I have an awful lot of sealing to do, in the next month or two.
Probably going to need at least 3 gallons of shellac.
I want to be able to paint over this.
What is your reccomendation for as low a cost as possible, yet not krap quality ?
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Replies
Zinsser Seal Coat. Can buy by the gallon at Menards, etc.
http://www.zinsser.com/product_detail.asp?ProductID=72
Paul
Luka
Not seal coat!
that' 1# cut shellac which is what's needsed to seal something, buy Zinssers bulls eye, it's about $30.00 a gallon but it's 3# cut if you add two gallons of denatured alcohol (remember denatured alcohol not thinner or anything else) at about $9.00 a gallon you will have 3 gallons of 1# cut shellac for about $50.00 saving you over $25.00
Frenchy,
Hate to be contrary, but I don't believe Zinsser Bulls-Eye is dewaxed, as is Seal-Coat. Thus, it would not be a good product to paint over, as Luka wants to. I confess I have never tried to finish over shellac with wax in it, but theoretically it doesn't work well.
Paul
Paul
Technically your not supposed to finish over waxed shellac BUT, I've done it numerous times, some as far back as ten years ago, with out a single incident of finish not adhering to the shellac.
I sand in between coats so I'm sure that helps.
I've read several articles on finishing furniture and the authors have used canned shellac, eg Zinsser brand, which would not be the dewaxed variety, and then applied a coat of varnish or poly over it with good results.
I think the key is to sand in between coats.
I myself buy shellac flakes, I like to be able to mix my own. Most of the flakes have been dewaxed.
Doug
Edited 12/25/2007 7:00 pm ET by DougU
gotall10
I believe there are only rare paints which have ever had an issue with waxed shellac. I've done it a lot and never had a single issue.. In fact I'm one of those people who write on my walls (sheetrock) notes to help me remember a mesurement or phone numbers etc.. then when I'm finally ready to paint them I splash a coat of shellac on (bullseye) and paint away..
I've even done it to some fiddle back black walnut I was hoping to save but had to use it outdoors. I splash a coat of it on just before I put varnish over it.. I know shellac won't stand outdoor weather but once you cover it with varinsh it's just fine..
Sad to say the Protection it offered was only temporary it gave me maybe 6 more months before the varnish allowed the underlying wood to fade. Anyway latex paint oil based paint and Varnish have all been applied over Bulls eye with out a single issue of paint failure..
I couldn't count the number of gallons of Bulls Eye I've used on this house - it holds paint like a magnet, dewaxed or not.
I vote for Bulls Eye!
Luka
What are you sealing that you cant just use a pigmented shellac sealer such as Bin/Zinsser(dont recall which brand is the shellac based primer)?
You buy that for I think under $20 a gallon.
Doug
I'm not sealing anything at all that I "cant just use a pigmented shellac sealer such as Bin/Zinsser".I have to paint the entire ceiling, all walls, and the entire floor in a 37 foot 5th wheel RV.Probably twice.I need really cheeeeeep.I think Frenchy has the right idea...=0)
A man, convinced against his will...
Is of his own opinion, still.
~Anne McCaffrey
I'm just wondering what material you are sealing and what are you sealing in or out.
Sealing out mold, mildew, and contaminants from the "black tank" that might have soaked into materials, and/or worked their way into cracks, when it was flooded.I have no idea what the floors are, yet. I am looking at just putting all new OSB or plywood on the floors. I want to seal that on all 6 sides before applying it.Most of the cabinets are in ok shape. I'll clean all surfaces with TSP, then sind lightly, and apply the shellac. I'll paint over wall, floor and ceiling surfaces, (Which are probably something similar to painted luan plywood.), and probably just shellac the cabinets several times.I am just trying to get the thing roughly sealed for now. I need to get moved in as soon as I can.I'll be rebuilding the entire thing, a bit at a time, later. Utility and safety is the thing for now. It can look as ugly as a wart on a dog's behind, but I want to be able to use it, and not keep getting sick.My current trailer is so damaged, full of water everywhere, and rot, mold and mildew, that it is making me sick, already. I want to do what I can to avoid that in the other one. BEFORE I move in, is the best time to get it all sealed up, etc...
A man, convinced against his will...
Is of his own opinion, still.
~Anne McCaffrey
I'd seal the OSB with floor paint. You can walk on it till you put something else down. I don't know what the walls and ceiling are made of, but I would just paint the ceiling unless it has issues, then shellac is a good choice. I'm thinking there are cheaper sealers than shellac. If you can get a good deal on flakes you might make your own cheaper. http://www.shellac.net/ShellacPricing.html
What about Junkhound? I bet he has the stuff you need cheap or free. Heck I would send you some supplies except it wouldn't be worth the shipping from Ohio.
Of course the ceiling has issues.The entire trailer has issues.;o)
A man, convinced against his will...
Is of his own opinion, still.
~Anne McCaffrey
Mark, have you dealt with shelladnet lately?
Last time I tried -- maybe 6 months ago -- they were out of biz. Are they back?
Joe H
Never dealt with them. Website is still up. I have gotten some flakes from Woodcraft, since the store is only 5 miles from home. Try emailing them at [email protected] . Prices are 2 years old.
Edited 12/25/2007 10:16 pm ET by MarkH
Mark
Luka has the right idea,, seal stuff with shellac and it does a great job of keeping fumes out.. If you've ever seen the insurance guys deal with a house fire what they do is clean off the solid wood and then spray shellac over everything to keep the burn smell out.. It really works.. I suspect if Luka has the mold problem solved sealing it with shellac should prevent reemergance of mold unless what caused the mold happens again..
But there are also paints that contain fungicide, I think shellac would not offer any resistance and in fact may feed it. Smoke and stains, smell etc, shellac is best for sealing.
I've seen plenty of new mold growing/eating shellac on old church organs in storage that was damp.
I think you are on to something with the fungicide idea.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"Success is not spontaneous combustion, you have to set yourself on Fire"
I would use a pigmented also. I would look into the effectivness of thinning it way down, maybe try it out and or contact the tech services at the manufacturer.
Think about spraying it. I'm getting ready to bid on a job where they used it on the walls ceiling and floor because there was so much grease and #### that they couldn't wash it off. They sprayed it with a really cheap machine. Stuff has held real good for the last two years. (I have to deal with the drips and runs that they left.)
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
I'm pretty much just trying to use up what I do have, and then make up the difference as cheaply as possible.I have some OSB. I have some plywood. I have probably a bit more than 3 gallons of white latex paint.I don't have the stuff to spray it with. Rolling and brushing is going to work just fine for me.=0)The trailer already has a -lot- of rot in it. (The reason I will eventually rebuild the entire trailer.) Mold, mildew, and the stuff from the septic tank, round out the problems.Mold, and mildew actually thrive on latex paint. Especially when there is already a thriving, established culture.I need to get it cleaned with the TSP, get something done about the floors, then seal everything the best I can. Down and dirty.Once I have time to breathe again, I'll start looking at replacing a section at a time of wall, cabinets, floor, ceiling, etc...I am almost to the point where I can close in the temp roof. When I get that finished, I'll cover the outside walls with tarpaper and/or plastic. Then get started on the inside in earnest.I've already cut out most of the face frames of all the lower cabinets. I want those gutted and open. Working on getting a water pump and 6 gallon 'point of use' water heater plumbed under the kitchen sink.I've been offered help when it is time to clean with the TSP. But I have to have the roof and outside walls done first. (To keep the water out, so it doesn't just sit there and keep breeding mold and mildew.) As well as a small porch, and some gravel, so I don't track mud in after I have cleaned.I am not a lazy person, but I think I take about a day now, to get done what I used to get done in twenty minutes to an hour. So it is taking me a long time to do this. At least I can pay attention to what I am doing. LOLYeah, I know, more info than anyone asked for.;o)
A man, convinced against his will...
Is of his own opinion, still.
~Anne McCaffrey
Seal with shellac based Kilz,it is white and will seal water spots,etc.This product is made for what you need.Do not use the water base Kilz, nothing wrong with it but the shellac based seals much better.
mike