I am still working on a money pit I bought last November. It appeared to be a great deal for the wife and I to renovate and move to with plenty of room for the grandkids to romp and the family to gather for holidays and Sunday dinners.
I may have finally turned the corner on this project and am putting stuff back together instead of demolition.
My problem is that I have an interior doorway to the master bath that has a RO of 78″ height in a load bearing wall. I bought a standard pre-hung interior door which needs a 81 1/2″ RO. I don’t want to cut the header down 3 1/2″ and I don’t want to cut 3 1/2″ off of the bottom of the molded fake 6 panel door. As is so often with me, there are other options that I haven’t thought of.
Are there any alternatives that could make this fix easier? I wasn’t kidding when I chose my user name for this forum.
Replies
Take the jamb apart. Reduce both the jamb and door size as needed by cutting the top and bottom of both exactly the same. Reassemble and install.
Now all you have to worry about is how the casing is going to line up with other casing head heights in the hall or rooms.
Dave
This is just an idea, maybe a stupid one, but I have seen in magazines where the author attached the doors to the wall, rather than inside the opening, so the door just closes against the opening rather than within it. Hope I'm making sense. You'd probably have to add a frame around the existing door opening with its stops and all to provide hinge and latch location for the door. (And remove existing casing so door face closes flush against wall opening. And may need to decrease width of opening slightly. Probably should also patch existing hinge locations on door frame (where they've been inlet into frame.)
I like that idea. If you trimmed it properly it could look good."Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
Yeah, I was going to suggest that. Have seen the equivalent for closets, etc, where the ceiling height in the room was below the door opening. (Note that door has to open outward.) If the entire wall is shimmed out the trim will fit flat (on the outside) and you don't notice it until you open the door. Inside you have to extend the jambs somehow, of course.
So convenient a thing it is to be a reasonable Creature, since it enables one to find or make a Reason for everything one has a mind to do. --Benjamin Franklin
Whatcha been readin' there, Danno?
I think i'm picturing what you're saying but i cant imagine wanting my name connected to it let alone write an article about it.
I was thinking about it and I even thought the article was in "Fine Homebuilding," (the horror!), but I must have been wrong. Don't remember where I read it. May have even been in a book. If you don't like the idea, fine, by all means don't use it! Sorry to offend your refined sensibilites! Just because you reject it doesn't make it bad or stupid or whatever. Why don't you suggest something better? I didn't know 6'-6" doors were available. As Steve Martin used to say, "EXCUUUSE ME!"
I called Lowes where I bought the door and they don't have the shorter door available in the 6 panel style. They said they have a flat panel slab door that they will sell me but it costs $18 more for them to cut it off. I don't really like the flat luaun type of door so I have to cut the door and jamb top and bottom to make it fit. Thanks for all of your help and discussion about my problem.
Try a real door place!
Lowes dont know/sell everything.
Doug
I had to replace a door in what started out to be a porch and was converted to a kitchen. It was shorter than standard. I opened it up trimmed the header and added a piece of angle iron, think it was 3" extended over the jacks.
Like previously said the existing header may be gross overkill. You did not say what was over this section (access and loadwise), possible to strengthen from above if accessible. You could open it up and put a 1/4" steel plate, cut up to get clearance, and then put some 1/4"drywall over it.
Just some uneducated hopefully practical ideas.
Bob
"They say, they say, they say"They do not own your house.time for them to listen to what You say. You are the customer!Otherwise, for get about them. Cutting that much off either doorwill ruin it. Why would you want to pay them to ruin a door for you?There are lumberyards all over this country that can and will easily order the right door you need.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I wouldn't recommend that you cut a door that you bought from a big box store. They build these things from all sorts of pieces of wood, and you're likely to discover a cavern hidden under veneer if you cut an inch off the bottom. This is a definite if you have some sort of hollow core there. If you bought one of their pine or fir "real" six-panel doors, you're probably ok in this regard.One of their "luan" hollow-core doors has a piece of wood at the top and bottom about 1 to 1.25" thick. Cut an inch off that, and there's no support left.George Patterson
For the love of pete, I'm apparently talking to myself. You have a perfect situation to fix the header situation in what would take us under an hour.
If it's this much of a stretch to get a hold of the idea, you should just buy the correct door and be done with it.
*shaking head*
Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.
I wasnt trying to ruffle your feathers. All I meant to say was what I was picturing would look ridulous. Admittidly I didnt read the article.
Refined sensibilities? Gotta show that one to the wife. :>)
I guess I got too upset for little reason--when I was telling my dad about this, as soon as I mentioned the idea of closing the door against the opening, rather than in it, he said, "Well, that would look like hell!"
The wall that the door is in has the floor joists for the second floor crossing over it. I'm pretty sure it is carrying a load. The header is a doubled 2x8. I don't know if it would be OK to cut the header down the 3" to make the door fit or cut the door to fit the opening. Looking at the door, taking 1 1/2" off each end might make it look silly. I'll check my local real lumberyard and see what they can offer in doors but their service has not been too good in the past couple of years.
son,your a dissapointment to me :]
do you not see the oppurtuniies here. tear out the header,,get a whole truckload of tgi's in there to make it free span.now while the upstairs are tore apart thats the time to lay those cherry floors you've always dreamed about. now the trim looks crappy so rip it off,oh might as well put in new windows while your there. dang now the siding needs patched,so go get some hardi and start siding,wait you got to replace the windows downstairs so they match the new ones upstairs and the wife always wanted to relocate the kitchen window......... so what type of wood are you going to use for the cabinets,i know the granite is already decided on so your ready to go.
my estimate on raising the door that 3" comes in at 150k ballpark guess [and you can read my sign on name].
now lets get to it,we don't want know hacking going on here.
larry
been their done it were all here to help!!!!!!!
hand me the chainsaw, i need to trim the casing just a hair.
