B" around an unexpected problem.
Besides they always think you were goofing off when you get back.
That's the other guys on the crew, not the boss. They'll always say that, even if you're back in ten minutes.
perhaps you are sent for lunch because the boss trusts you not to spit in his food when you pick it up!!!, LOL.
I do feel for your situation---- 25 years ago i worked in a small shop for 6-7 years-- foreman sent me out to get his lunch almost every day--NEVER bought my lunch( I brought my own)--- I felt making the lunch run at age 27 was demeaning-and i sympathise with your situation.
If i was regularly asking an employee to run errands in THEIR vehicle--there should be some reciprocity- I buy his lunch, I comp him a fill up periodically, I give him some materials for his own projects-some sort of mutually agreeable reciprocity.
stephen
I have a guy that lives near the lumber yard, I usually send him on the way in in the morning. just logisitcs really."it aint the work I mind,
It's the feeling of falling further behind."Bozini Latinihttp://www.ingrainedwoodworking.com
Well, how about looking at it another way.
Your boss isn't going to be riding his bike onto the jobsite for too much longer; it's going to start getting cold and dark and unless he's an awfully dedicated cyclist he's going to be driving to work.
Still, whether it's for the rest of the balmy fall, or for next year, why not suggest to him that he park his truck at the site? He can drive in on Monday with his bike, ride home, ride back in the next day, and then continue the cycle until he wants to drive home. Maybe it's Tuesday, maybe it's Friday. But at least his truck is where it's needed for work. On the off chance that he's got a spare vehicle, it's even easier on him.
And if it helps get him going in the right direction, he can get a bed rack for his bike like this: http://tinyurl.com/2focd2
I've got one of those racks, but finding what to do with the front wheels is a pain. I guess I have to spring for two of those forks, unless I can come up with something else.
I just toss my front wheel in the truck bed if it's a short trip. Otherwise it goes in the trunk in the bed. That's such a good idea, I'm surprised it took Honda so long to come up with it.Absent that, yeah, get one of the extra forks for the wheel. They are handy.
http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=3702&subcategory_ID=4413
I've got a universal mount, this one fastened to a sheet of plywood that's cut to fit in the bed of my truck. I can slide the plywood back to make mounting the bike easier.
I'm not a big fan of lending tools, because I've seen too many get busted. Autos and trucks are the same, but even worse because of the potential liability if there's an accident. One of my tenants just lent her new car to a niece for a wedding 3 hours away. She had the car about a week and the girl missed a stop sign and got creamed.
I'm going through something similar right now. I got a used car trailer about a month ago. Figured it would be dual purpose for bigger tools and big toys. Took it to NY to pick up my hot rod (48 Chevy). A lady that used to be married to one of my cousins sees the trailer and tells me her boyfriend needs it to drive down to North Carolina to get a car. I told her I had no idea how it even rode, suggested he might be better off renting one. Last week, I go back up (without the trailer) and I get a second hand message that he will drive down to VA, pick up the trailer and bring it back when he's done. Huh? I met the guy once. To the best of my knowledge, he drives a Buick - never even saw him drive a truck. But he wants me to trust him with 4-5000# behind him on an 1500 mile trip...on my insurance.
Small stuff, like lunch, as an occasional thing, I will use the truck. If it happens too often, I'd say enough - especially if there's no thanks back. Somebody else drive it? Not likely. That's just taking advantage.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
To the best of my knowledge, he drives a Buick - never even saw him drive a truck. But he wants me to trust him with 4-5000# behind him on an 1500 mile trip...on my insurance.
I've seen some really dumb things done with trailers, even a fatal loading accident. I wouldn't trust anyone but an experienced professional driver with a car trailer.
The rental places have contracts and high priced insurance to protect them, and they often force renters to buy additional coverage.
BTW, there are plenty of car transporter companies. They'll bid on any car move. They're on the web.
I know about the rental company rates. U-Haul wanted about $450 to rent me a car carrier before I got mine. I never got a price from a car carrier company, figured it would be at least $700-800. It was easier for me to get the trailer; had a buddy that has no place for it.
