DW and I are working to become a “real” company and get out of the position of “job ownership”. These terms are mol from the e Myth books.
E, in this case stands for entreprenuer.
Briefly stated, an original premise of the first book is that most small businesses are “owned jobs”, not ongoing businesses. Owned jobs are the realm of technicians in whatever field. I’ve spent my life primarily as a job owner, but I want to have a business that can survive my passing.
Why? Basic income potential.
If your business is not something that could be sold and could not exist except for you working in it, it is an owned job.
Job ownership isn’t bad! But…
Providing for your company to survive seems a viable option for people such as myself who have no vast sum to retire with. Owning a business that can be sold or that can be run by a trained manager has more than just personal benefits, IMO.
Building a business requires one to train others to do every task that you do. That requires carefully noticing what you do, recording what you do, and learning to teach what you do to others. Again there is the personal benefit of the learning and adapting for the entrepreneur, but there is also the simple fact that one must find and train people to do things that they haven’t done before and that probably will put them into permanent financial betterment. If you can make better money than those you train, if you do it well they will make better money. Who here hasn’t thought of the passing on of their trade skills to younger guys who will eventually replace you? You may also want to carefully train them with business skills as well as trade skills.
Someof those who are in the construction business now might want to consider how they will transform their businesses to not depend on them being there, to transform their businesses into surviving business entities. (Not to mention that such planning and training could protect you from financial problems from illness or accident)
Since I’ve been muddling through my own process of business change, it got me to thinking about the folks here at BT and how many have saleable businesses now and how many are working to have such a business in the future. I sure wish I’d started getting more serious at a younger age.
Replies
hasbeen,
Have you read the Rich Dad book's? ;} It sound's like you have. They helped me rethink my position, and what direction it is going!
Northeastvt
Northeastvt, I found the Rich Dad series to be extremely helpful. I've recommended it to many friends. Some have read him and followed up with some of his recommended activities and they have reaped the rewards. Kyosaki recommends investing in financial knowledge and I don't see how anyone could argue that idea.
blue
Those books are worth their weight in gold. I dont think thats what he's been reading though. In Rich Dad "E" stands for Employee.
The quadrant is E,S (employee, self employed) and B,I(business owner,&Investor). I think i'm still teetering between S & B.
I haven't read it, but I had it recommended to me by my son who was assigned to read it in his MBA program.He told me a bit about the basic premise.
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire
My business is saleable Hasbeen. I've been working at it for at least 26 years as I remember it.
I've offered it up at 5 cents and no ones taken the bait yet.
Seriously, it's not too late to start thinking along the terms you are. Your post laments the fact that you didn't start this line of reasoning earlier, but in reality, today is really the best day to start. You obviously have. It will now work out for you, because you've "crossed over to the enlightened side".
blue
Thanks, blue.I haven't had any offers yet, either! But a guy's gotta start somewhere.
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire
I have been doing something along those lines for different reasons. I grew bored with being a 1 or 2 man show. I also hope my son will be interested in continueing the business so it needs to be a full fledged business to hand the baton along. I also had the accident this summer and found out 1) how little you can do when injured 2) that when you are available for sales calls and answering the phone you seem to get a larger amount of business.
While e-myth is really accurate and good information the two biggest hurdles to growing a business in my book are 1)having enough business with enough man power to pay for the office staff needed. Kind of the classic case of what comes first the chicken or the egg. 2) Finding the capital to allow the growth to occur. All issues with growth require capital and I for one am not wild about a lot of debt so coming up with money to fund growth can be taxing at best.
And of course the age old issue of finding good quality help is the one thing we all share whether you have a simple helper or a 50 man company like Mike Smith :-).
I have a management background but the issues involved in growth have been huge. Personell files, employee handbooks, accounting changes, payroll service, building and truck issues, decisions in terms of what to include and what not too, and of course a constant struggle to figure out how to structure it all. But it is challenging and a lot of fun I think. It sure has kept me busy which has been a good thing. DanT
I haven't found it to be easy! And yes, it requires spending a considerable amount of current income to bet on a possible future.As someone said, the problems of the world are often solved with the simple advice to Press On!
