How many donate time to HFH? Reasons why you do or don’t? I have found it very rewarding for several reasons as well as beneficial to my business They are appreciative of my help & I enjoy the chance to teach others new skills. Doing work I enjoy without having to worry about profits, liability etc. is refreshing also
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I worked with HFH a little when I was in Illinois. I was one of the semi-skilled hordes, though.
Since moving to Oakland, I've worked almost every year with Rebuilding Together (AKA Christmas In April/Sukkoth in April), which focuses on rehabbing existing houses rather than building new ones. It's fun and rewarding. My skills and experience are sufficient to put me supervising small groups, and the projects are small enough that I can see results right away.
Rebeccah
Edited 12/30/2007 2:04 pm by Rebeccah
I did a steady gig with them for several years.
Only on occasion now though.
Restore does get everything I can donate however.
I called the local chapter a few years ago to volunteer. I told them what I do. They said no thanks we don't need you.
WTF?
Just show up at the work site, I'm sure they'll find something for you to do. Never seen then turn anybody away.
I know all chapters are not alike, the one that I worked out of defiantly had some problems, the guy in charge didn't care if the new HO's were actually involved in the build, usually he would just send them off to someone else's already finished house to work on landscaping or something, I brought that up several times and it didn't set well with the guy - I'm not one to give a shid what people think though. Hes no longer there and for the reasons that I mentioned, I think it became obvious to everybody else. He wanted to get all the house built for the year because then all he had to do was sit on his azz the rest of the year and wait until next years build. I believe the guy was a salaried man.
I've heard good and bad about local chapters, just like every other org, gonna be problems and gonna be well run machines.
Doug
I did it for several years before moving to TX, since returning it doesn't fit my schedule but like dovetail, the Restore gets all my donations of recyclable material. Good source for good used material as well.
There has been some good and bad comments made on here about HFH. Some of the complaints regarding HFH are by people that I suspect are borderline control freaks, you know, my way or its the wrong way type people, these guys will not work well with HFH because you have to be able to give and take, not always going to go the way you want. Sometimes you have to be a second team player and that don't set to well with them, they gotta be in charge because they are every other day of the weak.
HFH isn't for everybody, I liked it because I was able to work with people that needed to be taught something about their house, the inner workings of the place............ a little education can be very valuable, especially to a new HO, and especially if your a single parent, usually female.
I don't think that I ever got any business from doing HFH work but that was never my goal, I did get the feeling of doing something for someone that needed the help, that was my goal - sometimes it was difficult to see but hopefully it was there.
Doug
I did some work with them. Every time it I was put in a position where I was working with someone else who was less skilled. No problem. But the leader on the site would put us on difficult stuff others couldn't do. Like installing fascia on gable rakes. And they would have JUST enough material. So No wrong cuts.
But they didn't put me in charge of the other person so I would just work along side of them. 9 out of 10 times when it came time to put the angle and length on the board and cut it the person would get excited and take over. Whip out their new speed square and start trying to figure it out. Invariably they would get it wrong and they would desperately try to figure out where the board could be used elsewhere.
I find that work unsatisfying to say the least. If you're going to form teams, put somebody in charge. I don't want to have to do it.
As a member of the team I felt responsible for the bad work but I felt my hands were tied.
Pop
I had to go back and re-read my post, it comes off as though I'm saying that everybody that had a bad experience did so because they were control freaks and couldn't have their way. Sorry if that's the way you, or anybody else, took the statement.
I'm not going to mention any names but there are some guys on here that although I respect the hell out of their knowledge and skill I wouldn't work for them. I feel they are the type that believe that their way is the only way and everybody else is doing it wrong. Those guys are in no way wrong/bad they just don't make a good fit for the type of workers that HFH needs.
If you go back and read Marv's post on how his local chapter runs I believe that's the way it should go. Sounds like he belongs to a well run program, unfortunately they all don't go that well.
My experience with HFH was partially good partially bad, I came from a town of about 125K and we built about 5-7 houses a year depending on resources.
The construction manager that I assume was a salaried employee of HFH didn't seam to care whether or not the new HO's got any experience in the build, I was a strong opponent/vocal opponent of his on that front, didn't set well with me and maybe that's why I quit volunteering.