I told him I needed it and offered him $500. He handed me the regi on the spot, wouldn't take a dime. He knows that if he ever needs it back, I'll drive it up the next day. Then again, I just gave him a brand new 48" shower base that I couldn't use and told him I'll tile his new bathroom whenever he's ready. He's one of my closest friends - I'd even let him borrow my truck! :-)
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
Did ya get my e-mail? talk about borrowing trucks -glad ya broached the subject --
just kidding.
Boyfriend of your cousins ex ... that's stretching things a bit."Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
Never lend my work van or truck out EVER!!!!! Some tools and to only a select few that I trust. Sometimes I forget who borrowed what. Now I write it all down.
-Lou
We were friends with another couple, They needed a car, I lent them my car for one month , I drove them To Portland, An hour and one half away from here to buy a car, a month later i asked to drive it to see how it drove around the block, I got an icy stare and was told there insurance did not allow anyone driving there car, They beat the pizz outta my car to
Case histories:
Loaned my chain saw to an engineering 'mentor' in 1977. He filed the BACK of the teeth. Last time I ever loaned a chain saw.
Loaned a dozer 3 times.
1st was the D2 to first boss, circa 1975, he spun a bearing on the pony engine, he fixed it (quite another story), all well and good.
2nd time was to co-worker, broke the D2 cross spring, he also fixed it with some help from me, OK.
3rd time, circal 1985, son of deceased friend that died with me owing him a few favors, loaned JD 440 dozer to him. He did not watch stuff very well. 55 gal fuel tank and pump stolen, all my chains stolen. Ran it so hard blew one injector and sheared tabs of reversing clutch plates. He did replace one chain. Debt paid, OK.
Licensed cars, trucks, vans, etc are different, just future junk, so lend anytime for a full tank of gas. Did I say my newest was an '87 <G>
Loaned dump truck to asst. scout master once, somehow the clutch got stripped?
Anyway, have not loaned anything to anybody for the last 20 years except lic. vehicles to relatives.
If my kids want to borrow something, I just give it to them. Just gave oldest son 12 V Makita and Dewalt today <G>.
Grandson wanted to borrow my fiberglass Werner class III ladder last fall, I simply gave it to him, now I can borrow it back as needed <G>
EDIT PS: Oldest Grand-daughter already has said if she gets married to someone with apiece of land she'd like to have the backhoe <GGGG>
Edited 9/24/2007 10:15 pm ET by junkhound
If my kids want to borrow something, I just give it to them.
That's an interesting idea. Eliminates the worry and pretty much guarantees that they'll take better care of it than if you'd just loaned it to them. Then, if you need it, you can borrow it back.
Sounds simple enough. Lemme know how it works when you need that nice ladder. Kid might not know what it's worth and trade it for a keg of beer or whatever.
I haven't worked for anyone in a while...but when I did, if I was using my own vehicle for his projects, I was being compensated for it.
Most of the guys I worked for, recognized the fact that I could just as easily drive up to a jobsite in a Honda Civic. So they understood that if I was driving my truck/van, and it was going to be used for their projects, they were going to help foot the bill.
Whether it was 2 x 4s or subway sammiches....they were paying.
So I wouldn't have been "loaning" anyone anything.
Loaning tools is another animal altogether....but I probably trust friends and family less with them than I do coworkers or neighbors.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
My answers are generally:
No.
I said no.
In case you weren't listening, I said no.
What are ya, freakin' deaf?
I was taught that if I borrow something, it goes back in the same condition, or better. Dirty and/or rusted? Cleaned and lubed. I break it, I bought it and it will be replaced with equal or better. If it's just a part, that gets replaced.
I have loaned things and almost every time, they either dinged it, lost it, broke it or returned it way after they said they would. The other thing that drives me nuckin' futz is when someone goes into my tools and takes something without asking or telling me that they did it. Then, I end up wasting all kinds of time looking for it and they can't think enough to know why I'm pizzed off and making a big stink. One guy I work with occasionally absolutely refuses to bring all of what he will need into a job. He thinks making 50 trips to the van won't waste any time and has told me that I don't need to bring any of my tools when we go to a job. After the first one, I bring everything. He has no ability to think ahead, apparently. He thinks his way is the only way and gets really wigged out if I do it differently and usually, better.
Sorry for the rant, this touches a nerve for me. With a spike. That has electricity connected to it. Like a yapping dog.
Thanks for the clear insight, Highfish.