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire
While I think The E-Myth RevisitedView Image and The E-Myth ContractorView Image are really great books that bring up an important concept most every contractor needs to understand they aren't too specific or heavy on implementation about how to go about "getting your business to actually run without you". (For the solo operatorsince it seems "getting your business to actually run without you" is an oxymoron what it means is developing a set of operations and procedures View Imagethat you can follow instead of wasting your time reinventing your business processes over and over again in the every View Imageday operations related to your "job").
Two books I recommend that go a few steps beyond The e-Myth books that I think are really helpful are Susan Carter's How To Make Your Business Run Without YouView Image and
Linda Leigh Francis' book Run Your Business So It Doesn't Run YouView Image.
View Image
Thanks for the suggestions. I just ordered both books.
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire
hasbeen,
I read that book way too late.
In 2002, knowing I was going to be deployed for a year and not wanting to start up, again, when I came home, I sold out.
The total value of my "Business" was the net value of my tools and a few bucks for my time to break someone in and introduce them to a few customers.
If you are doing this soul searching now, and it's not just the business, but life in general let me recommend two books.
One is called the Automatic Millionaire. The other is the millionaire next door.
It's never too late.
I struggle with the RIch Dad-Poor Dad guy. Knowing his story is a bunch of bull makes it hard for me to take his advice or logic seriously.
Thanks for the recommendations.
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire
I started a countertop business in 1994 by putting about seven large on my credit card and sold it six years later for sixty grand.
The guy who bought me closed his cabinet business a year after the purchase and he's expanded and is apparently doing well.
Having the marketplace vindicate your efforts is one of the sweetest things on earth.
Kowboy
Good for you. You must have done well.
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire
robert,
I own the 3 books you mentioned--
in my opinion the " millionaire nextdoor' is BY FAR the best book of the 3---lightyears beyond the other 2.
my problem with" Rich Dad" is pretty much the same as yours
And my very BIG problem with the whole E myth thing is that it is based on what I see as a seriously flawed premise.
the way I see it--------most of us are in what has traditionally been a " Mom & Pop" industry. VERY few of us succeed in " building a business" that can be sold for a value close to the effort in developing it-----Or pass it on to a 2nd generation. the attempt to do so---will cause the "owner" to spend money on the attempt which would be better invested elswhere.
while I personally know very few people who have successfully achieved the sale-or snd generation thing--- I actually know quite a few who used the income stream from the " owned job" classification-or the " investor" classification to build substantial net worth.
simply put, I believe using " owned job" to become" investor"-is a MUCH more realistic path to substantial net worth. My own business efforts CLEARLY fall into what the Emyth crowd sort of sneeringly referr to as " owned job"---- but the way I operate it is closer to investor. I have essentially unlimmited income potential and almost unlimmited personal freedom. I have zero interest in a business entity which would survive me. Long before i pass away , most of my assets will be in a trust( I hope) which will establish a scholarship at a particular school.
you also might want to look into Steven Silbergers' , " The Jewish Phenomenom"----which is-if anything--- even more helpfull than " Millionare Nextdoor"---particularly for anyone raising kids.
Best wishes,
Stephen
Amen, about the bunch of BS.. i had been biting my toung reding those posts but at least someone knows the truth.. have a look at this link.
http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html
his books are more fiction than fact.
So when he uses an anecdote that is not true that makes the advice in his book false?Any time someone wants to rip on Kiyosaki they invariably include a link to the Reed site. Maybe his journalistic integrity leaves something to be desired, but does that mean we should reject all he says?FWIW, I read "Rich Dad, Poor Dad" and found it to be entertaining and thought-provoking. Am I a disciple of his? Not in the least. I bet that most who read his books are more inclined to consider the effects of their financial decisions, which I think is a good thing.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
The book is a fairy tale... nothing makes sense.. maybe the reason people point to reed's link is to enlighten other people :)
If you enjoyed it and found it entertaining thats great, but others should be forewarned..
