Any thoughts here on ‘ideal’ ceiling heighth?
I’m an owner-building my own place and after putting in a 10′ ceiling on the first floor I put up the 8 foot ceiling on the second floor and it feels low to me! Any thoughts / impressions on this subject would be much appreciated.
thanks!
T.
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Replies
Why did you go from 10' first floor to 8' second floor? I framed one house that way a couple years ago and it felt real low when you walked upstairs also. I've framed a lot of houses with 10' first floor and 9' second floor and that doesn't feel low. You still can have a 9' second floor depending what stage your at and if you want to make any changes.
Are the rafters on yet?
Are you also asking this because you might want to change it?
Joe Carola
Edited 7/16/2006 1:45 am ET by Framer
Hi Joe,
I'm asking because I've got two more floors to frame that I could bump up a little and I'm just wondering if there's any sort of 'magic number' that builders know about that equates to feeling comfortable with ceiling heighth. I mean, it wouldn't surprise me if there were some sort of 'common wisdom' as far as design goes that I'd never heard of like "anything under xx' xx" will tend to feel cramped".
I built the first floor at 10 feet because it's sort of separate from the living areas above. Thinking of possibly using the ground floor as a more public space ... it's two rooms .. one with a small bathroom and entry way .. then the large room .. and the 10' ceilings really makes it feel expansive. But I'm fitting four full floors in under the code of 40' so ... at this point I'm at about twenty feet and have two floors to go. The tji's and flooring use about a foot, so with another two floors at 8 ft -- with flooring 9 ft -- that'll put me at 38'. I've got a tiny bit of room to play with. Just wondered if going to 8 1/2 feet might make quite a difference in 'feel'.
T.
Are you putting a flat roof on this 4 story?A great place for Information, Comraderie, and a sucker punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
"But I'm fitting four full floors in under the code of 40' so ... at this point I'm at about twenty feet and have two floors to go. The tji's and flooring use about a foot, so with another two floors at 8 ft -- with flooring 9 ft -- that'll put me at 38'."That 40' is to the top of your joists? That would only give you 2'. If your building 4 stories I would assume it's a flat roof or from front to back it slopes down x-amount of feet.When we use our height it's always to the top of the ridge.Joe Carola
Edited 7/16/2006 12:05 pm ET by Framer
I'm in a dual residential/commercial zone. It's the best of both worlds for me. It means that I can build right up to the property lines and go up to 40 ft. -- residential limit here is 30 -- but still fall under only residential restrictions in terms of construcion. The zone is designated NC-240 --- the NC is neighborhood(residential) commercial .. and the 40 of the 240 refers to 40 ft. limit. IF this house had ever been designated for commercial use I'd have to build under commercial designation ... sprinklers in the ceiling, etc ... but since it never has been up to now I can still continue to buld under residential (softer) rules.
What I'm building, and I've gone in to this already here several times, is a 4 story residential 'tower'.... I'm calling it an "urban tower". It's just a single room on a single room on a single room on a single room. Some may find it ugly ... I find it fun and I'm really enjoying building it. At it's 4th flr and roof heighth it's view will be stunning ... two mt. chains .. puget sound .. downtown .. etc. I am the owner builder .. NOT a builder by training and too old for the job ... my self-established challenge is to do every aspect of it .. beginning to end .. with my own hands. I've got it framed up through the floor of the 3rd flr. It's getting more and more difficult as now every tool and every single piece of material used has to be lugged up stairs and ladders. Hadn't thought about this!
So ... maybe a silly thing to do .. but I'm enjoying it when the day goes well!!! Had my very first framing inspection Friday and it went well ... my only real nerviousness at this point is there are summer arson fires going on AGAIN in my area and they are always unfinished construction sites. I guess unfinished construction looks to some like ... an organized pile of kindling.
Was just wondering about ceiling heighth. The reason I made the second floor 8 ft. instead of a more comfortable slightly higher was just because it meant I didn't have to go around the entire perimeter with blocking for that edge of sheathing and extra 6 inches!
T.