I think you will find a lot of people that have had bad experiences with HFH for the reasons that you and I have expressed, some are just poorly run and if there isn't any real construction pros around then things don't run smoothly.
Seams the common denominator in this is frustration. Doesn't seam to be any real leaders and then when one does emerge they're not recognized as such and the talent is wasted because of ego, ignorance or whatever.
Doug
I'm not offended in the least. I need to bone up on the speed square so I can use it better and school them when they ask.
They have finished the one house I worked on. when I go back I'm going to establish a chain of Command myself right off the bat. I think people need that in order to know where they are. Chain of Command works. Some of the people won't like it. fine. those are the ones I don't want to work with anyway.
I am a Christian. But there are different kinds. I believe in a chain of command. So if I'm working with someone at Habitat and they don't believe in a chain of command I just don't want to dance around with this issue. So many people have fundamental issues with this. It causes real chaos in a lot of areas.
Ah, yes, the Catholic/Baptist thing. ;)One thing to note is that local Habitat chapters are given quite a bit of autonomy, so experiences that apply to one chapter may not apply to another in the next town.Also, some chapters operate a "ministery of repair" or something like that, where repairs are made to existing homes of low-income/elderly folks. This may be more the cup of tea for many here.
If your view never changes you're following the wrong leader
Another variable are the homeowners. I've had homeowners me to show them how to hang a door, trim a door, shingle, frame a wall, install a window, hang cabinets, etc. If they are interested in learning, I'm willing to show them. Its very rewarding.
I've also seen homeowners who bring family members who sit the the car (and expect hours). Show up on 11:00, work for 1/2 hour, have lunch and then leave and expect 1 and 1/2 hours for each family member who came. I've even been called a racist when they didn't like what I asked them to do. It takes all kinds.
One of the homeowners working last summer was eager to learn, showed up early and stayed late, made us lunch twice and brought her boss and co-workers one day. She is what Habitat is all about. You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
I've also seen homeowners who bring family members who sit the the car (and expect hours). Show up on 11:00, work for 1/2 hour, have lunch and then leave and expect 1 and 1/2 hours for each family member who came.
I remember the time we were sitting around eating dinner and the HO to be made the comment, "I should be home doing laundry" I thought to myself, well maybe you should but what about the 35 other people that are taking away from their families duties to build you a house! She just didn't get it.
I saw the hour thing used and abused but I also saw one HO that had some real skills, he probably put in 2000 hours towards his house and for the next three years was there all summer to help out on others homes. I remember the day the framing crew(bunch of young Dieselpig type guys)showed up, they were sheeting the roof by lunch and while 3 of them finished up inside one stayed up on the roof and had the shingles laid before they left that day. They Wouldn't stop for a photo op for the local newspaper. Great bunch of guys.
It all averages out.
Doug
I spend ten years at the local county fair, voulenteer and after the hurricane I was handing out supply with the national guard. After so many work parties where nothing get done, and the typical pizza fest. also giving out supply to people that dont need it and get chewed out. i wont never voulnteer again to help anybody. They all want something for free and are ungrateful.I say when it comes to this type freeable 40% is fraud
Dunno. I've been helping in Rushford where people got flooded out. They need the help and are grateful for it. I've been down to Biloxi (and will go again in Feb). They need the help and are grateful for it. I did, many, many years ago, do some work for Red Cross where it seemed like they just liked to order people around, but that's about the only situation like that.Have been in a number of situations where a group was disorganized and rudderless, but these have as often been groups at work as volunteer groups. A certain % of managers are incompetent in all fields.In a volunteer situation you will generally spend more time sitting on your hands, but if you know that going in it's not so bad. And if you take some initiative you can usually cut down on the hand sitting time considerably. (Eg, I'll go out and buy minor supplies/tools that are needed rather than waiting for them to appear. And even without that I can usually find SOMETHING that needs doing, even if it's only cleaning up the site, salvaging lumber, etc.)
If your view never changes you're following the wrong leader
About 4 years back Rochester MN HfH had one HO who intentionally sold her house about a month before the 10 year time limit was up. She was "moving up" and was so thankful to HfH that she wanted the money to come back to them rather than having it herself. She gave up something like $20K in equity to HfH.
Certainly not all HOs are deadbeats.
