Got a client that has a 30 year old dishwasher they want to replace with a newer (but still used) model. They’ve had a laminate floor installed in their kitchen, so now it appears as if the old dishwasher is held captive by the 1/4 increase in floor thickness. I can dismantle the old unit with a recip saw and remove it from under the counter without problems, but in measuring the newer dishwasher, there’s about 1/4 to 1/2 inches too much to fit under the counter.
The adjustable feet of the newer dishwasher can be removed completely, and that gives us about 3/16 to 1/4 inches extra, but it’s still too tight to fit underneath.
My options, as I see them, are:
a) separate the countertop from the lower cabinets just enough to provide enough room for clearance, then reattach the countertop once everything is back in place. Existing countertop is laminate like Formica, but there’s the placement of the attached backsplash and obstructing window stoop that will complicate things.
b) remove two sections of laminate flooring from in front of the dishwasher, insert dishwasher, replace laminate flooring. Customer said it’s a Pergo floor. I don’t know if the flooring is glue-in or snap-in construction. Can sections of Pergo flooring successfully be replaced? The dishwasher is located in an inside corner of the kitchen.
c) remove a portion of the underside of the countertop bullnose with a Fein Multimaster. Might look ugly if not done just perfectly. Also, it would clearly show a different thickness in the bullnose above the dishwasher.
d) buy and install a special “low-countertop” design dishwasher. Does such a thing even exist?
Thanks in advance to everyone offering opinions and other suggestions.
Regards,
PK
Replies
Depending on the age of the Pergo, it may be glued to itself.
I would vote for a new dishwasher that will fit the space. There are height differences in standard models, you would have to look around to find one that fits.
No advice but I lived for 17 years in a house where the DW was trapped by Mexican tile, up about an inch from the subfloor.
With just two of us we didn't use the DW much but I always lived in fear of the hassle of replacing the DW.
In any event, hope it works out.
Runnerguy
I'll be of no help here either, but this story should be remembered by those posters asking if the flooring should be installed before the cabs.
The installer should plan ahead ( the topic of another recent posting ) and pin nailed two pieces of the Pergo in front of the washer that could be removed and replaced unobtrusively.
Shorter DWs are made for ADA kitchens where the counters are 34".
Pricey, but they are available.
I always recommend customers do the entire kitchen floor in case the cabinet footprint ever changes.
Chuck Slive, work, build, ...better with wood
Second the ADA dishwasher. I know GE makes 'em. We use 'em in commerical applications where the countertop is at 34", that means the R.O. is something like 32 - 32-1/2"
That'll get you sorted.
While I like to have the finished floor in before install, we generally have to work around the installer's schedule and that usually means our cabinets go in first.
For a solid hardwood, tile or backer board/tile, we just shim up to suit the finished floor and always allow a little extra clearance that's covered with the quarter round/shoe. The finished floor can be carried into the DW space or material can be added there to make the floor surface in that space flush up with the kitchen floor.
I try really hard not to force someone to remove flooring or have to lift the DW up over the flooring to get it out.
I think you need at least 34" for a standard dishwasher
http://store.a1pluselectronics.com/eqwbfusibudi.html
Slab or crawlspace ? I know a guy that installed one from under the house ! No kidding - he cut out the subflooring, headed off a floor joist, and raised it into place from below.
Too much work for me !
Greg
I have used your "Option A" several times. You could also pare a bit of the hidden built up section with the MM
Lower the dishwasher feet as low as possible before starting to pry up the CT.
It is really just the front edge that needs to come up a tad (built-up section).
In reality the "attached backsplash" (postformed?) is good for your cause.
I usually explore a bit for any screws in the run of counter - pull if found. Pry up gently and insert cedar shims between counter and cabinets to hold the front edge up a bit. Inside corner is not going to help - will probably have to search for screws in both runs. Go slow and easy to avoid breaking the corner miter open ----- I would have a shim under that miter for support.
Toughest thing is not dinging / scratching the floor in front of the DW. Cardboard helps in this area.
I think you will be surprised how easily it goes in.
Good luck!
Jim
Dish-drawer. Fisher/Paykel was the first but others have since copied it. I know it's pricey but when you factor in your time to piece together a less-than-optimum solution that may not last...
Sell the FP on low water use, low electric use, it fits in the existing opening with a little bit of trim work, etc.
Good luck, -Norm
roll that puppy on its back and get a cutting torch to the legs.
Had the same thing when I replaced DW after adding 1 cm thick flooring.
Cutoff lip under countertop where dw went in , reinstalled matching moulding.
Also, routed away part of the subfloor so the foot rails could slide in at an angle.
Used old formica strips on the flooring to avoid damage.
Good Luck, Dude. - lol
I had one of those several years ago and - like you described - cut it out with a Sawzall. Completely removing the adjustable feet and peeling back the insulation let me get it in with ~1/8" to spare. It was a real bear sliding the insulation back into place and I had to use shims to raise it back up in the hole.
To this day, I hate flooring contractors who don't mention this sort of thing to their customers. - lol
LOL he said the HO is replacing an old DW with a used one so there's no way they're going to spend the money for a ADA or Dishdrawer..
.
"Thank goodness for the Democrats! If you are terminally unemployable, enjoy living off of govt welfare and feel you owe society nothing you're in luck: there is a donkey waiting for you."
and all this time i thought you were just another pretty face......
i read that part too... and thought the same thing
all it's gonna take is throwing some money at itMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
XOXO.
.
"Thank goodness for the Democrats! If you are terminally unemployable, enjoy living off of govt welfare and feel you owe society nothing you're in luck: there is a donkey waiting for you."
I've found that the newer dishwashers are a bit shorter and have more adjustment in the feet. I know this from having homebuyers decide they want HW floors after the cabinets are installed. Used to be a big problem. Not lately.
Get a new dish washer. A cheap one can be had for ~250 (or less) or a decent one for around $500. Sounds like the cheap one is in line for your client.
Formica, nbd.
Unscrew the countertop from the cabinets, might need to disconnect sink supplies if metal and drain if sink is next door, get partner to pick up front of countertop and slide old out and new in.
If you are worried about strain, take a couple of shims and slide betwix cab and top to left and right of DW to lift laminate up enough.
Done it numerous times.
Might need to caulk, dont go crazy on the top but you should not have a problem with 1/4".
Granite and corian are a little trickier.
Make sure client understands that if the particle board under the laminate is rotted around the sink due to leaking of the sink over the years, then you might get some laminate failure in the area but that is pretty unlikely.
Just be careful when sliding out the DW that you dont catch the edge of the laminate (formica) annd chip it.
Fixed too many of them to mention as well.
most DWs are shorter in the back than in the front allowing you to "roll" the top forward then lift the rear over the flooring.
also, pergo has changed its snap together profile so that you might not be able to purchase mating floor boards. I had an issue where a basement had a leak and I could not match up the flooring that was only 4 years old. ended up replacing the entire floor
can you at least get the old one out ??? i would rip blocks of wood try and cut the feet off with a sazwall then slide it out on the woood blocks
as far as the new one slide it backin on the same blocks and shim it to the counter
Detach the front of the counter top and block it up a little, you should be able to roll the new one under.