OK, We all know how much fun it can be to build.but we still don't know if you ghave any plans of any sort and it still seems like you will have no room for any sort of roof other than a flat one.Communication goes two ways. i'm curious
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It just seemed odd to me that anyone was expressing doubt that I had any 'plans' in building a forty foot structure in the middle of a major city. How in the world could I get a way with that without having permitted plans and why would I have had an inspection if I didn't have plans! I certainly don't claim to read every mssg that's posted here but I've never seen any one else here post pictures of their plans ... so that seemed a little odd as well.
The 'plan' is for a flat roof .. or .. very slightly slanted, of course. The roof will be an open 'sun-roof' for .. you know .. sleeping out on and .. whatever. I don't know about elsewhere but here you can exceed the heighth limit by 4 or 5 feet with low safety walls.
I've always striven to communicate thoroughly here!
:
Sorry, but I've read your comments and questions in a couple threads now and there seems to be no organized plan. You ask about how to do things you are in the middle of and consider changing wwall heights as you are going along. That is not the sign of someone who has a detailed set of plans.
The lack of firm standards in the local AHJ is confusing also.
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"...I've read your comments and questions in a couple threads now and there seems to be no organized plan..."
Well ... there's definitely a 'plan'. But it's my own structure on my property and from what I've experienced it's a set of 'guidelines' I'm working under. For example, I've got 40' to come in under. If I come in at 38 or at 39.5 either is ok ... if I lift a ceiling that's on the drawings from 8' to 8' 6" it doesn't seem to upset anyone as long as no codes are broken. Leeway within limitations.
It may be that it just seems so different because most builders are working under code AND under the watchful eyes of their clients. I don't know .. just trying to make sense of it. But I AM staying within code ... and my situation IS unique in that there is a specific designation in my city that is a 'mixture' of residential and commercial. Before the structure is applied for commercial use all building that occurs is under residential code. This house is on a commercial street but has never applied for commercial use ... always been residential. Lucky for me.
T.
I work in an area that has very little code enfocememnt and I am generally the designer on the houses I deal with.To me a plan is wheere you get to work out all the details and make all the mistakes when it is cheap to fix them on paper. You make it work, practical and look, beautiful - on paperFirst - then you start building. Occasionally inspiration hits and changes are made along the way, but building with a rubber plan like you describe is a god way to err in structural results, exceed costs, and make the neighbors angry over uglienessJust my two cents, but a good plan is worth far more than the paper it is drawn on. Sounds like you are satisfying your client so far though, LOLBTW, There are other ways to get materials up if you plan things right
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I didn't mean to give offense with my questioning your (or any) questioning of what I'm doing.
I must honestly admit that I have no doubt whatsoever that this structure -- in ways that I am no doubt unaware of -- 'suffers' from the conditions under which it is being constructed. Chief amongst them being that it's builder is a past-his-prime owner-non-builder who is building for 'love' with very little money.
That being said I am taking every precaution to 'do it right', not chintzing in ANY way on materials, consulting continuously on method and approach both here and elsewhere, and, so far (apparently) so good. Four boxes on top of one another is, after all, pretty straightforward. If I get the holddowns right and everything alligned floor by floor I should be good. Or ..... one would hope.
:
Like I said, I'm curious. Being new, you are bound to make some mistakes - thems the rules- but you'll learn from them and we along with you.Have fun and good luck.
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"Had my very first framing inspection Friday and it went well .."What does that mean, first framing inspection?Joe Carola
"What does that mean, first framing inspection?"
Huh .. this is interesting. Are we speaking apples and oranges here? Is this an east coast/west coast difference? I don't understand the basis for this question.
Throughout the process of building a permitted structure a number of inspections take place. For site disturbance, foundation pour, framing (several throughout the process), electrical, plumbing, insulation, utilities, and a final when everything is completed. I just had the first of several framing inspections. Checked holddown placement, nailing patterns on shear walls, etc. Went well. Passed. No re-do's.
What am I missing here?