If your view never changes you're following the wrong leader
I was one who wrote about HFH on here before--my experiences with it have been mostly negative and I doubt if I'd ever do it again. I wasn't the control freak, the guys heading up the builds I worked on were though. Not pleasant to work for. On the last job, the guy got short with me as soon as I walked up because I was there too early! I told him I was told to report at the time I was there and he said, "Oh, you must be new." Then I couldn't do anything to his high standards. After putting the same four rows of siding up four times, I left. Nails were too angled, nails were too deep, then not deep enough, then the siding wasn't level (but matched the rest of the wall, so when I pulled it off and leveled it, he didn't like that it didn't match the rest that was put up earlier), etc. If I pleased him, there was another guy walking around and he didn't like what I'd done. The siding already put up when I got there was rippled because they nailed it over fanfold over studs--no sheathing.
Also, on that and other HFH jobs, we'd run out of materials and no one would want to get more, so on one job I was there to finish drywall and when I ran out of mud after an hour, no one wanted to go get more, so that was that. On another job they asked me to help install a vent hood over a stove and when I arrived at 9 on Saturday, there was no hood on site. After many calls to all sorts of HFH people and finally several calls to Lowes, the truck with the hood on it delivered it somewhere around noon.
I deal with HFH alot... I'm the one they call when they have truckloads of something donated and can't use it or don't have a place for it... like 90k worth of 8ft french doors...
They have corrected alot of this but... very few of the people who got these homes around here were able to keep them more than a few years... with instant equity and people willing to lend them money on that equity... that and putting the house up for someones bond... anyway many were being lost.... I think they now put a second on the home and hold it 10yrs at which point it is forgiven...
here i think they built less than 20 homes last year... with a full time office staff of over 20 people... I have to assume each house costs 2x what it should....
great people on a great mission... but most of them are just fund raisers...
p
[Quote:]here i think they built less than 20 homes last year... with a full time office staff of over 20 people... I have to assume each house costs 2x what it should....great people on a great mission... but most of them are just fund raisers.. [end quote]Exactly! Some chapters spend an enormous amount of time, energy and money just to exist; the home owner and the build then become secondary.Carl
I try not to be down on too many people that raise money to help others...
Just as crafts people run into all the time... "well thats more than i make" when you fix their sink...
it costs alot of money to raise money.... and they never know how much it will cost... one large donation can make the numbers look ver respectable... where if they have to spend a ton of time beg'n for every dime... it often costs more than they get...
in the end someone should get something... help... that they otherwise would not have received... yes often whats given costs... a ton to give away...
p
it costs alot of money to raise money.... and they never know how much it will cost...
Here's why we need to raise money all the time. We build 5 houses a year and they cost about 50k. We then collect the payments from the new houses and old and figure out how to build 5 more next year. The fact is, we need to raise 200k each year to build the new houses. If you've ever tried to raise money you know this can be a difficult task year after year.
Oh...did I mention.... I have super bowl sweepsteaks tickets avaiable at $30 each. trip for four to Super Bowl, airfare and hotel included. [email protected]You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
I have also donated time to build houses for the last 5 years. I have learned a lot and taught a lot. Last year I was co-manager of a house. You get all kinds of people who show up to work. You must coordinate the skilled people and teach the unskilled. Its not an easy job but someone has to do it for the effort to succeed.
One thing I value the most about my experience is the great people who I work with. We have about 50 "Week Day Wonders". Guys who show up on Tuesdays and Thursdays to build houses. Nobody complains or criticizes, they just build for the fun of it. the comaradary is the best.You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
with instant equity and people willing to lend them money on that equity
I'm treasurer with our local HFH. When a homeowner buys a house here, we put on an additional mortgage that strips the equity. After they have lived in the house for five years, part of this 2nd mortgage is forgiven each year. After 10 years, the 2nd mortgage is all gone.
with a full time office staff of over 20 people
We have one paid person acting as excecutive director and one paid person as restore manager. We built 5 homes last year. That brings our total to 70 and 90% of the original owners still live in their homes.
I have to assume each house costs 2x what it should....
We build a house for around 50k and sell it for the same amount.You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
I think it's a great organization. I like the fact that the HOs have to work on the house and pay for whatever isn't donated.
