Just a quickie, and some may hate this shallow post, but not sure where else to turn. I’m finishing my project (yeah, after 2 1/2 years) up, and of course one of the keys is the railing system; the guardrail and then rail going down the stairs. Probably about 25 linear feet, half as guard and half as rail down the stairs. I had some framing fabricated and installed, and then I installed the cable rail system.
So to make it finished and up to code, I want to cap the entire system off with some red oak. The bottom of the handrail will be routed to fit snuggly over the framing I have on top of the rail system. There aren’t too many stair guys on the Peninsula here in the Bay Area, CA, but hooked up with one at the recommendation of my door supplier. The guy seems really competent, not that this job is that tough compared to I’m sure the other stuff he described in process at the moment.
He was suppose to call me back with a “number,” but hadn’t heard back from him so I called him back. Anyway, he comes back with a material and installation number at $1400. Does that seem “about right?” Granted, everything in this area is friggin’ expensive, and I’m not going to try and beat the guy up, but man, that seems like a lot to me. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.
Replies
If I understand your post correctly, $1400.00 just to cap off a stair wall. I'm assuming you framed a short wall and want to cap off with 25 -0 red oak.Material is less than $200.00,one day for installation at the most. Red oak costs me $4.20 bf for 8/4 stock, machineing ,sanding and finish 5 hours. Mighty expensive rail capping in my opinion.
mike
wiley.... could be a great price.... or it may be a not so great price.. why don't you post a picture of your project ?
I spent a week on one kind of like that for $3700.
I did another one that could be similar too for a neighbor friend fabricating from exotic SA cedar in a day for free - no finish on it. Could have been a five hundred dollar job
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
my stock answer will be ...
in the grand scheme of things ...
in the grand scheme of the cost of the house ...
how does $1,400 fit?
As a home owner myself ... and living in a much cheaper part of the world ...
$1,400 doesn't seem like an awful lot to finish my house?
Guy's gotta come and measure ... maybe template ... go somewhere and construct it .... with materials ... then come and install ...
Nothing simple is ever easy ....
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry in Carpentry
Pgh, PA
As Mike suggested, here's a couple/few pics of the rail I'm trying to cap. Piffin, is this the same situation?
Jeff, point taken, but any money I might save are some laborers for some "smoothing" of landscaping, some landscaping in general, some fencing, some, some, some, and a host of "little" things (that may not prevent my final inspection, but still things I have to get done, eventually) that all add up in "the grand scheme of the cost of the house."
Thanks again for the help gents.
so.. looks like
rail... corner... corner... down easment.... rail.... end piece
.. i forget what you want to make it out of.. but suppose we make it comply to IRC 2000 profile... plow the bottom.. fasten with screws from the bottom
materials ... milling... assembly & fitting... installation..
sounds reasonable... or .. do it yourself, might be funMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Materials and labor? 1400 bucks, I'd charge you $72 more...I'd say you've still got a willies to spend on labor. And by the way, congratulations on a long time comin';-) Don't worry, we can fix that later!
Are all the fittings cut with a wormie for that price?
Doode, I have a beaver I'm very close to<G> Don't worry, we can fix that later!
Hanging at the bottom of your stairs (rail2.jpg), that' s the biggest damn banana I've ever seen! No wonder everything's so expensive in the Bay Area... serving portions are to the extreme.
flashy.. bananna huh ?...
i thought it was a shoe tree ..
View Image
does the cable close the space between the two newels ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
In the bay area of CA, I'd say $1400 is a bargain. Think about what he's gonna have to do. Measuring, cutting, fitting, staining, sealing. He may have to spend two or three days on the sealing part. Plus he may have to take time to just procure the material, and he has to make money on that as well.
The sealing is what's getting you. See if he'll just cut and fit the pieces. Then you can stain, seal, and install yourself.
Wiley,
I did a job like yours but many more feet for a guy who sold his company to ALCOA and was building his dream house. The Car was made out of some exotic wood, I forget what. The Stair shop made the rail. I just installed.
Red oak Rail? Maybe $6 a foot? So thats around $180 by the time you account for waste. Add in screws and assorted stuff. A day to pick it up, drive it to the shop, Mill it and drive it to your job. A day to install it.
So, your at around $200 for material and around $800 for labor. And, thats eastern P.A., not California.
Sounds good to me.
In my area, stair rails of any kind are a specialty and you buy the whole day no matter what portion of it you use.
>> I had some framing fabricated and installed <<
How much did that cost ya?