"Huh .. this is interesting. Are we speaking apples and oranges here? Is this an east coast/west coast difference?"I asked about your "First" framing inspection you mentioned, not all the other inspections, which tells me that you obviously have more than one framing inspection. Must be east coast/west coast. We don't get a framing inspection until the electrical, plumbing, hvac is done.What do they inspect there? First floor, second, floor?Joe Carola
Here it's generally one framing inspection. But if for some reason you want extra inspections, they'll come out for $57 a visit. In this case, I can see paying that at the half way point, just in case they find a problem that'll be a lot harder to correct with two more stories on top of it. People sometimes do this so they can live in part of a house while they work on the rest of it. Then they move to the new part and fix up the old.
-- J.S.
Same here, one inspection after all the mechanicals, plumbers and electricians are done sawzalling a house to pieces.
You get one inspection then it's $35 a whack after that. Can't you hear the violin playing your song.
Here the initial permitting fee includes all of the inspections UNLESS there is some sort of stubborness on the part of the builder such as the inspector tells him that this or that must be taken care of prior to the next visit and then it is not again and again. Then, they begin charging for extra visits ... 77$ per visit on TOP of the initial fee.
Terry
Life be different here, permits are usually dirt cheap and don't require much. I don't think stamps are needed on blueprints. In some areas a test well is needed then once that is OK then you pay the permit and then have at it. The footings need to be inspected and then the next inspection doesn't happen till the other trades are done.
At least your inspector shows up that day or the next. It can be weeks before the inspector shows up. Most of the time we just keep going until it's time to drywall, then we have to keep calling them until they feel like showing up. Can't you hear the violin playing your song.
My permit for this fairly simple (tho labor intensive) thing was something like $3,300. Labor intensive because of all the major holdowns and such. Just from ground flr. to foundation around the outsides of one 19 X 13 foot room ... 11 enormous holddowns ... simpson's HD-14A's ... One inch thick threaded rod buried 36" in reinforced concrete. It's insane.
I agree that is insane. Most houses around here are held down with 1/2" bolts 6' OC. Our biggest thing around here is frost so everything gets buried in a 4' deep pit.
Can't you hear the violin playing your song.
> ... One inch thick threaded rod buried 36" in reinforced concrete. It's insane.
It's leverage. This structure is 13 ft. wide by 40 ft. tall. Your engineer ran the numbers on what an earthquake could do to it, and those plans are the answers.
-- J.S.
It's leverage. This structure is 13 ft. wide by 40 ft. tall. Your engineer ran the numbers on what an earthquake could do to it, and those plans are the answers.
this is true, of course. This area is MAJOR earthquake country ... even with the 11 giant holdowns I've had experienced builders come by, take one look at it, and say "the first major jolt of our next Cascadia Quake and that baby's gonna end up horizontal in your neighbor's yard." A soothing thought to go to sleep to at night after a long day's work.
:|
Did your engineer tell you what horizontal G-force it's designed for? Is liquefaction an issue there? In any case, keep the heavy stuff downstairs, and don't put a tile roof on it.
-- J.S.
"
Did your engineer tell you what horizontal G-force it's designed for? Is liquefaction an issue there? In any case, keep the heavy stuff downstairs, and don't put a tile roof on it."
Like I said ... no engineers involved in this design. I just drew it, handed it to the architect, he put in the holddowns and soforth .. and got it through .. though not without a close look downtown and a loooooong delay.
Yes ... from what I hear I'm certain that liquifaction is a factor here. The Puget Sound area ... 'Cascadia', as they call it ... is primed for one of the worste quakes the nation has ever seen. I just hope I'm on the first floor when it hits.
No tile roof ... just an enormous, 10 person Hot Tub on the roof! ;)
If I remember correctly from my brief period in your lovely city of Seattle that you not only have to build for quake considerations but hurricane winds as well. So there's 2 things that kind of overshadow your whole building approach affecting attachement to foundation, the shear walls for shaking & blowing, and roof attachment to the box. Learn what you can so you can get ahead of the curve because I think you're in one of the more restrictive markets re: details that will shoot down your inspections.
"If I remember correctly from my brief period in your lovely city of Seattle that you not only have to build for quake considerations but hurricane winds as well. So there's 2 things that kind of overshadow your whole building approach affecting attachement to foundation, the shear walls for shaking & blowing, and roof attachment to the box...."
As a matter of fact when the architect took the 'plan' (more like a simple drawing) from me and ran the numbers he came back with the statement that the wind was clearly a greater force-consideration than an earthquake. (Though ... how the hell can one really know that?). So .. the 'engineering' -- again, done by an architect -- is all done to Wind forces. Turns out though ... a forty foot skinny tower perched above everything around it on top of a hill is at considerable risk for 'turn-over' .. as they call it. Hence ... all the heavy holdowns.
T
Newby,
I built just north of you a year ago, simple 2 story house. It needed an engineers stamp. Can't imagine you got away without one. Your architect more than likely sent the drawings out, or had an in house solution.
Just out of curiosity. Now that you have the third floor deck down. How were/are you going to raise it 6-12" ?
Can't wait to see picture. Oh, and what neighborhood you in?
D.
Aha! Yes .. quite different here.
One is encouraged to hook up with the inspecter as early on as possible in the building process. I didn't ... and built a larger ground floor 'base' to the tower and then the first of the upper floors before I called him in. He was clearly of the mind that I was long overdue and 'let it go' that there were many feet of wall that were now covered and could not be 'inspected'. But now .. from here on out I'll need to call him to 'have a look' before I cover any sheathing with gypsum or siding or felt. As I'm putting up 'Shear Walls' , which require specific nailing patterns he must see them himself and sign off on their having been done properly before I cover them. For example, on those of my walls that are SW (shear-wall) -4 ... I must stagger the nails along the edge no further apart than every 2 inches and every edge must be backed by no less than a 3X (2.5"). Nails in the field must be every 6" (I believe .. don't have the schedule right here). Now that I've called him in this will slow me down some since he'll be having to come by. But on any given day if I've called the night before or before 7am he MUST show up that day ... so there's no wait of several days or anything as crippling as that would be.
I'm surprised (as you must be) that you are only inspected at the end ... what if something is not right on the first floor and must be re-done?!
Anyway ... a pain .. but a necessary one. Despite my sort of 'casual' attitude .. they keep a very close watch here. This project almost didn't get through simply because they'd "never seen anything like that before". I finally had to get on the phone to the engineers and ask them, "Does it appear to be legal and engineered right?" "yes it does" "Then PLEASE sign off on it so I can get started!" Which they finally did.
"I'm surprised (as you must be) that you are only inspected at the end ... what if something is not right on the first floor and must be re-done?!"I'm not surprised at all since I've never seen a framing inspection until the end. If something isn't right on the first floor then it's my fault and my problem because I screwed it up and I deserve to fix it later on my time. They can't babysit us by inspecting each floor to see if we make mistakes. Nothing is getting covered that they can't see later anyway. We all make mistakes but that's the price you pay.They wait until the end to see if the electrician, plumbers, or hvac guys drill holes or cut out the framing and ruin the structural integrity of the framing. If that's the case and these morons chop up my framing, then we have to go back and fix it, as an extra of course.Joe Carola
"I'm surprised (as you must be) that you are only inspected at the end ..."
"I'm not surprised at all since I've never seen a framing inspection until the end..."
Just for the record ... what I meant to say was that "I'm surprised at your situation as you must be at mine ..." not "I'm surprised at your situation as you must be also..."
My sense is that they're on us too closely here ... and I would prefer your scenario. But the system was in place long before I was doodeling an 'urban tower' on a napkin in an open air cafe on a backstreet of Bangkok ... so .. gotta live with it.
thanks -
"My sense is that they're on us too closely here ... and I would prefer your scenario."They must not trust you New Builders.............;-)Joe Carola
Sounds like I am in the same boat you are. You don't want to fix anything, do it right the first time. Can't you hear the violin playing your song.
Same here at the edge of the western world... frame the whole thing, do all the mechanical, plumbing and electrical, then get a rough-in inspection all at once. If you want a courtesy inspection part way thru you can get one, and sometimes I do if I want to be absolutely sure the BI will be happy before I let the subs loose to stitch everything together.
Same here at the edge of the western world... frame the whole thing, do all the mechanical, plumbing and electrical, then get a rough-in inspection all at once.
Huh ... that's weird ... you're just a short drive away from me ... however .. you're largely rural .. San Juan County ... my situation is extremely urban ... King County. I love the San Juan's ... used to go there every chance I got.
With all of you in that situation you really could be NOT conforming to shear-wall specs or some such requirement, and, once sheathed, no one would know. So ... maybe it IS a matter of 'trust'. I don't recall EVER feeling that the state 'trusted' me on this or that. And the feeling is mutual.
I'm going to try to post some pics in the next 24 hrs. All the pics I had planned on choosing from were stolen in a recent burglary ... and this new digi-cam I got makes it difficult to grab them from the computer and post them. But I'm goin to work with it tonight or tomorrow. It'll at least show the first two floors.
T.
"With all of you in that situation you really could be NOT conforming to shear-wall specs or some such requirement, and, once sheathed, no one would know."I don't even no what a shear wall is. We do nothing but nail the walls together and then sheath, that's it.Joe Carola
I don't even no what a shear wall is. We do nothing but nail the walls together and then sheath, that's it.
Huh ... it's interesting how differing regions have things that are sort of a given that one assumes are universal. Obviously the Pacific Northwest is a high quake region ... maybe that explains why the whole shear-wall thing is so prevalent.
Needless to say it's a system ... an 'approach' to creating walls with greater lateral strength. The range is from one to five and at 5 the wall must be 1/2" ply on BOTH sides with edges NOT matching through the wall ... a minimum of 3X timber at sills and on all edges and nails at 2" intervals staggered. Level one is much simpler but still pre-determined.
I've looked for a good example online several times and never been able to locate one. Strange ... maybe it's local only.
Here's the engineer's favorite pre-fab sheer wall:
http://www.strongtie.com/products/strongwall/index.html?source=topnav
They're certainly common throughout California as well as in your area.
I'm actually surprised that you got away with wood and not some elaborate steel thing given the narrow and tall nature of your building - count your blessings?
"I'm actually surprised that you got away with wood and not some elaborate steel thing given the narrow and tall nature of your building - count your blessings?"
This was an architects figurings that got it through ... though supposedly the guys downtown who okay'd it are engineers (aren't they?!). It actually even seems to high to me for these flimsy straps ... I'll count my blessings if, after the next big Seattle shake, it's still standing and plumb.
T.
I was just joking with you about not knowing what a shear wall is. I never heard of it until these forums though. We really don't do anything yet for shear walls. We just frame and sheath and that's it. They're doing stuff like that towards the shore areas and making there way up here.My head spins when I here of all the hardware you guys have to use. I guess it's only a matter of time before we start and then the framing prices will also go up for the labor involved.Joe Carola
I'd be interested to see the front elevation from the plans for this house... can you take a pic and post it?
so far, it doesn't sound like there are any plans
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I was wondering about plans too, but also it's a little hard for me to picture a good looking 4 story residence with a flat roof. Here is one: http://mdhsimage.mdhs.org/library/images/XaccessLive/xa000838.JPG but somehow I doubt it was built in an ad-hock fashion.
Another thought is that I'm not even sure a residential building code would cover a 4 story structure... For example, I think my state's code which is based on the IRC2000 only covers up to 3 story buildings. I believe 4 story would be covered by the commercial code or as we call it "The Building Code", which in our state anyway, requires the involvement of a licensed architect (not that that is necessarily a good thing) ;-) but plans would be a given.
so far, it doesn't sound like there are any plans
Why plan a 4 story house before construction starts?
A lot of these old capes are 9' firwst floor, and then you are lucky to have 7' or so on the second floor.
Cileing height is best made proportional to overal size/shape of the room.
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"Cileing height is best made proportional to overal size/shape of the room."Exactly, proportion should be your guide. We see new construction here with 12-foot ceilings and standard 6"8" doors. As though the builder was going for the "grand atrium" look without the budget to match. It looks silly IMO.
In my area in the South, good-sized old houses are 11'/9', or 12' for single floor. Feels right to me. 8' just feels like a shed.
Forrest
In my area in the South, good-sized old houses are 11'/9', or 12' for single floor. Feels right to me. 8' just feels like a shed.
Forrest.
Wow! You're actually answering my original question! Thank you!!!
T. (TWELVE feet! Love it!!!)
in the south, before AC, high cielings were needed to give the heat someplace to hang out
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I've been living a house with 10' first floor and 8' second floor for 13 years. It's never seemed bad to me.
Newbuilder,
Once you get away from 8 foot heights you are into waste management.. I went with 9 foot ceilings and have this one foot high piece to add to the walls. that plus an extra seam to fill.
It doesn't matter to me since it's my house and I'm doing the work but I wonder if the added space is worth it to most people.. Frankly the great room at 28 feet and the first floor at 9 feet 4 inches was enough of a design statement. I was happy to simply put up a sheet and not have to worry about how many seams it had on the second floor. (besides I religated the kids up there so unless they start to play basketball It doesn't matter)..
exactly my th0ught: how 'worth it' is that extra 6" (in my case) when it translates to blocking all around the room to support the now new edge of ply and drywall ... and all the cutting and fitting and scrap!? On the other hand ... if it DID end up feeling 'cramped' I'd regret it forever. But hey .. I'm only 5' 10" . . . . how 'cramped' could I end up feeling!
NB
You can buy 54" drywall, and do 9 ft. by stacking two horizontally. Just like 48" and 8 ft, only taller. That makes 8 and 9 convenient natural heights to do. You could also mix 48" and 54" to do an 8'-6" ceiling. Anything in-between would require cutting.
My 1926 place has 8 ft. walls and 9 ft. ceilings, the foot difference being made up by a plaster version of crown moulding on steroids.
-- J.S.
"You can buy 54" drywall, and do 9 ft. by stacking two horizontally. Just like 48" and 8 ft, only taller. That makes 8 and 9 convenient natural heights to do. You could also mix 48" and 54" to do an 8'-6" ceiling..."
This is good to know ... never heard of or saw this ... I like it.
thanks -
T
I've been away from this discussion and the forum for a while - been very busy at work. I was the one who asked to see the elevation drawing. Still hard to picture what the finished structure might look like.
Anyway, I read through the above postings and have a few relevant comments.
Here, we have 1 framing inspection - after the framing, plumbing, mechanical and electrical are done. It is kind of a risk that you may not find out about a problem until after you have pipes, wires, etc in the way, but it's the chance you take, relying on your experience to pass the inspection with no major F-ups. The idea is that if you built to the approved plans, there will be no big issues. In one adjoining township they have a sheathing inspection too, as they do in areas closer to the coast. The sheathing inspection would occur after framing but before siding and the finished roof covering. Here, we are ~120 miles inland and in a 100 MPH wind, non-seismic zone. The building inspector will come out more often if you want, but you basically just call in your framing, and he fails it for non-completion, and you pay a $60 re-inspect fee to see his smiling face. Everyplace I have built though, the required inspection sequence and frequency is very defined. BTW - a permit is maybe $2k, +- $1K but is also based on sq footage.
Re architects and engineers, our single family home plans must be stamped by either an architect or an engineer. I guess the thinking is that an architect can run the numbers just like an engineer. That may be up for discussion though...
Back to the plans thing, I'm getting ready to build 7 spec houses. They will all be out of the ground within 4 months. I have spent the last 2 weeks redlining the plans - 9 hrs a day - some weekend work too - punctuated with some site visits and punch work to help retain my sanity. Went over the plans with the marketing guys and the company owner too. The idea is to get sets of plans that are as close to exactly what we are going to build as possible. Sent them back to the designers yesterday. These plans will be stamped by an engineer. No future HOs looking over our shoulders yet - just trying to get it all worked out on paper first. That way cost estimates can be as close as possible, and the building process will go as smoothly as possible. Not that these plans are that detailed - they just need to be right and well thought out. It will save time, money, and make things run more smoothly. Admittedly though, part of the idea is not to have buyers in the future say "that's not what is on the plans"... which doesn't pertain to you. Sounds like your budget is pretty flexible too.