As others have said, not every experience with a non profit organization is going to be a good one. Even good people and good organizations have bad days. Good organizations sometimes get bad volunteers.
All in all, I think it's the best organization out there that gets poor people into houses.
I've been a Saturday crew leader with the Orange County H4H chapter for 7 years now. Our chapter has completed 122 homes in the past 11 years or so.
It is great to participate in a cause that gives people a hand up - not a handout - to get out of the cycle of poverty. No deadbeats, no welfare cheaters, no profiteers need apply. Families must have a low but steady income, good credit, willingness to devote 500 hours of their time (sweat equity), and carry an interest-free mortgage for the materials cost of the house. They may not sell the house on the open market; only to Habitat for the amount of their equity.
Any of you guys in my area who would like to give of your time and skills for the benefit of disabled veterans and families of those who died in combat, we'd love to hear from you. We have plans to build 27 houses in San Juan Capistrano (near USMC Camp Pendleton), of which 14 will be reserved for disabled veterans.
On Saturdays we need skilled people to guide unskilled day volunteers. Tue-Fri we need people to do work themselves.
Haven't done it recently because life got in the way, but used to volunteer with Habitat quite a bit. Some bad experiences, but mostly good. And just about anyone here is better-qualified than their average volunteer, so there's no need to feel not up to the job.
I used to volunteer in a smaller city - just showed up on a Saturday and went where needed. Got to work side-by-side with the homeowners and other great people. Really enjoyed it.
Later moved to another state and larger city. Chaperoned 4-5 high school students who wanted to help out once, and it was a totally different experience. Lots of church and school groups without quite enough skilled people with them, no mixing of people, no working with homeowners, no prayer to start the day or lunch, etc.
Decided if I ever do HFH again, it will be solo or with a couple friends and not as a group. It's too easy for groups to focus more on the event than who is being served.
I've been involved with a group called Servants With A Tool ("the SWAT Team"). It is more of a family event that I can do with my kids (they pick up leaves and sticks or other tasks safely away from power tools, etc.), and serves Bible camps, shelters, etc. rather than homeowners (HFH does a good job, so no need to duplicate their efforts). Events tend to last a weekend and occur about half a dozen times a year.
My family moved, and we are trying to get a chapter started in Ohio. The group started in North Carolina, and a Texas chapter is also in the works.
With our spreading out and a few other key members moving, we could really use some more volunteers, particularly those who are skilled and can show others how to do things - hang siding, nail trusses, etc. We have a lot of great people who like to work, and with a few pointers from a few knowledgable people a great deal of work gets done.
If anyone is in Ohio, North Carolina or Texas and interested, let me know or visit http://www.ServantsWithATool.org.
BTW - I'm not looking to steal volunteers from HFH or any other groups. Just want to mention this as a different option to fit different schedules and desires.
our church sponsored one a year for five years.pretty much just members of the church worked on the house. we'd start sept10 and try and have the family in for thanksgiving.
i had a great time working on these,made some good friends,learned some stuff and learned some things not to do.i do think it's hard to walk on one day and get a feel for whats going on and getting much accomplished. we had a core of about 7 guys that were there almost every day and knew what was about to happen next,thats a great asset.
lots of things went wrong but they sure are fun to laugh at now,vinly windows put in upside down,no tape on the joints in the basement,etc....
makes me want to go do another one ,larry
if a man speaks in the forest,and there's not a woman to hear him,is he still wrong?
Just briefly let me say that although I have given hundreds and possibly even thousands of hours to our local HFH, I got tired of their disorganization, incompetence and inefficacy. Locally, with an office staff of around 20 or more, a few construction superintendents, and a half dozen or so other field employees they currently have probably a half dozen homes under construction. That is roughly the same volume I handle by myself. It's a good cause but tends to be poorly executed. I would rate their end product as reasonably well built homes with terrible finish work. I think it is a good place for novices to pitch in but it can be a frustrating experience for building professionals who like to make efficient use of their time. I will also say that in times past I found it to be a rewarding experience and it taught me the value of giving.
I've been interested in helping out for a while. When I was in NY, I saw a newsletter from the local chapter that ripped landlords something fierce. I sent him an e-mail and asked why. I was not nasty at all, just wanted to open dialogue. He ignored me totally. I figured it wouldn't be a good match.
