I have a problem at the end of my driveway. Current driveway is just gravel. The joint between the roadway and driveway continually washes out.
The driveway is pretty much on solid sandstone.
I’m left with 2 choices – try to dig out and place in a pipe or maybe go with a concrete or asphalt apron at the end of the driveway.
I think the Apron might be easier than installing a pipe. Since it would be a small area – 200 SF or maybe 4 CY or concrete – I’m thinking of going with concrete instead of asphalt.
I do have concerns about freezing/heaving since I’m located in western Pennsylvania. Maybe that wouldn’t be a problem since I’d be right on the sandstone.
Any thoughts/suggestions ?
Replies
How deep is your bar ditch? If you have a pretty good dip there, a concrete apron will undermine and wash out UNLESS you contour it to allow the water to flow over it when any flow is present. If you put a pipe culvert in, you can stay with gravel as long as you rip-rap the upstream side to it won't undermine the pipe. You can do that with dry-stack rock or lay it up with some mortar. Check your county code. Might be a clue there.
I had to Google "bar ditch"--I knew what you meant, but hadn't heard that term. Apparently it's only used out west ("out west" isn't offensive to Texans, is it?)
"bar ditch"in louisiana, we have "bar" pits near roadways that are built up. the dirt to build the roadway higher was "borrowed" from the pits. As jimmy buffett says "i don't pronounce my R's and G's, when i'm speaking southerneze."
Hell, every road I've been on in LA has a bar "just down the road...a beer..."
Nope, it's not offensive. It's what you run off the road and get stuck in when you've had too many at the "bar."
At least that's my experience...
I was thinking of contouring the apron for flow.
There really isn't a ditch now, the shoulder of the road just ends against an embankment and the water just follows the embankment.
My driveway is cut into/through the embankment.
I think maybe the rip rap above and a contoured apron for flow might be the best/easiest. I spoke with my local excavator and he can't say how easy the rock might come out. Wouldn't be very neat, since the sandstone tends to come out in layers somewhat like shale at times.
Well, don't know how ya'll do things up north. Be advised that water sitting in the swale of the apron may freeze and give you an opportunity to "skate" outta your drive... ;-)
Shouldn't be a problem - apron would have a pretty good slope from side to side to shed the water.
How and where is the water coming from that is washing out the gravel?
Is there an existing ditchline on either side of the driveway?
If there is, put in a culvert to redirect the water flow under your driveway.
Usually my preferences is to pave everything, but solve the root problem first.
Impossible is an opinion.
Water flow is just following the shoulder of the road, which is against an embankment.
There really isn't a ditch line above my driveway so I'm not too concerned about a concrete apron washing out - a bit of rip rap should work. I would think if the flow was that substantial a ditch would have formed along the edge of the road by now.
The house was built in the 1850s with the driveway always in the same location as far as I know.
I deal with this a lot in my current job. Culvert is the best option, but not always practical due to ditch depth and utilities. This sounds like the case here. I think the concrete apron/pan will work well. I would strongly recommend that you don't use asphalt. Concrete is a very good material for water conveyance, asphalt is not, and eventually will deteriorate in this application. Additionally a problem I have often seen in this application is that paving contractors goal is smooth flat pavement, they have a knack for filling in swales. <!----><!----><!---->
Rob
Edited 3/27/2008 4:42 pm by robinpillars
You're probably right - concrete guy might be better at constructing the right slope for the apron than asphalt and hopefully more durable too.
I've seen some heavy welded steel structures along some difficult driveway aprons. they act as a drain channel, yet provide a stable method of traversing. How that channel would be welded up depends upon your terrain.
Sometimes they use they to keep cattle in/out of certain areas.
Yep, "cattle guards." Pipe welded horizontally just the space of a hoof so a heifer won't try to cross, but a good place to twist an ankle while getting in the mail...