Re the ceiling height thing, the houses I've been building and am getting ready for are '8 over 9'. That's kind of minimal these days except for the cheapest of cheap starter homes. In my personal house I have 10', 9', and 8'. It's a story and a half. The center part of the first floor which includes the LR. DR, Kitchen and FR the ceilings are 10'. There is a bedroom wing to each side with 9'. The bonus room upstairs is 8' - this is not often used.
As far as the ceiling height being in proportion to room size - well yea, but I think it's all goes back to the pre-plan drawing stage... The idea would be that you decide way ahead of time - are we building a small house with small rooms and low ceilings, or are we building a grand house with large rooms and high ceilings - or somewhere in between. In my examples of my personal house and the 8' over 9' houses, the idea is that the living areas with the large rooms get the higher ceilings, and the bedrooms/bathroom/etc areas get the lower ceilings since these are somewhat smaller rooms. OTOH, the master might get a vaulted ceiling, raised tray or something along that line, since it is the "big bedroom". openings - windows and doors, are sized in proportion too. Window heights go higher in higher ceiling rooms too.
One thing that is cool about high ceilings is it gives you the opportunity for cool ceiling details like wide cornice moldings, trays, coffers, etc, but this goes more with traditional styled homes. Contemporary type homes might be more along the lines of cathedral, vaulted,etc ceilings.
BTW - is your "tower" going to have an elevator? Seems like a perfect opportunity for one - probably too late now...
One thing which I'm sure you have figured out but I'm gonna state it anyway: there are some great resources and tons of answers here but you have to wade through a lot of extra opinions and scrutiny in order to extract out the exact answers you need... :-) Don't fall into the trap of just looking for someone to agree with you though - there is always gonna be one of those, and it is difficult to tell which posters are the real deal and which are really little old ladies in curlers and a bathrobe who just want to rub elbows with the sweaty and tanned men :-)
Edited 7/19/2006 7:54 am ET by Matt
I bought a Kodak digital camera and their software, I swear, is blatantly designed to give you as little freedom as possible and to create a situation in which you MUST go to there website for any pics or copies you may want. I can't even open a pic and copy it to email and send it since EVERY SINGLE PICTURE ON MY COMPUTER now has been 'converted' to Kodak and they will only open them in 'their' special window which does NOT allow copying by hi-lite/click-copy.
Any experience anyone has had with this which may help me to escape the Kodak prison, short of dumping the camera I just bought and am beginning to with I hadn't, would be greatly appreciated.
thanks -
T.
I'm assuming the pics are not .jpg? That sux...
I have a mid to cheap priced Nicon and had a Fuji before that and don't use the software that came with the cameras. I just use the Autoplay function of M/S Windows to copy the pics from the camera to a target directory and 'it just works' :-) The camera just looks like another disk to the computer. I can even just cut and paste the .jpg files from camera to my hard drive directory but I like the Autoplay because it allows me to rename them while they are being copied and then delete the pics after they are copied.
If I want to diddle the pics, I have Adobe Photoshop.
--- EVERY SINGLE PICTURE ON MY COMPUTER now has been 'converted' to Kodak ---What probably happened is that when you installed the Kodak software, it changed the default *program* used to open .jpg files. You can change this back to whatever image viewer or image editor you like.In your Explorer window (not IE, just regular Windows Explorer), assuming you have Windows XP,
click Tools | Folder Options.
choose the File Types tab.
highlight JPG (JPEG Image).
click the Change button.In WinXP, Windows will make a bunch of suggestions about what programs you might want to use to open these files, or you can browse to find one that's not listed.In previous versions of Windows, the File Types tab is located roughly the same place, but you don't get the helpful hints about programs to use.Hope this helps,Rebeccah
Thanks Rebecca, I appreciate the direct response to my question. Problem is, Kodak has recently 'improved' their software ... i downloaded the newer version and the 'improvement' is that it's even more air-tight to outside diddling than it used to be when my brother used it for his computer.