I was brought up with the same basic rules about borrowing including returning a borrowed item as soon as you're done using it. Borrow a wrench, tighten the nut and return it immediately with a polite "thank you".
This last was the law in our house so when, in the third grade, we got to subtraction and the teacher started talking about "borrowing" ten from the column to the left, my immediate concern was "when do you pay it back?"
"Oh you don't have to pay it back," replied the sweet young teacher.
"Yes you do," I said with conviction, "otherwise it's stealing."
The teacher just laughed at that one and went on with her explanation to the rest of the class.
That matter got straigtened out between my mother and the principal, the following day. From then on "borrowing" was out and "taking" was the accepted way to express that concept.
"Yes you do," I said with conviction, "otherwise it's stealing."Could have been a gift. I agree- "borrow" is a really mis-used word. I also left out the part about thanking the supplier of whatever was loaned. I was assuming that it should happen all of the time but it's getting rare for someone to be sincere about it. One of the guys who worked for me at one job "borrowed" my $70 Snap-On swivel head ratchet and left it in a truck. Nobody fessed up to it and when I called the customer, he naturally denied that it was in there when he looked. I replaced it with a $26 Craftsman sloppy-head ratchet and nobody ever borrowed it. I really hate that POS!
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
I'm pretty selfish.
I don't like borrowing or lending.
as to the boss ... if biking riding is gonna be a regular thing ...
he should make arrangements to drop a car off at work so it'll be there when he needs to run outta the office.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
My motto is I don't loan anything except to my friends, and I don't have no friends.
Don't loan out my wife either.
I have given my sons many tools. Always good stuff. They do take good care of it, and it is more fun to aks may I borrow your saw than to yell where the heck is my saw.
if it doesn't feel right ... then it ain't....
I've tried to take the approach that "it's just stuff and stuff breaks"
but it always seems to break when someone else uses it...
now i know most of my stuff is junk... but it's my junk and i know how to use it... i'm pretty sure my bobcat has never been at full throttle...
I listen to my engines... and i know when they are hurt'n... something others can't hear...
just my take on it... i do lend... and really hate it but sometimes there are folks you can't say no to...
p
but it always seems to break when someone else uses it...
True, very often. But how can you tell who or what is at fault?
I knew a gentleman in India who would freely loan his used car to friends with the understanding that, if something broke while it was in their possession, they had to pay for the repair. His friends called it "The Karma Car".
Didn't matter if the part that failed had a life expectancy of 100,000 miles. If it went south while you had the car, you paid. Your karma, your repair.
One of my compatriots has almost any major tool needed and told me "don't buy it if you can rent it, don't rent it if you can borrow it". I reminded him that he was the one with all the goodies and I was the beggar. He said no problem he knew I would take care of it and get it back as soon as I was finished.
When his DW chargers crapped out he called me to see where he could get a good deal, I told him I knew just the place and gave him one.
"When his DW chargers crapped out..."
Where, oh where, can I buy a new charger for my Dear Wife? Any way we can input new energy would be appreciated.
Don K.
Most folks would hope their DW quit charging
best answer to "can i borrow...?":"i loan tools to anyone who i'd also loan my toothbrush." (heard that one on BT a fews years ago- don't remember from whom)personally, i try to avoid loaning tools/vehicles because every time i do i regret it. latest example: after a hurricane my neighbor's chainsaw dies cleaning up tree damage. i lend him mine (near new Stihl, right out of the shop, tuned and winterized). not even a half hour later, "uh well, uh, the chain oiler don't seem to be workin'..." $40 to fix and absolutely NO offer whatsoever to pay or defray the cost. and the cheap, mannerless schmuck wonders why i told him "tough s***" when one of my trees fell in his yard (no other damage) during a windstorm last spring and my insurance agent told me i had no obligation to clean it up. it's still laying there to this day. hey, what goes around, comes around...m
I like your solution Mitch. Does seem that the universe is trying to teach him something.
I learned about chain saws from an ornery old Homelite that was given to me. I spent a lot of my free time, learning about what made that thing tick and how to service it. It took a lot of patience to get it fired up, and then it would only run at high RPM. Good for cutting up logs for firewood.
A chainsaw is one tool I'll never loan, even to someone who knows how they work. The liability issues alone make it too risky.