Hi guys, I’m trying to come up with a price for hanging about 20 interior doors. The pine jambs are already set (loosely) but are not routered for hinges or strikes. So I need to router gains in hinges and door, set door, adjust jamb, apply casing (wood) and drill for & install lockset, install door stops.
My Means “Home Improvement Cost Guide” 1990ed. says it should take 4.1hr per door. If I use a rate of $40/hr, add 20%O&P, I get $196.80 per door.
Does this seem too high? Does anyone out there have productivity rates for this?
Replies
With casing $90.00 - $110.00 (canadian) per opening. If jambs are fixed and the doors have to be cut down, use the higher end of the scale. If your getting $196.80 per door. Shut up, smile, and say thank you!
If you are set up well you should be able to crank out a door in an hour and a half. That's good money. Good for you.
Dave
Dave, are you sure about the productivity? Does you r price include routering hinge gains, and strike, and drilling for the lock?
BTW thanks for all the feedback everyone!
GB, if you don't have a fancy aluminum router jig for hinges, make your own from some plywood scraps and a top-bearing hinge mortising bit.
Rout the jamb first, mount the hinges, and get the door into place. When you like the reveals, use a knife to mark the hinge locations. Set the door in a door buck and rout the hinge locations. Hang the door. Drill and mortise for the strike.
Depending on the complexity of the casing, the first door would take me four hours or so. Once I got a system down the time would go down, but an hour and a half seems pretty optimistic if you have to case the door too. Maybe after ten doors if the casing's simple you could get it down to that.
I've done between fifty and a hundred doors total this way, so I'm not the biggest expert in the world but I have a pretty good idea.
"This is a process, not an event."--Sphere
Thanks Woody, I'm thinking to make a MDF jig with templates for 2 hinges. Then I could route the jamb with a 3/32 shim at the top and then the door flush to jig. I guess I would need one for LH door and one for RH doors, in order to have a stop on the jig to reference edge of door and edge of jamb.
If your just a Luddite, excuse me...otherwise, you could pay yourself less to buy this than to make something<G>http://www.amazon.com/Bosch-83038-Deluxe-Hinge-Template/dp/B0000224KW/ref=pd_bbs_4/104-6086153-5428745?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1172872742&sr=8-4Since the frames are in loosely, do you know if the heads are even level? Might have to trim the legs, too. I'd count on starting from scratch. Then, with lugging the doors around and clean-up, I'd say the Means numbers are real close...I'm gonna have to check that book out<G> Outside of the gates the trucks were unloadin',
The weather was hot, a-nearly 90 degrees.
The man standin' next to me, his head was exploding,
Well, I was prayin' the pieces wouldn't fall on me.
Thanks, Snort, the price looks good and I could theoretically have it here by Mon. morning! Did I mention I'm in Canada? In a small town, neither of our 2 hardware stores had any clue about these jigs.
BTW, had dto look up Luddite in the dictionary? What a concept.
Yeah, you Canadiens are way past that, eh? ;-) really<G>Good luck...and come back with how it turns out Outside of the gates the trucks were unloadin',
The weather was hot, a-nearly 90 degrees.
The man standin' next to me, his head was exploding,
Well, I was prayin' the pieces wouldn't fall on me.
Hi again Snort, Luddite indeed?
"It could be a lot better, I was almost thinking of making my own templetes that would be more reliable and accurate. Its hard to beleive that they would sell this on the open market."
This is a quote form one of the reviews of the Bosch hinge jigs!
Have you ever used one of the jigs? Seem to be lots of complaints about accuracy and repeatability.
Also can't get it to Canada by one day shipping. Big rush job as carpetting contractor coming next week!
As far a s letting you know how it turns out, I will. Probably won't get hired because price too high.
Thanks to all.
I've used that jig, and it's Stanley predecessor, plenty. I wouldn't try prehanging any other way unless it was a single door. You CAN make your own jigs, plenty of folks do, but seriously, once you understand how to use and manipulate that door hinge template, you'll never go back.
If I were to bid the job you described I'd plan on removing the "loosly nailed" jambs with a sawzall, knocking them down to prehang the doors, reassembling the jambs and installing the doors as prehungs. 4 hours/door is doable if you don't have to transport doors to or from the jobsite and have a interuption free work environment onsite.
Any deviation from optimum working conditions and 4 hours/door sounds tight to me. Remodeling contractor who once visited the Glass City.
Unfortunately, the header jamb is glued to the side jambs. The guy rabbeted the side jambs so there is lots of glue area. Think we will have to router the jambs in place.
Well, I'd still plan (bid) to cut them out and start over hanging them after prehanging. But that's just me.
