I know the feeling, a customer who’s pulled the trigger on purchasing materials or products, then turns to you to make it all better!
I guess the fact that the manufacturer recommends against it doesn’t scare me too much, since I’ve been on that side of the business and they often err on the side of extreme caution. The two things that do worry me are the thin section of the flooring and the direct contact with the concrete.
I don’t know if you’ve got room for any firring, sleepers, iso board, etc, but I sure wouldn’t want the wood in direct contact with the slab. That slab will always be cold, and the wood will also be cold if there’s no insulation of any type. This almost guarantees moisture on the warm side surface. A whole lot of circulation and dehumidifying could work, but no sure thing.
The other moisture consideration would be through the concrete (I’m assuming that the area stays dry as far as seepage or leakage is concerned). You’ll always get a bit of moisture through the concrete, and you’d have to have a good vapor barrier to keep moisture from wicking up into the wood. With only 5/16 in board thickness, there’s not going to be much dimensional stability in that flooring.
Sometimes its better to walk away from a job. Regardless of what he signs, you may be safe from a legal standpoint, but all that will remain is a customer telling his friends that he hired you to put in a floor and now the floor’s no good.
Replies
See of they can return the materials (with stocking charge) or unload it on ebay - I would not damage your reputation.
In two years, when the floor is toast and their friends (your potential new clients) come to visit, all that will be remembered is Duey installed this floor and it looks like C&*&. In your absence, over cocktails, the best they can say is: "I know it doesn't look like it but he did a good job, as he installed it in accordance with our direction and against the manufacturer instructions". And with that endorsement, you will not see any return business...
I would try harder to convince them they made a mistake and get them to purchase the right materials - Do a quality job and think about the long term.
The only way I'd consider doing this would be to give the slab an epoxy coating, then use polyurethane adhesive -- Bostik's Best or similar.
Do negate any guarantee, implied or otherwise, in writing to the client.
IanDG
In addition to signed waivers, I would want to assuree myself that it will work. A sharplawyer can use a waiver against you arguing that by the written wiaver you show yourself aware that this is an improper installation with potential for trouble. You get painted as the Knowledgeable party, the one who should have known better, like the parent who allows their teen daughter to attend a party where liquor will be served afdter having her sign a promise that she herself will not drink and that if she does drink adult bveverage, she will act responbsibly. Yeah, Sure!
So, tape a sheet of plastic over the concrete for a week to see if any moisture shows up under it. I wouldn't think of doing this job if any moisture shows itself.
Another idea.
I have seen some 24"squares of OSB that snap together for basements as an underlayment. Ity has some plastic dimples on the bottom to provide a drainageplain. Never used them, but it's an interesting idea
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The OSB, unfortunately, still wouldn't stop the humidity.
Generally I'd steer clear of any combination of unventilated spaces, moisture and timber --- remember dry rot! View ImageI've used the epoxy sealant successfully to lay parquet on slabs that [in one case] were less than 2 weeks old so I wouldn't be worried about moisture from the concrete -- the polyurethane adhesive is a moisture barrier too. I would be worried about moisture from the walls and the area generally though.
IanDG
Piffin,
I think you are talking about Sub-Flor, which has Delta-FL glued onto the bottom of 2' sq OSB. We used this under our below grade installation of Bamboo flooring and have been very happy, so far. The room itself feels much warmer than with the carpet, and the floor walks very nicely. Plus, we were able to nail our application down rather than glueing, which is a plus if you need to straighten any boards. This is an expensive solution, however, and if I could get the Delta-FL I need on it's own, then I'd go that route. When you are just doing a room here and there, the Sub-Flor is great.
Dri-Core has a similar product, but it uses a different source for the isolation membrane.
I think the dri-core is what I saw.
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vapor barrier, foam insulation between 5/4" sleepers.
Advantech subloor and go to town.
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I don't think a waiver would be worth the paper it was written on.
If you end up in court over it, the judge will say you're the "expert" on this, and should have known better. You'll be hung out to dry.
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Something along the same line happened to a car repair place my Brother worked at. Someone came in wanting some brake work done. They just wanted new pads - Didn't want anything else done, even though the garage recommended it. The garage had them sign a waiver and did what they wanted.
But then the guy got in an accident. His lawyer sued everyone he could think of, including the garage that did the brake work. Even though the customer signed a waiver that stated he understood their recommendations, the judge ruled against the garage. He said the customer wasn't an expert in brakes, and wasn't capable of making an informed decision.
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