I'm playing with it and will, hopefully .. eventually .. , figure something out. I'm working off of my old dinosaur computer with Win 98 and 2 gigs of hard drive. So I'm extremely 'confined'. If I absolutely can't get it to work through Kodak i'll give your deal a fly ... but, as I said .. I'm working off ancient software myself!
thanks -
T.
I'm willing to bet that the files are actually still .jpg, it's just that the software has renamed them with a Kodak extension. Other programs (e.g. Photoshop) should still recognize and open them, and they should still be able to be uploaded to the forum in the normal manner.
I'm saying this because I had that happen to me with a photo management program that came with the Dell. Took me a while to get everything pointed to a different management program (I'm using Picasa - free from Google now) - hang in there!
The instructions Rebeccah provided are the key - you just need to translate them to your operating system (IIRC with Win98 you can do the assignments in the File Explorer menu).
The instructions Rebeccah provided are the key - you just need to translate them to your operating system (IIRC with Win98 you can do the assignments in the File Explorer menu).
I look .. but I don't see this. Do you mean at the top of the page like the one I'm in right now? Where it says File -- Edit -- View -- Favorites -- Tools -- Help ... ???
Hmmmm ... lesson here is never by kodak again ... how could they not think that this would build resentment!
--- I look .. but I don't see this. Do you mean at the top of the page like the one I'm in right now? Where it says File -- Edit -- View -- Favorites -- Tools -- Help ... ??? ---Nope, that's Internet Explorer.Open up a folder on your desktop (double-click on it). You are now in Windows Explorer. NOW look at the menu across the top.(The names Internet Explorer and Windows Explorer are similar because Microsoft actually uses much of the same programming code for both functions.)Rebeccah
REMOVE the EASYSHARE software ASAP. It sucks.
DL Irfanview ( freebie) and IF you are on XP, you need do nothing else except plug the camera in with the USB ( skip the card reader for now) with the mem stick/card in the camera..turn on the camera, windows wizard will "find" the hardware.
Follow the wizards steps and Badabing you are done, pic will be in MY docs/my pics FULL SIZE. Open and select a pic, rt click to open with Irfanview, resize, save as ____ and save in either a folder that you created or what I do,back in MYDOCS..easy once ya get the hang of it..but LOSE that easyshare crap.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" I am not an Activist, I am, a Catalyst. I lay around and do nothing, until another ingredient is added"
the "easy-share" truly is crap.
problem is .. I'm on a nine yr old computer with Win98 and a 2 gig harddrive.
lotsa things related to picture manipulation came AFTER '98 ...
thanks -
I finally got the kodak to work ... sort of .. by running a 'repair' module on it and messing with it for quite some time. Here are a few pics from my odd 'little' project:
1 - first is a pic of one of the elevations ... south side ... from the permit drawings. No real schemata .. just a rough of how it'll look. First floor is two rooms with 10' ceilings and a bathroom in one. Second through fourth floors are separate from the ground floor ... living space.
2 - just a shot of one small corner of the 2nd floor to show the three kinds of holdowns that I'm using ... hd 10's .. straps .. and threaded flr2flr pass-thru's. This project is riddled with holdowns.
3 - Just a shot of the two ground floor rooms from just inside
4 - This is jus a shot of the first two floors .. relatively complete, framing-wise. Now it gets interesting as the structure .. with the third floor walls will become visible from all directions. Actually NOT looking forward to that.
Promised these long ago ... for what it's worth ..
T.
Glad you finally got it working.Rebeccah
Not that this means much, but my 1901 four square has 10' on the first floor and 9.5' on the second. Of course this is with plaster, not drywall.
In my opinion, to go up to 12' you need a very large room. But the ceiling treatments you can do, oh my!
It is going from 10' to 8' that makes it feel low. Usually when we have 10' down, we have 9' up. 9' to 8' also works, but 10' to 8' will be noticable.
I am a custom builder.