Replies

1. 
   webby | Sep 08, 2005 04:30pm | #1

   Hey liam I am not an expert but I dont think that the strapping is purely a regional construction technique. It is also a quality thing. In new England and actually all over contractors who work in old sometimes very old construction will apply the strapping because it gives a solid plane over an uneven surface whith which to fasten wall board or blueboard. It allows the contractor to shim individaully each peice of strapping and bring it level or plumb with a sting line. Even in new construction it allows the contractor to provide really flat walls and ceilings.

   It can also 1. allow for more insultation area if say foamed in place insulation is used. and 2. it can allow room for some wiring etc.

   I havent seen it done much around my area because of the added cost.

   I am not sure which way the board would run.

   I would think that you would need the blueboard as it is specially made for veneer plaster application (or else every one would just use drywall). Veneer plaster is also different than joint compounds.

   Just some two cents worth from me

   Webby

1. 
   liam | Sep 11, 2005 01:43am | #6

   Thank you. Very good thinking.  I can see where it could make my ceiling flat and I think it is the way to go.  Liam

2. 
   BryanSayer | Sep 08, 2005 04:42pm | #2

   The backing for veneer plaster (like blueboard) has a special paper with a bonding agent applied. Rock lath is another alternative and should be available in Cleveland, but the coating is a bit thicker than just the skim of a veneer. You will need to try an actual drywall/plaster supply house to locate it probably.

   Plaster cures, while regular drywall compound dries. "Hot mud" like Durabond 45 or 90 is a curing type joint compound. I doubt any joint compound would hold up as a skim coat over a large area like a ceiling. Particularly on ceilings you want to make sure you have a very good bond between the finish coat and everything underneath it. Gravity you know. Plaster is a much harder finish than drywall compound.

   The plasters I use *might* travel to Cleveland. They're really good, but not cheap. Third generation people. Let me know if you want their name.

1. 
   liam | Sep 11, 2005 01:50am | #7

   Thank you.  I will save the message in case I need to plaster a larger area than I am working on.  I can find only "greenboard" in this area so far.  I am investigating if it is the same product.  I may travel to Pennsylvania and get the blue stuff if nercessary. I have been told I can coat regular drywall with Plasterweld to protect the gypsum from moisture and provide the necessary bond for the veneer plaster.    Liam

3. 
   BossHog | Sep 08, 2005 04:58pm | #3

   Strapping ceilings is a very regional thing.

   Here in illinois, I've only seen it done once in my lifetime.

   Out east I think it's pretty much standard practice. Don't know about the rest of the country.

   Personally I can't see any reason for it.

   Childhood is that wonderful time of life when all you need to do to lose weight is take a bath. [Richard Zera]
1. 
   4Lorn1 | Sep 09, 2005 11:36am | #4

   Don't see it much in new construction but even tract housing built in the early 60s and earlier commonly had strapped ceilings. Makes for a nice flat ceiling plane. I doubt if it actually increases the load capacity of the ceiling material. The straps are pretty much all 2'OC same as the trusses. The actual rate of fastening, drywall or plaster to the strapping versus truss bottom or joist, doesn't seem to increase much.It may strengthen the ceiling as a diaphragm member. Helps laterally support the bottom of the gable end and the top of the wall area. It can make running cables a little easier but this is offset by the trouble retrofitting high hat lights into the ceiling. Those straps, typically 1x3s or 1x4s, can get in the way. If you cut the wrong one, one not properly fastened or an area with tender plaster, you can cause the ceiling to sag or even have a section drop. Old work is fun.

1. 
   liam | Sep 11, 2005 01:51am | #8

   Thank you for you thoughts.  Always a challenge.    Liam

2. 
   Piffin | Sep 11, 2005 03:24am | #11

   Typical strapping is run at 16" OC and it not only re-inforces the cieling plane, it reduces sound transmissions between floors on a 2 or 3 story building. The 16" OC layout lets us use 1/2" SR instead of 5/8" on cielings too. The cost is minimal. Our electricians would probably charge us more if we didn't do it, and there is then slight savings in SR costs too. 

    

   Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

1. 
   Brian | Sep 11, 2005 04:10am | #12

   I was planning on strapping the ceilings at my house - soon - 16" o.c. sounds great for sr, skipping some blocking, for wires etc - what do folks use? - I was thinking 2x3's...

   Edited 9/10/2005 9:38 pm ET by Brian

1. 
   Mitremike | Sep 11, 2005 07:37am | #14

   I've strapped really wicked ceiling and I have used 1x3---thick enough to nail with out splitting and shimmes well.There was a mention of butt joints landing on strapping--IMO I wouldn't worry about it--put up full sheets--take the left over strapping cut it 52" long and splice the two sheet together--the extra 2 " on each end catch the other sheets running along side--I'm no help on the "blue board" Not stocked or used in my area--seen it on TOH--Mike" I reject your reality and substitute my own"
   Adam Savage---Mythbusters

2. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Sep 11, 2005 08:07pm | #15

   Mitremike, since Piff is dodging my strapping question, and you've obviously done some, can you clue me in? I've never strapped anything in my live (except maybe my slave).

   blue 

3. 
   Geoffrey | Sep 11, 2005 09:30pm | #18

    Blue, Strapping is only  done on ceilings, not on walls. The use of strapping (1X3) reduces the "crowns" in the ceiling enough to give a fairly flat and smooth finished surface.

