I could use a little help. I built this curved deck last fall, but got shut down by the cold before we could heat and bend the border. The home owner hired someone to review the work, and he had a few comments. He didn’t like my choice of two layers of 3/4 pt plywood for the outside rim.The curve was tight enough that we had to kerf the back in places. He says the plywood is and will de-laminate. I didn’t think this would be an issue with pt. He says that when he bends rim joists ‘we glue laminate pcs. together in the mold of the curve. We build up the laminate to 3″‘. He doesn’t say what material he uses to glue up. The deck joists are supported by a beam under. I also didn’t put on hangers. (some places you couldn’t) How would you guys do it? Here are some pics.
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I used for my curved rim joist 3 layers of 1/2" glued and screwed to the joist ends. No kerf needed but it did take some pushing and shoving. So he might have a point on that. I used lots of hangers and brackets where I could, more to make the inspector happy than add strength. This one is my deck so I'm still working on the railing.
Looks like your using trex type material and for this you need a hot box. Build out of plywood and electric baseboard heaters so you don't have to wait for the hot days of summer. The radius looks a little tight for 5.5" wide border bending as it might crack.
Third picture is the hidden fastening method I used.
I think your biggest problem is "not finishing" and this is whats pushing buttons!
depending how far those joists cantilever over the beams, the curved lam rim joist is not structural. It is only there to maintain alignment of th ejoist ends and to provide a nailing surface for the trim. If the trim gets nailed at joists, it doesn't matter a bit if the ply does de-lam a little, but I doubt that it would do much. If you do see some happening now, just inject a little gorilla glue to stabilize it and make them feel better. A little suger pill.
I am impressed
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I do not have a problem with your plywood bending although I may have gone with 1/2". Last summer I retrimmed a front entry way with Azek. I bought 5/8" 4x8 sheet thinking that it would bend like 5/8" Azek beaded trim. I was wrong.
I had to kerf cut the azek about every 3". HO didn't mind, but you could see where the kerfs were cut.
For a curved deck, I would layout the arc and cut the joists. Blocks could be placed in between the joists (i.e. like solid bridging), and the trim/riser in pic would bend around the end of the joists.
Did you ask why they wanted a second opinion?
Dave Otto -- Otto Construction -- PA
I have done it he way you are suggesting with blocking between the joists the curved facade material is just for looks. I add shims between the joists nailed to he blocking so there is support every 8 inches. Then used fiber board siding to bend the arc.In stead of an trim board following the edge, I over extend the decking and cut that to follow the radius of the structure.Wallyo
Edited 5/14/2008 9:53 am ET by wallyo
Thanks for all the responses. Dave, to answer your question. She doesn't want to pay. The deck is part of a large renovation. She is trying to find any and all problems to stall, beat down the price etc.
My FIL sent me this article about bad clients. She fits the profile.
http://community.nytimes.com/article/comments/2008/05/15/garden/15contractors.html
You might what to file a mechanics lien to put your self in line if there are a lot of contractors waiting for pay.Wallyo
If she's threatening to not pay and trying to beat you down on price why are you still working on the deck? All you're doing is increasing the degree to which she can screw you.
I'd want the remaning balance in escrow and payment terms set before proceeding with work.
Cagiv, I'm not working on the deck. I haven't worked there in months. If we ever meet I will use all your responses as 'experts'(yes I said expert)opinions. I will also discuss this with the BI, as he has some discretion. I'm sure I won't be working there again. I don't believe I can file a mechanic's lien, because I am the prime contractor, and I have an arbitration clause in the contract. I haven't started that process yet because then everything will come to a dead stop for a few months. However painful, right now the process is moving forward at a snail's pace.
I'm not certain but I don't believe the arbitration clause and filing the lien have anything to do with one another.
I agree arbitration is a remedy to be used instead of a court law suit. A lien just protects your material and work since unlike a car you can not go over and reposes the deck. She cannot sell the house with out resolving the lien before or at closing. If she sold the house and you had no lien it will be harder to get your dollars. If there is no mortgage, she gets the cash and moves to another state, then try collecting without a lien, it gets a lot harder. Some contractors file liens right at the start, before a nail is driven, so they are first in line to be paid then when work is done when all are happy the lien is released.Is part of the problem that she is in too deep, and the house dropped in value? Nice looking deck by the way. Here is a question if you do not finish it and some one gets hurt do you have any liability, I don't Know just a thought?Wallyo
An arbitration clause does not always preclude using a mechanics lien, but letting too much time elapse does in most states.
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That is too bad she is being difficult. You have done some very good work. She is getting a well built deck, and if the rest of the reno is of similar quality, she should keep quiet and get her check book out.
Im not saying you do bad work but if shes "hiring" ( I assume shes paying then) someone to inspect your work maybe your neither money nor the quality of your work is not the problem here.
If you are the GC, have you been working on the other parts of the reno while waiting for hte weather to turn?
Edited 5/21/2008 5:26 pm ET by FCOH