Came down to VA and tried to hook up with one chapter down here. Went to a groundbreaking and got offered the shot at GC on the house when they found out I have some experience. Politely declined b/c I don't have the contacts down here yet. Told them I'd be happy to work with them - haven't heard anything in probably 2 months since. They did say there were some problems with the family and finances. It may have been postponed.
Got an e-mail out to another chapter this weekend. Little closer to me, but still 30 minutes away. Waiting to see what happens with them.
I guess it's fair to say that the particular chapter means a lot.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
I tried to help out with HFH chapter here where I live. When I told them what I can do they were pretty glad to have me come on board.
After several phone calls and showing up a couple times, only to be told I was to skilled to help out. I pretty much gave up.
Found out the guy in charge of assigning work was the guy I followed on three jobs to rework some of his mistakes.
Nailer
i have tried on several occasions and all they want is my money. I gave up.
"The nearest thing to eternal life we will ever see on this earth is a governmental program" -Ronald Reagan
I've framed and roofed 8 HFH homes. My experiences have been a mix of bad and good.
I've seen all the anchor bolts cut off because they all landed in a stud. I don't know if the frame was ever connected to the slab. It wasn't as long as I was there.
I've seen so many wrong layout marks on the top plates that we had to use spacers to set the trusses. Somebody read a framing book the night before and thought they'd lay out the trusses while the pros ate lunch.
I've had my thumb mangled by a guy with a brand new waffle head Estwing who thought I was holding a nail for him to drive. I threw his hammer over the fence and told him I'd kill him if I saw him again.
I've stepped on an interior wall that wasn't tied in when carrying a truss. It got real heavy, real fast for the two guys on the outside.
I've seen a whole bunch of people show up 15 mins before the pizza got there and leave 15 mins after it was gone.
I've seen a bunch of people that couldn't grab their butts with both hands and a sprinkling of pros frame and roof a house in a day. Not done very well, but fast.
I've never seen a homeowner do much but get in the way. Most of the volunteers, while incompetant, were not newbies. The homeowners were usually at their first rodeo. They wanted to help, but couldn't figure out what was going on and were awe struck about the whole process.
I've seen mucho macho ego clashes, usually within the church groups.
I've gone home every time with a great feeling of accomplishment (deserved or not).
I've gone home every time with some new friends.
I highly recommend that every pro participate at least one day at a HFH project. That'll keep the house wives in the kitchen and the "can I borrow your hammer" accountants in the office.
http://grantlogan.net/
That'll keep the ...accountants in the office
Now I'm really offended! ;)You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
Just kidding...I've seen your work and it would be an honor to work next to you.You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
My son is an accountant. I've got two engineering degrees. I used to be a desk jockey for a while and as I get older and my business changes, I spend more and more time at a desk. I didn't mean to disparage office workers of any sort. My gripe is the volunteers that show up and want to borrow your tools. I had a guy borrow my hammer (I thought it was an emergency since I was on a roof using it and he asked me from the ground) and he walked to the other side of the house and sat it down. I had to climb down and find it. Then he asked me again about 15 mins later.http://grantlogan.net/
My mother once said to me, "Elwood" -- she always called me Elwood -- "Elwood, in this world you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant." For years I tried smart. I recommend pleasant.
Elwood P. Dowde (James Stewart), "Harvey"
The experience varies greatly depending on who is running the show and how organized they are, but in general I like HfH.
Just don't have time for it right now with my own project.
jt8
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it." --Upton Sinclair
We spend most of our regular work building second homes, most of them for very nice folk, but Habitat is a chance to build a home for someone who really needs it. There is a great sense of satisfaction for doing this. It is a great change of pace.
I've done it for several years. The company I work for has built one house a year for the last five years and our church has done four. It was so much fun that I started volunteering as one of their supervisors. Each location does it a bit differently. Nashville is a pretty well-run organization.
It was so much fun that I started volunteering as one of their supervisors.
Do you wear the hockey mask when you do the HFH thing?http://grantlogan.net/
My mother once said to me, "Elwood" -- she always called me Elwood -- "Elwood, in this world you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant." For years I tried smart. I recommend pleasant.
Elwood P. Dowde (James Stewart), "Harvey"
LOL. Naah. That's just for when I forget to take my pills. ;)