What was the original plan, anyway? For someone to mortise the jambs and doors after the jambs were set? What does anyone gain by that sequence? Remodeling contractor who once visited the Glass City.
Good question, Jim, I think the guy doing the work just doesn't know how to hang a door. I certainly pointed out to the owner that that is not how I would procede.
I guess handling the router would be a bit easier if I could lay the jambs on a bench, but I am worried that the jambs would get wrecked if taken apart. I think leaving the jambs up and nailing the jig to the jambs should work OK, and probably save time too.
Thanks to all for a lively discussion of a fairly mundane matter.
I have used the Bosch jig and the Porter Cable...the PC was a PITA to set up...the Bosch is a breeze, and is really good at morticing jambs in place.Once you're set up, it shouldn't take more than 15-20 min a jamb.For the job you're describing, routing the hinge gains is the easy part...it's all the associated stuff that eats up the time...but it will be a much better finished job than than most pre-hungs.Good luck Outside of the gates the trucks were unloadin',
The weather was hot, a-nearly 90 degrees.
The man standin' next to me, his head was exploding,
Well, I was prayin' the pieces wouldn't fall on me.
Thanks to all for your interest.
I called the owner late afternoon and stuck to my price. He says the guy who hung the jambs(Larry) hung 3 doors in 6 hours one day. I said OK hire me by the hour (for $40) if it goes that quickly. Long story short, Larry is working for $25. If owner hires me, Larry quits. Larry has baseboard all cut and ready to nail, etc.
I guess I wasted a good part of yesterday chasing the almighty buck when I should have been planing fir for baseboard for my own house.
Am very impressed with all the advice, opinions at BT. You guys helped me with confidence to stick with my price and I probably avoided working for $10 per hour.
I hope it goes well for Larry. He is supposed to work the weekend, and have all the base and doors done by Tues, when the carpet layers are supposed to start. I don't know how he can work for $25 and think he is making a decent living. Also don't know why he would install the jambs before morticing the hinges... I know he has been self employed in renovations for at least 10 years. I guess he doesn't read FHB.
If any further developments I will report back. Thanks GB.
Goldenboy, your first clue should have been "the doors are loosely hung".
The guy trying to hire you was/is exactly the type of guy you should NEVER bid or work for. Larry is an idiot.
Don't be an idiot. See the signs, then just say NO.
blue"...
keep looking for customers who want to hire YOU.. all the rest are looking for commodities.. are you a commodity ?... if you get sucked into "free estimates" and "soliciting bids"... then you are a commodity... if your operation is set up to compete as a commodity, then have at it..... but be prepared to keep your margins low and your overhead high...."
From the best of TauntonU.
As I said, when set up properly, It can be done very quickly.
In my area Home depot charges $150.00 to install a pre-hung interior door, you are doing substantly more work, so I would tend to think your price very reasonable, even abit on the low side
I don't recall the amount, but I have heard it is significantly more than $150 at HDI've heard an exterior door (max 3'0", no side lights) is $500 for install.It may be that my friend who informed me of this embellishes a tad.
My local HD has a sign that says "Basic installation starting at only $149". That's for a pre-hung door in an extsiting jamb. Everything, and I mean everything, beyond that basic install is extra $$. Remove the old door from the jamb, installing lockset and strike plate, disposal of the old door...it doesn't take much to get over $200 - easy - for a pre-hung unit.
A slider install starts at "$496".
-Norm
Obviously a difference in our locations, but guys I know here in New Jersey would charge $250 to remove an old door and install, trim, and install the knod for an interior door.
I understand it's a different situation, but those are prehung doors, and you need to do all the morticing and fitting.
It's more work involved, and I think you are leaving some cash on the table.
But if you get 2 or 3 done a day, that's not bad money at all.
Too high$$? No.
Best to you and yours, Chris.
Some say I know too much? Can you ever?
I would be able to do two, or maybe three doors like that a day. With the right jigs possibly four doors. If you want $400 to $800 a day charge $200 a door.
The pine jambs are already set (loosely) but are not routered for hinges or strikes
What exactly does "loosely set" mean? Are the jambs nailed into the opening already? If so, I figure you should count on having to fight them in order to obtain even reveals around the door perimeter, etc.
You've described a pretty full scope of work -- I think 4.1 hours seems pretty quick, unless you're a specialist. But since you're actually charging for about 5 hours, you'll probably do alright. With 20 doors, you'll develop a rhytym pretty quickly.
Jambs are attached with a few nails only. Fairly sure they will be easy to shim to suit door. As carpet will be FF, a bit of tolerance in leg length OK.
The headers seem to be the right width, 3/16 wider than doors (I only checked a few).
Thanks to all!