         To al others: Blue board is NOT the same as green board, green board is the same as MR (moisture resisitant) board. Blue board SHOULD NOT  be skim coated w/ joint compound, using setting compounds or veneer plaster over lathing is also not a wise choice . Veneer plaster is designed to be applied in a thin (veneer) layer (1/8"-1/4" thick.

   Lathing is typicaly covered with old style plaster designed to be applied in a thicker layer, hence the use of horse hair, in the older versions, to act as a binder during application.

4. 
   Piffin | Sep 11, 2005 09:55pm | #20

   No dodging dude - I got a life to live too. ya thinks I live inside your PC?;) 

    

   Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

5. 
   Mitremike | Sep 12, 2005 01:43am | #22

   Blue--Looks like ya got your answer--my biggest reason for strapping a ceiling is Kitchen crown ---followed by underrun pipes (ie, basement) and lastly because of a severly deteriated old ceiling(plaster) prepped for new rock---Mike" I reject your reality and substitute my own"
   Adam Savage---Mythbusters

2. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Sep 11, 2005 05:23am | #13

   Curiosity is getting the best of me Piffin.

   Would you explain the techniques used to strap a wall?

   I'm curious about the actual installation procedure and sequence. Someone mentioned that they straighten each strap with a string. That would lead me to believe that you'd have to find the high spot first, then place everything to it.

   Am I on the right track?

   I'm thinking that you'd have to start with at least a 3/8 build up on the straight studs that you use on all doors, correct?

   blue

     

1. 
   Piffin | Sep 11, 2005 09:53pm | #19

   Hi Blue.
   I rarey do strapping on walls, except on a cape. Thjere, I run 1" Thermax foam across the studs ( and up the sloped roof and cieling) and then place the strapping horizontally in most cases, but sometimes right over the studs and rafters and screw it on, throguh the foam and into the frame lumber.
   but we always strap cielings. The lumber yards acarry a product called strapping which is milled from spruce 1x3 and finishes to about 3/4" x 2-3/8"
   in remodel work, we usually have sugs in the framing or the house may have settled to one side. We might be jacking it up or not, depending on the overall job. So we can end up with a flat, level cieling which is important, especially in something like a kitchen so the cabinet crown runs trueWe find the lowest spot of the cieling, spin the laser and mark the perimeter on the wall plates. From there, we nail up the strapping at each end, run a string and shim at each connection, nailing through the shin and into the fram lumber above. I have a couple phots of a job ( probably have dozens more someplace on floppies) so you can see the general idea - some are in the new addition and some in the old kitchen.Another advantage of strapping is that is reduces noise transmission from one floor to the next.
    

    

   Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

   
4. 
   DaveRicheson | Sep 09, 2005 01:22pm | #5

   Drywall runs perpendicular to the strapping, or prpendicular to the joist if no strapping ios used. Butt joints break on the straps or the jost in both cases.

    

   Dave

1. 
   liam | Sep 11, 2005 01:52am | #9

   Very good  and thank you for the tips.   Liam

5. 
   BUSTER | Sep 11, 2005 02:23am | #10

   Hi Liam,

   When you mention "strapping, are you referring to metal "hat-channell" ? I have personally used this product to level-out the ceiling in my old house, with excellant results. One of my many in-laws which are in the biz mentioned useing this.  It is a common product @ supplier houses. I also used 1/2" CD board for the 2' o/c spacing, also excellant product (light, fibers in it for strength). Good luck

6. 
   WayneL5 | Sep 11, 2005 08:17pm | #16

   Strapping does not help make wiring easier.  Wiring cannot be tucked in the space between the strapping and the joists because code requires it to be 1¼" from the finished face so there is a reduced chance of putting nails or screws through it.  So the joists need to be drilled or the wiring go above the joists anyway.

1. 
   Brian | Sep 11, 2005 08:48pm | #17

   So would 2x3 strapping be high enough (2" from finished face, including drywall) to meet electrical code if the wires were sitting on top?

   I need to lose some ceiling height and thought of double plating every wall, but 2x3's could solve a few problems at once.

   Can strapping help solve the truss uplift issue?

7. 
   rhurst | Sep 11, 2005 10:14pm | #21

   Here on cape cod strapping is used all the time. In NJ or SC it's not even available (except 8' lenths). It si extremly usefull when sheetrocking basement cielings.

   My experience has show me that it's hard to tell the difference when a good job is doone either way.

   Good luck