I am working on my friends house and she wants me to fix the bedroom door.
Just to give you a backround I have posted some stories about the “creative fixes” both structural, plumbing, and electrical that I have found in this house in the past. May of them are similar to the “what in the hell where they thinking” thread that was posted a few days ago.
Needless to say nothing is level, square or plumb.
Anyway the door won’t close. It is rubbing agains the stop on the hinge side and the door is hitting the jam on the latch side.
Also it looks like it might be hinged bound. I can’t it closed even to tell for sure, but the gap at the top is small.
The hinges are set in extra deep and even more so at the at the edge away for the knuckel.
Rather then trying to patch the hinges and redo them just to move the door an 1/8″ from the stops and still have the problem on the latch side.
So I thought that I would so this.
Shim out the hinges so I have normal clearence with the jam on the hinge side.
Pull off the stops.
Then scribe the door to the jam on the latch side and trim it with a saw or plain. Not sure how much I have to get off.
Then resetting the stops.
Am I missing anything or a better way to do these (other than a match <G>).
Replies
Bill--IMO ,if your door has a standard Kwikset or Schlage lockset, you're going to have to take off the extra width on the hinge side ONLY. If the door is already bored, cutting or planing the latch edge will change the set-back for the latch bore,and could begin a whole new bunch of headaches. That said ,if you only need to remove a little of the edge ,you MIGHT be able to take it off the latch side and move the lockset slightly. However, I would still just plane the hinge edge.
Thanks
I *think* that the overlap on the jam is only below the latch, but I will check that before I do the cutting.
As I said, nothing is square. If it overlaped the whole jam then triming off the hing side and reseting them would be the way to go and solve several problems.
Bill-- A quick follow-up to my previous post[my brain no longer works at full speed on Fridays<G]. Is the hinge side of the door beveled? That could be part of the problem being hinge-bound. Hope this helps, and good luck.
Maybe it's beveled, and was installed backwards?
Can the stops be removed, or was the jamb cut from one piece of wood?Do it right, or do it twice.
Tell your friend to call a carpenter
Woodrow
Furgit about it.
a) She has already spend more money that she orginally planned with all of the repairs.
b) I am a woodworker and I have installed a few prehung's and fix a couple that rubbed a little, but I have never fixed out this out of wack before. And it is good practice as I figure that I can't make it any worse.
c) She would probably end up with the carpenter that installed the double doors in my basement. I was having problems with them and could not figure out what was going on untill I did some measurements and the look closer. They look like the where cut by a drunk beaver.
If you are that hard up for work maybe all of the people on the forum and send you 5 bucks.
I think what you're proposing sounds reasonable. Shep's point is also valid. I would have some concerns with the "hinge bound" portion. I read that to mean the hinge side of the jamb is not plumb. If that is true, most anything you do will give you a headache if you don't fix that first.
If it's only very little (which it could be quite easily) a long screw through the hinge closest to the bulge might suck things tight enough to work. Barring that, you reset the jamb. Once it's plumb, the scribing works fine on old doors, but the process now begs the question, if you're pulling the casing and a jamb leg, why not just do the whole thing.
The hinge side should not be beveled. On slab doors intended for prehung units (and sold slightly undersize) both sides are beveled to take away the beveling part of setting the door. But I don't think it's likely in an old home, and I'm not sure I see the rationale. I square the edge up for hinges anyway. IMHO, leaving the bevel is just asking the door to move a little on you.
" To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100
The hinge side should not be beveled.
Got to disagree with you on this one. The hinge bevel does not need to be as pronounced as the leading edge, ( 1 or 2 degrees is fine ) but it is always good to have the additional clearance in case of a twisted jamb or a raised hinge screw. The biggest reason we do it is planning ahead for paint buildup and the long term prevention of hinge-bind.
carpenter in transition
Edited 2/22/2003 5:12:37 PM ET by TIM_KLINE
Still trying to figure it out? Would be much easier to call a carpenter."One measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions"
Are you sure the problems don't rest in the installation of the jambs?? Sounds like I would want to pull the casings and redo the shimming of the jams. Then address the hinges set in extra deep if there are still problems. Finally look at shaving some off the door.
But, to steal a tag line, What do I know??
Another day, another tool.
Bill, Woodrow may have the ultimate answer here, maybe you should just back away slowly...
Whaddya mean the doors' rubbing on the stop? and it's hitting the jamb at the same time? This has gotta be one racked out door.
The first tweakage w/ any door is usually with longer screws that hit the framing ( I know this was brought up before, but this danged desparo answereing system doesn't help me give me a way to give credits due). Your unfortunate situation sounds a bit like the one I'm having setting a house full of solid core pre-hung split jambs...Monday I'll try to post some hinge springing pics...
Are you sure the stops are moveable?
Can't believe Phill and Gary haven't clocked in here with the "real" fix<G>
EliphIno!
Did this door ever close properly? You mentioned the gap at the top is small, is it even? The gains for the hinges should be flush with the jamb not extra deep. Is it possible that the hinge screws came loose and someone tried to fix it, by deeping the hinge gain? Does the door strike the latch side all the way or just in spot?
Suggestions: remove casings, check for movement in the jamb(ie. loose screws, shimming) check to see that the jamb is not twisted, put in screws behind the hinge leafs to tighten up any movement, adjust shims if needed.Fix the hinge depth. Check that the knuckes are not twisted. Do not plane off entire side of lock side!!! Bevel or not on the hinge side, from your description this door needs to be completley rehung.
I finaly got to door. There are so many "projects" in this house. She has only been in there 6 months and we have been working in it continously. In that room we pulled off old panneling and drywall and redid the electrical. The new drywall just got finished 2 weeks ago and she is painting in there. So no telling how long it has been happening.
I am glad that I ask about this here. I pulled the casing off and found that the bottom 1/2 of the casing on the latch side was loose. When I push that in then it appears that the door won't bind on side.
The real problem is now on the top. There is 1/4" shim on the hinge end of the top, but on the latch side the head casing is right on the header and that is where the top of the door is binding.
And that all makes sense. The hinge side is right over the basement wall, so the latch side is towards the outside. And there has been settle in the house with a bowed foundation that was just fixed. And there was a remodel in the mid 70's where they took a door and some windows and put in new windows, but in a slightly different area and did not fix the header all the way. And there is a little bow in that wall, but all of the trim matches that bow and I don't think that it has moved since them.
My guess is that the door was put in during that remodel and made to match the sag and then with the foundation problem it moved another 1/8".
But it was poorly done at the time and the stops where to tight and I will reset them. And after I get the top of the door planned down I will then check the side fit. It looks it will will work, but there it is close. And the gains are not just deep, but rather rather the edge of the hinge away from the pin is deeper then the edge near the pin. And the bottom of the hinge gain is deeper than the top.
So I will plan a little off the hinge side and clean up the gains and that should give me good clearance on each side.
Thanks all.
Bill,
How are the door frame & casings? Could it be this is just clapped out? A few hefty wood screws could resecure the door frame to the 2x4's behind it. That would give you a bit more room.
(In edit I didn't read far enough, It seems part of this was the issue... Continue on though...)
And here is another thought. Could this be the wrong door for the opening? Search thru the house. Possibly someone removed doors to move furniture or to hang beads. In doing so they stack the doors in the basement then reassemble when the house is being sold. I had 5 doors in my basement when I moved in. It appears to be a realtors trick to keep us from seeing everything is out of square. If it looks screwy it could be the doors were swapped. Ignore color, measure instead.
Edited 2/24/2003 8:02:22 PM ET by Booch