WHOA! stop the train i see your in n.okla up by me. do you have a basement? if not thats where i would start then fix the door. estimate just cleared 200k.
Edited 8/11/2007 10:24 pm by alwaysoverbudget
It is not ok to cut the header down.George Patterson
It was done all the time in the old days with wood frame screen doors. The door is bigger than the frame, the frame is rectangular profile, and the door just covers the frame. You can run into trouble buying Victorian screen door hardware expecting to make it fit on a recessed door of some sort. Never seen it done with regular doors, much less inside the house.George Patterson
Didnt think we were talking about screen doors.
Buy a 6'6" door. Less trimming to fit.
Hollow core 6 panel is cheaper than the labor to re-build a jamb and door rails in a cut down 6'8".
Thanks for the suggestions. I'll mull them over and decide which way to go. I appreciate you all getting back to me so soon.
Like Sphere said - buy 6'6" door.
Return 6'8" currently in possession - even if you get charged for restocking, you are still ahead.
Jim
Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
From a code stand point can he get away with a 6'6" door?
Head clearances for stairs is 6'8" if I remember correctly. Seems like that would carry over to most anything in the home including doors.
Just thinking out loud.
Matt
Why are 6'6" doors sold then?
I was just curious about it. Not questioning you at all. It might be allowed for all I know.
Matt
Hey tall one.
IIRC. I don't know!
This has got me thinking, I am going to research this some more.
If it's less than 6'8" here I am going to kick that BI in the crotch. LOL
Matt
Code for stairs here is 6'5".
Really? Jesus man, that would make my life easier framing some of the houses I get into. 3" doesn't sound like alot but in stairs it may as well be a mile.
Matt
If the current door is shorter, and he isn't changing the framing, I'm pretty sure any height restrictions would be grandfathered.
So convenient a thing it is to be a reasonable Creature, since it enables one to find or make a Reason for everything one has a mind to do. --Benjamin Franklin
6'8" head room minimum for new construction around here. (stairs and doors)
6'6" doors fairly common in some of the medium-old houses, really old = 6'8"+
If 6'6" exists, I am allowed to replace with same - check with your BI - may be the same where you are.
Jim
Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
Here's an idea, :)
Exchange your 6' 8" pre-hung door for a 6' 6" pre-hung door!
Fudge factor should be no more than trimming a 1/2"- 1" off the 6' 6" door to get it into the R.O.
Geoff
I have a hard time putting in a short door rather than correcting the poor design. Figure out why the header is so low and make that change. A short door will always be short and everyone who sees or uses it will think the same thing. Correct the header and the problem goes away for the life of the house.
It's not uncommon for door headers to be oversized for the short span because the orginal carp used whatever header material was sitting around. You might be able to cut some out of the existing header. Also, if there is a horizontal 2x plate under the header it's not adding anything and can be cut out. If there is a top plate over the header that can be cut out and the header raised, tying it all together with Simpson straps.
The door RO can be shrunk with some careful measuring and I'll bet 81" will work just fine and with some careful work the top of the jamb can be shaved a little for a tight fit to the header.
Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.
For futer reference, use yuour tape measure BEFORE getting the door.
The standard door height is 6'8"
RO is typically 2-1/2" over that, but you can get away with soemwhat less.
You have a RO that is fine for a 6'2" door. It is not hard to order one and have it within three weeks
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Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
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It should be pointed out that, with a little cleverness, you should be able to have a door height that's only about 1/2" lower than the interfering framing member.
So convenient a thing it is to be a reasonable Creature, since it enables one to find or make a Reason for everything one has a mind to do. --Benjamin Franklin
It is not hard to order one and have it within three weeks.
Can you call my lumber yard and tell them that? Week 6 for simple 4 panel Pine doors..... Nobody local stocks them apperantly and when I say local I mean within 150 miles, I tried everywhere I could find, quickest lead time was the lumber yard which said 3-4 weeks.... apperantly someone missed the boat on that one.
Took so long we installed hollow core Birch doors while we're waiting just so we could finish trim and move on to paint.
Back to that communication thing, nobody told the h/o why we did it so I recieved a frantic phone call at 9pm when they got home wondering why we installed the wrong doors.
I found a knot free piece of 4x4 and made the RO fit the door. Sorry if I made some folks lose their temper. I was just fishing for ideas from experienced folks before modifying any framing. Thanks for all of the help.
Could you raise the header enough to get the 81.5" RO? If you open the wall above the door, you might find that the existing opening could be reframed to raise the header.
The header is right below the double top plate and has the second floor joists bearing on the double plate.
What do you think of using a 4x4 as a header to replace the doubled 2x8? This would give me the RO I need for the door I have. Since the header is only 29" long it isn't spanning a great distance. This gives me a 26" wide RO.
That'll work unless you have pretty tremendous loads on it
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!