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This discussion is prompted by an addition that we are doing to our home. We have come up with an idea to move the front door and the solution would be better if we could use a high quality, watherproof sliding door rather than a standard hinged door.
So, what is the best choice for sliding doors? We do not envision an all-glass door, but one that really can be a front door with a small window and otherwise solid.
Replies
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Hi Peter,
Depending on where you live, one of the regular boys could fit a standard exterior door to the frame of a standard sliding door assembly.
Gabe
*It is my humble opinion that a sliding door will not last a fraction of the time that a hinged entry door will especially if this front door is commonly used.Pete Draganic
*Peter - You need to check the building code in your area. Single family homes require only one means of egress in most codes up to three stories, and in most jurisdictions it is generally a matter of convention that it is the front door.If you mean that you plan to change the primary entrance to your house to a sliding door IMO you need to first determine whether or not a sliding door can be a legal means of egress in your jurisdiction.b Been there (never) done that, can't remember ...
*Peter,I agree with Pete that the slider will not wear well. Is there any chance of a outswinging front door fitting gracefully into your home's entry gestalt? Hinge pin security is not an issue with the correct hardware.Bill
*There was a discussion here a few months ago about an exterior pocket door. As I recall, no one really knew how to do it and make it weather tight. One guy said he had one but never posted how it worked or where he was located.
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Wonder what is used for a lockset? Can't recall any "keyed" pocketdoor hardware suitable for exterior use. How about screens and storms for pocketdoors?
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Take ahold of the top and bottom legs of a letter Z, and pull them apart until it is almost flat... If you made the track for the slider in that shape, the door could move from one position, where it would seal to a frame, (closed), to another position where it would slide easily into a pocket, (open).
This would take up probably almost 3 times the length of a normal slider track. That way it could be sealed to the weather, but the hardware would still have to be worked out in reference to locking.
Another track idea would be a letter F. The two legs of the F being at the door opening. The door would slide as normal, and the track would be the same length. When the door is pulled completely out of the wall to the door opening, it would then slide forward in the two legs of the F and seal to the frame. The locking hardware could basicaly be identical, except it would be, for example, a deadbolt on each side of the door. (Side-side, not front-back) Come to think of it, the locks could be the same on the other track setup as well.
A standard screen/storm could be mounted to the outside of the frame.
*FWIW, I used to have a house where we used the sliding patio door 99.9% of the time. Drove me crazy, I'd never do it again.Bob
*Well Peter, I guess I was wrong. The regular guys don't know how to mortise a standard door to accept standard heavy duty slider hardware and locksets for your home.Guess you'll have to export your drwgs north of the 49th and import the finished product.Gabe
*I like Luka's concepts. The flat Z is similar to a van's sliding door, in that it drops into the locked position. Besides being secure, it provides critical alignment just at the latching point, something you wouldn't necessarily get with a straight slider.
*here's my opinion... based on 25 years of helping people make these decisions...if this is your primary entrance .. don't do it..use a hinged door, minimum of 3/0 x06/8.. anything less or anything sliding is going to be sub-standard and you will not be improving your house.. but rather downgrading it.go back to the drawing board... this only SEEMS like a good idea..b but hey, whadda i no?
*You may have already considered this...But would an out-swing entrance door work?
*How 'bout one of them roll-up security doors like at the local Quickie Mart? I've seen them in non-garage door sizes. All ya do then is design the rest of the facade so it doesn't look out of place. I'm thinking retro/gas station. Jeff
*Yeah! Hook up a Genie garage door opener and you have a hands-free, secure, entryway, :-}John
*Peter Polshek:I would guess most of us here are interested to know a little more about your particular situation, please let us know more. I guess what I am trying to say is "are you sure you can't work a conventional swinging door in to your design?". As mentioned above a space saving out-swing door can be done securely using hinges with non-removable pins. Pardon my old fashioned view but you will probably live to regret anything else. I'm with Mike Smith on this one.
*Baldwin makes a great cylinder-keyed pocket set. No, don't ask how much ...b Been there ...
*I know swing outs arethe norm in Sweeden. The idea is the blowing wind pushes the door against the weather stripping to make a better seal. Actually this would work nice in my house, gotta see who makes them here. Jeff
*Jeff, Keep the door you have. Just flip it to the outside. Drill a hole through the center barrel of the hinge and the hinge pin at the same time, and use a spring pin to hold the hinge pin in place.If you drill the hole from the outermost side of the hinge, and toward the leafs of the hinge, no one will be able to drive the spring pin out and remove the hinge pin. The only direction they will be able to drive the spring pin is towards the house/door. It will stop at the leafs.
*Swing-out front doors are also the norm in one neighborhood in which I lived in Tampa. I don't know the reason, but I do know it would be a lot harder to break down. Mark
*If you use an outswing, be sure to shim behind the latch plate and behind the hinges. This is good practice on any door, but critical in this circumstance. Otherwise, it's a simple matter to insert a flat bar between the door and jamb, then pry them apart so that the latch no longer engages. Doing this, an intruder could be inside your house within 30 seconds. Andy
*Gee, Andy, how'd you know that? :)Jeff
*Now Jeff, don't be suspicious. I was on the receiving end of that treatment. Kind of made me wish that we'd adapted certain aspects of Islamic law, particularly those that pertain to cutting off the right hand of thieves.Andy
*Andy - I'm very sorry to hear that it happened to you. You make good points about latch throw and doors that open in vs. out etc. Another problem we've seen in this area is that in certain neighborhoods, double front doors were popular for awhile. One builder was notorious for installing them with cheap 1" hinge screws. Several people, including a couple we know, came home to find the doors lying flat in their foyer, knocked right in by brute force.I'll vote for your 'disarming' solution any day.Best - Jeff
*In college, we made a maids closet "key" out of a couple of short lengths of 2x4 and a hinge. between the two.This tool was placed within the door jamb spanning the width of the door. The thing was about an inch too long and the hinge had to be at a slight angle for it to fit. By pushing the hinged center in toward the door, the jamb would spread enough that the latch would clear the strike plate and you were in. This really taught me to block behind hinges and strikes.
*Ryan, I did a lot of silly stuff in college, but breaking into a maid's closet wasn't one of them... But that's OK: Whatever excites you is fine with me. (Was the maid inside?)Curiously, Steve
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This discussion is prompted by an addition that we are doing to our home. We have come up with an idea to move the front door and the solution would be better if we could use a high quality, watherproof sliding door rather than a standard hinged door.
So, what is the best choice for sliding doors? We do not envision an all-glass door, but one that really can be a front door with a small window and otherwise solid.