i will be installing prefinished 3/4” maple t&g in an open concept house i would like to run it parallel with the floor joists in the great room will this cause stability problems or should it always run across them
also wood construction adhesive be a good addition in either application
thanks for any and all suggestions
andrew – (artistryinwood)
Replies
As ageneral rule you always run the floor PERPENDICULAR to the joists as they can sag and cause 'waves' if run the other way. That said, if you up the thickness of the current 3/4" subfloor to 1 1/4", you could safely run it the other way, but this causes lots of prob's with floor heights elsewhere. If yours is an open concept, you may be fine.
NO, NO, NO don't use any adhesive with your nails/cleats. It's way more problems than it's worth, not only for install but finishing as well. Use 2" cleats nailing approx every 10-12" and your O.K.. I do every 8" so I stay consistant with one ON the joist and the next one IN-BETWEEN.
Check out N.F.M.A. website or Bruce flooring or Tarkett or even HD's 1-2-3 books on flooring. (I help with writing them)
Why do you say not to use adhesive under the flooring? We would not normally use adhesive but on our present job we have radiant tubing which is directly in contact with the subfloor. In a few places we will have nothing but the subfloor (3/4) to nail into. We were hoping to use shorter nails and supplement them with adhesive. In the rare occasions where we have used adhesive before we have not had any problem. I look forward to the advice of an more experienced floor layer.
I have seen floors only 5 years old that start to 'wave' cuz they were installed parallel to joists. If you add a layer of underlayment, you are o.k., but they would affect the heat. Check with NFMA as to what they reccomend.
---- and Piffin,
It depends on the spacing of the bearers -- for example, if the sub-floor is 3/4" ply on bearers at 12" centers it's a different situation from 3/4" ply on bearers at 24" centers. The thickness of the flooring itself will also make a difference.
As to gluing with nailing/stapling I fail to see how this can do anything other than strengthen the construction, turning, as it does, ply and flooring into a monolithic structure.
IanDG
I often glue and agree with you on that. I never work over 24" OCF layouts so I hadn't thoughht of that. Never had a probelm over 16" OC
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the subfloor giuve the structural stability you need . OK to run parallell to joists.
glue depends on the situation
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
Oooh boy.....maybe you shoulda started off asking about drywall screws for cabinet installations. <G>
Flooring paralell to joists will be fine with a solid 3/4" (minimum) subfloor. It has been my experience that a more general rule of thumb is to run flooring with the length of the room....regardless of joist direction.
As fer adhesives.....that is generally considered a no-no. Flooring and subfloor materials are going to react at different rates to changes in humidity. You want to allow them to do so independently of one another.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
Okay, lemme add my two cents worth....
If the subfloor is 1x T&G or ¾" plywood, he oughta be okay laying parallel with the joists without beefing it up. If it's OSB, forget it. He'll need to add ½" ply glued-N-screwed on top or, yes, it will wave out in the recent future. OSB has so little structural rigidity it can't even support it's own weight across 24" without sagging within a few weeks.
But you are right about not using glue to install the pre-finished HW. The different elements in that flooring system have to be allowed to work each at their own rate, or they'll spend their lives fighting with each other until they start to pull apart.
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
Good point about the OSB.....I have limited experience with the product. Worked with it a few times....didn`t care for it....and I regularly overlook its existance.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
I wish I could ignore it's existence...but the sh!t's everywhere these days.
What's really scary is looking at a new house in the framing stage. The subfloors are in, of course, walls and roof framing in place or in progress, but it's not blacked in.
And then it rains, of course.
I walked by a site at that stage near here a few days ago, after a good-sized cloudburst, and decided to take a look in just for the heck of it. There was over an inch of standing water sitting on the subfloors and soaking into that OSB. You could already see the stuff sagging between the joists....
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
I recall my first experience with the product...I couldn`t believe it met code.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
The power of Big Bizness, pal. You think code-writers don't get lobbied?
What's even scarier is that not only is it recognized by the code as a structural material (§9.3.2.4, NBCC95), but the code tables specify 3/8" Grade O-2 Beaver Barf over rafters or joists on 24" centers for roofs (Table 9.23.15.6.A).
Hard to believe, and Canadians are usually so conservative, too....
If I gotta use the stuff, I up-grade code minimums by a solid quarter inch, to 5/8 on 24" centers. I'll let my arm be twisted to use ½" on 16" centers if the roof is steeper than 8 in 12. Flatter than that I stick with 5/8". My theory is, when the roof (or floor) starts looking like an oversized washboard, you think the HO is gonna call the code writer and tell him to come fix it...or is he gonna call the poor schnook who built it? Yeah, maybe I might have a 'legal defense' if it meets code...but by the time you need a legal defense you're already in the shi tter and the only ones gonna come out smelling good are the lawyers....
And I tarp every night until it's blacked in; once that sh!t gets wet it's useless. But to be fair, if it's painted with a good water resistant paint, it can hold off water damage better than you'd think. I sheathed a cheap temporary storage shed with it 12 years ago and slapped 3 coats of exterior latex on it and it's still okay if gettin a little furry in spots. ('Okay' being a relative term; remember this is a temporary structure, LOL.)
Don't know why the mfgrs haven't gotten the bright idea to sell it 'shop primed' on at least one face and the edges....
Dinosaur
A day may come when the courage of men fails,when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship...
But it is not this day.
I've used glue under all my wide plank flooring here and face nailed them with rosehead nails. Just be careful which glue you use. There "is" flexability in lots of different glues.
I have zero squeeks and no cracks in the wood. I'd definatly use glue again...especially on wide pine planks.
PS...All the subfloors I installed are Adventech 3/4" T&G 16 oc
I've run them in all different directions in different rooms with no problems anywhere.
Be floored
andy
The secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
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