If you enjoyed it and found it entertaining thats great, but others should be forewarned..
I agree. I would be less critical if he came clean about the past and what transpired prior to his first book.
In my own private life I am often asked business questions. I always preface my answer with an explination of what I did wrong, what I did right and why I packed it in.
The practices that allowed my to feed my family with a small two or three man show operating out of my basement really don't apply to a guy running a 20 employeed business with a building and inventory etc, etc................................................................
I won't dispute that some of his advice is valuable. I just don't thnk that:
a. any of it is groundbreaking
b. that Mr. Kiyosaki himself has proven it to be of any value. He didn't actually use any of his own advice to build his fortune.
Ironically, I've been listening to Dave Ramsey during my afternoon ride home. I struggle to take his advice seriously too. And, he has taken his own advice and proven it works.
Even if it does work, his basic source of income is self promotion. Now that's not all bad. Just so long as you remember that Mr Ramsey and Mr Kiyosaki both count on you buying the hype, and their books, for a living.
In Dave Ramsey's defense, at least he willingly admits that his knowledge was earned in part by his own failure and bankruptcy. Something he shares with Mr. Kiyosaki but that I have yet to hear Mr. Kiyosaki openly discuss on any of his prepaid tv shows.
In the end, if the book helped you shape a better thought process and you didn't drink the koolaid in the process? Than it was worth reading.
I've built and sold several businesses... the only time i ever made any real money is when i sold em.... and several times what i was really doing was collecting the pay i never got while building them... I was never sad to see one go
p
It's really funny how Breaktime works. Just last night I was thinking about E-myth and Rich Dad and how they advocate against "owning a job," thinking about Steve Hazelett's inspiring posts about how he's done well owning a job, and wondering where I fit in the mix.
Since reading the Rich Dad books (I was inspired, don't care if it's a true story,) the Millionaire Next Door books, and the E-myth books, I have been working on changing my approach to life, business, and money so I can do more good in the world and retire comfortably. In the six years or so since I started the process I've increased my net worth by six figures, but I'm still a full-time employee and have an owned job on the side. I am constantly thinking about what my Business might be.
Do you plan to create a viable general contracting business, or some specialty trade, or some other business altogether?
Since reading the Rich Dad books (I was inspired, don't care if it's a true story,)
Disappointing that it is not true, but I would point out how a local self-made real estate millionaire recommended the series to DW and I, as a starting point. (We had already read them)
As to the original posters question, I realize that i own a job, for now. Still unsure if I would want to run a larger operation. But I realized that I owned a job years ago during a conversation with a customer over coffee after work. And have taken measures to not have to count on selling a business in order to retire.
The customer's comment was something like,"You don't own a business, you are simply self-employed. But if you run your self-employment like a business, you can do well."
thinking about Steve Hazelett's inspiring posts
He does have a way of getting your brain ticking, doesn't he.
Bowz
woodguy99 - "It's really funny how Breaktime works. Just last night I was thinking about E-myth and Rich Dad and how they advocate against "owning a job," thinking about Steve Hazelett's inspiring posts about how he's done well owning a job, and wondering where I fit in the mix. "
Stephen said what? Where? (the search function isn't working for me tonight)
Interesting, I would like to see that post and read what he written because he's one of the (few) people here who I think of as owning a business instead of just owning a job. .
View Image
Might be http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=82377.1 since he posted several interesting post in the thread.
Cheers
damn, am I fat!
Hmmnn, I had read that discussion before. This might at first glance seem a bit too nuanced or perhaps splitting hairs but I recall Stephen talking about his dislike of having employees but I think there is a difference between running a business with no employees and just creating a "job" for yourself.Unfortuantly, I think most solo operators are just creating a "job" for themselves and not really running their solo operation as a business. From my observations over the years I think Stephen runs a business regardless of whether he has employees or not.
View Image
Have you been using the advanced search in the upper left?
damn, am I fat!
Yup sure was. My survival here is predicated on the Advanced Search but every once in a while it just returns zippo even when I'm looking for something I knew I wrote. It wasn't working for me earlier when I went looking for Stephen posts but seems to be working fine for me now.