Wiley,
I do custom cabinetry and millwork down in the LA area (beach cities) and after seeing the pictures, I can see that $1,400.00 is about right. I wouldn't go any higher though.
Jim
why is it that the last guy is always suspect of overcharging you?
did you question anybody else during your 2 &1/2 years?
why aren't you doing it yourself?
I'm thinking it might be a little bit low if he has to sain and finish, possibly on the high side but you are in an expensive part of the country - overall, about right range.
I do see a finicky problem with "fitting" where the posts are wider than the top rail of your metal system. I would plow to fit the raail and custom fit with router on the job to the posts. That will take time on that shorter piece especially. heck, I might even have to do a 'practice piece'
;)
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
All right! Thanks, I guess I can rest somewhat assured that “we” (my sub and I) are in the same ballpark.
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Matt, Robert and MalibuJim, I will be doing the staining and sealing; I already asked about that, it's not included. In fact, I’m a little anal when it comes to stuff like that, so I’d prefer to do that myself anyway. Same with painting; I can’t afford, or don’t want to pay, what I expect in finish painting—some prep work I will hire some guys that have been helping me on and off for side work.
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One thing I did forget to mention, and I asked if this was included, which it is, was the little handrail down at the bottom of the stairs above two steps that, by code, have to have a handrail too—I will put that on the wall and didn’t want to “turn” the cable rail system again.
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Dirishinme, good question: the framing (which was “painted,” but that I reprepped and repainted) itself cost $1400, installed. For about $750 I bought the cable and parts and installed myself. For stainless steel, with the cable rail installed, that was going to run like $8000 from someone else. And I would still need a wood cap.
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Flashy and Mike, there is a not-so-long-story about the surfboard, dudes, if you really want to read it. And no Mike, there is no cabling between the newels; it doesn’t look as wide as it kinda does in the picture, and there shouldn’t be any code issue. I like it the way it is as I think it would have looked too busy with the additional cable and fittings, plus the cable not lining up with angle and horizontal runs.
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Piffin, good eye; first, see above about the staining and sealing. Yeah, the fabricating wasn’t done exactly to my spec’s…that top rail should have been thicker and wider to the width of the square tubing. And yes, I discussed with the wood rail guy about routing out to conceal the top metal rail part. But what I was thinking, and let me know what you think, was have him route out the width of the square tubing width, that way the rail will come down the side of the square tubing like maybe 3/16th’s and not get hung up on the weld between that top metal rail and the square tubing?
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Phiant, it’s not that I’m questioning the “last” guy, and yes, on my other rough stuff, from grading to HVAC, I did a little “shopping” like I think anybody else would do. It’s just that I’ve done pretty much ALL the finishwork from hanging cabs, finish electrical and plumbing, to casing all my windows and doors, to finish painting, to some of the tiling. So yeah, this is “probably” something I could conceivably do, but think the learning curve is such, it’s a specialty, and it is close to the end of the road, that I don’t want to do it myself. This guy came recommend like I outlined earlier, and I just want to know if the guy is in the ballpark.
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billy, it’s gettin’ there, but looks like I will be doing another one next door for my sister; rest assured (I hope) though that I won’t be asking the same question twice here on Breaktime. ;-)
<!---->Anyway, thanks again for the help from all…I will post some after pics in a few weeks if I can get the staining and sealing done reasonably soon.
Edited 1/30/2005 5:35 pm ET by Wiley
the price sounds just a bit high to me (and I'm used to Metro D.C. prices), but if they do a perfect job (good fit, good stock) then what the hey.......
Just an update on my rail post. The stair guy installed the rail yesterday and I think it looks pretty dang good; these guys do some pretty high-end stuff in the area. He also went over why my stairs are not so cool (he did remark that the trim in the house was very nice though--oh, I did that!); I was reasonably happy with what my floor guy did with the stairs given what I got for the price, but he did have some points. He's going to outfit me with some cove to finish off the stairs a little better.
Anyway, my original post was about the cost of the rail; $1400. What I come to find out is that this group built the handrail out of four pieces to make my more contemporary look which we agreed would be better than something else. They also routed out underneath to fit over the metal top framing, and then provided me with some 1 1/4 X 1/4 oak strips to glue underneath the rail to completely "enclose" the metal framing top.
The only drag is that I have to now stain and finish the dang thing. I wanna get this done pretty quick as oils from people's hands and what not probably will not serve the wood well.
looks pretty elegant to me ..Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore