I intend to have a 22’4″x22’4″, 15′ high second “garage” built on a slab with stick framing, stucco, gable roof with composition shingle, no interior finishing past exposed studs with an 8’x6 door (type suggestions invited) and standard entry door. This structure will also have a joist network sufficient to accomodate a storage loft I can make later. The building be for some lapidary-type equipment (with some specialty tools) and a very large fossil collection. Does anyone have any basic total or segment prices I should be looking at? Tips for negotiating or finding contractors? General advice on features I should think of incorporating now or will find worth considering now as opposed to having to retrofit with remorse later? Books, articles or sites that might be informative?
Obvously, I’ve done some thinking here but hearing some of it seconded won’t hurt and having any of it surpassed by better ideas and tested by qreat questions is just what I’d like. Please have my advance thanks for all suggestions and inquiries. Many heads are better than one. I appreciate any help.
Ed
Replies
General advice on features I should think of incorporating now or will find worth considering now as opposed to having to retrofit with remorse later?
I've been living in SoCal for several years. One thing which seems inevitable to me is photo-voltaic panels on every available roof surface. Imagine an electric car in the garage, being charged by your own solar energy farm on the roof.
As gas prices rise and photo-voltaics become more efficient and affordable, the change to electric power for local driving seems very likely. Therefor I would build the garage roof with 12/12 (45 degree) roof trusses, south facing of course. That's the most efficient roof angle for collecting solar energy. It will allow for the largest surface area too.
Now that is an excellent example of an idea of merit that didn't initiate on my side. Coincidentally, I happened to view a long photovoltaic power documentary last nite. The predicament I would initially see is that the optimal panel tilt required forces extreme limitations on usable loft space. But that doesn't mean more thinking isn't spurred by your contribution for which I kindly thank you.
Regards,
Ed
15' high isn't going to get you very much storage space. You might - MIGHT - have 4' of vertical room at the peak of your space. Not very usable for anything besides a few small boxes - less if you intend on storing polished boulders up there :)
I presume you are trying to match the current pitch of your existing house, 1:4 slope is the most common out here on most ranches. I'd advise starting with higher walls initially - say 10' tall instead of the common 8'. This gives you more room where the joists meet the wall under the rafters, enabling you to have usable space there.
Have a sheet of ridgid foam put on under the sheathing, it will help to keep out the worst of the heat.
Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
Oh, good Lord, no. But I can give him two dollars and an assault rifle.
Paul:
To illuminate my ignorance, any more particulars on the foam?
Thank you for the other observations as well. I'm W of you and the code here requires that buildings be a maximum of 15' high at one storey without the owner being willing to wait for a planning commission process that could take 4 months and will definitely consume an extra 1.6K just for the attempt at asking for an accomodation. The same rules demand the roofed area be under 500 square'. No matter what you say, the code people are afraid of another illegal rental.
My intent was to maximize wall stud height for spatial considerations and I agree that 10' sounds good. As for the big specimens, most of the rough stuff will take the weather either straight or if tarped. If things get too small, too delicate or too valuable, then they get brought inside. I do have some large trees and dino footprints left outside that would give two godzillas hernias....which would be a just reward for anyone designing to "borrow" them.
Thanks again.
Ed
Two ideas about keeping heat out:
1. Foam and insulation sandwitch: Start with the bare rafters. Cover the underside with 1" foil faced polyurathane. In the rafter bays, lay down insulation (fiberglass or recycled denim) so you leave an inch or so of the top of the rafters exposed. Put down a layer of Tyvec (roll the bottom edge, not the ridge first) and install their plastic spacers which should push the Tyvek down to where the top of the insulation layer is. On the top of the rafters, place a 1" foil faced polyurathane layer, then put the 7/16" sheathing on top of that. Fasten the sheathing with 3" screws to get deep enough into the rafter.
2. Solar heat you water: We visited some people out in Redlands, they had a converted horse shed and a pool out back. The shed was the "Man Space", TV, beer fridge, stereo, pool table... all of which I though nice except for the heat that would soon be coming that afternoon. The walls and ceiling were not insulated at all. But that afternoon the room wasn't a blazing oven (it was 100 that day), and I finally figured out why. The entire roof was covered by a water tubing black mat that was used to heat the pool water. All of the heat I was expecting was being shunted into the pool. I had never thought of this before, but "solar water heating" can also be called "liquid roof cooling".Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
Oh, good Lord, no. But I can give him two dollars and an assault rifle.
Paul,
I appreciate the effort in your follow-up. I've copied your notions about insulation against Old Sol and will be showing it to a contractor arriving for a talk today.
Another idea I'm prospecting on is some sort of passive solar illumination a la skylights or lightpipes. The concept of passive ventilation or flow-through ventilation is also inviting. "Solar chimney" is an interesting idea that came up awhile ago in my reading on cooling greenhouse structures. I'll revisit that and see if there are any applications to my present project given the limited time left to plan it.
Reading your tag lines, it is interesting to note that "fanatic" traces to "fane"=church and implies zealotry about something/body. No one can say passion isn't good. In fact, "fanatico" is the Spanish word for "fan"."Profane"= in front of the church , literally means something that would be particular blasphemy if said there. I thought you'd be amused. Thanks again.
Ed
Thanks! Long ago on a different forum I would warn people against getting "into" the Honda CRX like I was. I recommended heroin instead. The reason is that you family and friends will understand an addiction to heroin, but no one will understand the hook from a 20 y.o. grocery getter that had between 60 and 109 HP. That's just nuts.
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Please, someone call an intervention!Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
Oh, good Lord, no. But I can give him two dollars and an assault rifle.
Ed,
First, I have to admit that I had to look up lapidary, but I am still not sure what the equipment looks like or how that impacts use.
As ap point of reference, I am in the process of drawing some plans for a barn for a small sports car collection (lotus/healey). In my city (thousand oaks, Ca) I am limited to 600 sqft max. No amount of pleading, waivers or planning variances will make it any larger, so I have to live within the defined square footage, but there are a few ways to expand the space, which seem to get around the restrictions.
What you are designing is essentially a plain square box, just a little bit larger than a two car carage. Are you sure that is what you want? Have you considered an "L" shaped structure with a small clean room. The design I am leaning toward is an "L". In the corner of the "L" a large porch I will create a ranch like overhang to allow me to pull the small cars out for washing. If the permits are pulled independently, the porch space does not factor into the footprint. Neither does the addition of a small (under 100sqft) shed lean-to. This buys you a space for garden equipment and chemicals. Of course you would build it all at once. If the building is narrower, you can use taller walls to gain a little interior height and still comply with the 15 ft limit.
Just some ideas to consider.
Dean
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From:
EdwardAmmon <!----><!---->
11:36 pm
To:
HealeyBN7 <!----><!---->unread
Dean:
I know your area. There's a spot I've been working near Calabasas for awhile.
Easy work and lots of it with a rare nice thing every few weekends.
The square building will work well for my lot and I plan to push it back to the
perimeter to allow someone else the idea of enlarging the house and me the
possibility of putting a buffering greenhouse in. Unless you have a...problem...
neighbor you develop your place without all sorts of gov interference. In my
town, a non-commercial greenhouse under 400 square doesn't even require
a permit or an inspection. Though I would keep a greenhouse just that,
someone else may find it good for other purposes. It is something you might
consider and a topic on which I've done considerable research and had more
than one experience. A lot of that construction can be handled by an average
handy guy without eating up blocks of time. I've done wood and would never do
it again. 1 3/8" top rail chain link tubing can be adapted to make a pretty firm
structure with the right reinforcement and can be covered either with poly film or
--more esthetically--with fiberglass or polycarbonate panels. You can even add
grommeted shade cloth panels by themselves or in conjunction with another
sheathing to get interesting effects. If, in going so far off track from my original
posting, I've hit on something that might work for you, try gardenweb forums on
greenhouses or post back.
Thanks for your thoughts.
Ed
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