View Image
Jerrald, Stephen's been saying great stuff for years, but the thread Rez pointed out is particularly good. He admits to owning a job but he runs that job like a business.
From the books I've read (many you've recommended!) a good business can operate without you running it. For somebody like Stephen that's not the case, so it's a job, but one he has purring like a kitten (or a Harley).
woodguy99 - "Jerrald, Stephen's been saying great stuff for years, but the thread Rez pointed out is particularly good. He admits to owning a job but he runs that job like a business.
From the books I've read (many you've recommended!) a good business can operate without you running it. For somebody like Stephen that's not the case, so it's a job, but one he has purring like a kitten (or a Harley). "
I think Stephen is underselling himself in that regard. Although I really only know him and his business through these forums over the years I do think Stephen has a real handle on his business that anyone can grab. Having a "job" in a business you run is different than having set-up a business just so you have a "Job". It's long distance analysis and thinking on my part but I think if Stephen wanted to sell his business he could spend a few month with a potential buyer and show him how he's done things and how to to do things and it (the business) would be worth some bucks.
On the other hand this roofer I know near me when I look at his business I see all it really does is provide him with a "Job". I wouldn't give him 2¢ to show me the ropes and buy his so-called business. In fact I think I could start a roofing company on my own and surpass his operation in a matter of months if not weeks.
Stephen has an approach (methods and systems) that if he was so inclined he could teach and pass on to others. This guy I know has no real approach or method to what he does at all. All he can do if put down shingles and I'm not so impressed by his method and organization there too.
View Image
I'm "sort of" in the real estate business.About 11 years ago I remodeled the office of a local broker. He convinced me that I didn't need any sales experience and would do fine in real estate. I took the classes, got the license, and did very well working for him for 3 years. In early '99 I opened my own real estate office, my wife got her license, and I trained her to run the business. About 4 years ago I left the office to build our new home and I haven't gone back.That's not to say I have nothing to do with the business! My wife runs the office, but I still am regularly involved with training, consulting, and strategizing for the future. Our real estate business now takes about 10-15 hours a week of my time, primarily as the company problem solver. I also spent a majority of this year remodeling and expanding our office.The business that I'd hope to sell or hire a manager for would be the real estate business.I vastly prefer building to real estate! I plan to start back into new construction at some point with the hope that perhaps my older son will come and join in when he's ready. He's only 23 now and in school getting an MBA. After he plays around for a few years (he's currently seriously into climbing, camping, biking, kayaking, boarding, etc) I expect that he will get more interested in business. IF, and it's a big if at this point, he comes back and wants to work with me building, then we could have another possible ongoing business.And I'm always looking for something else that could make a good business. Right now every storage outfit in our county is full. Hmmm...And you?
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire
And you?
LOL, I just got in the mail a flyer for "Maines Self Storage" which is something my brother and I have been talking about for years. Some sort of franchise deal. We can't get past the fact that you need to have somebody around to manage the day to day stuff. That and right now he's living in another state.
After work tonight I was having a beer with a buddy on my crew and he offered me partnership in his prospective business, a side job to our day job as employess for now, called Door Doctors. We are both trimmers at heart (though framing a house right now) and see a need. Everybody has doors in their homes that need tuning up, heck, I have several that won't close properly. I'd hire somebody like me to come in and get my doors operating properly for a fair, predetermined price. Later the business could be expanded into installing new doors, making doors, etc.
Several food related business ideas.
Several green design/development ideas.
At the moment, having analysis paralysis, working too many hours for my employer and working as a self-employed designer on the side, and rebuilding my house and rebuilding my rental house and....
Your son sounds much like me ten years ago. He'll come around to business, it's the best adrenaline rush....
Doing ones own thing usually requires working (when you are already tired) on something that won't pay off for years. But hey, it's worth it.And I'm also rebuilding a rental, working on extensive landscape plans that won't be done for years, etc.Yup, you can't beat business to get you going!
"Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd."
~ Voltaire