Replies

1. 
   Carl_Shaw | Mar 06, 2001 03:35pm | #1

   *
   I have never "pickled" but have done a lot of staining. Generally the only stain that does not need to be sealed is a varnish stain. You can kill two birds with one stone this way since it stains and seals in one step. Some people find it to be less satisfactory than staining and sealing in two steps. If this stain was mixed with a water based polyurethane then you may get away with not sealing though I will seal no matter what unless the client says not to. Some people like the rough look of unsealed stain. He is right about the shine. Even a satin finish sealer will leave a shine on the wall. But if that is what you want then do it. If you had no contract with the fellow (verbal or otherwise) lets face it he can give you a bill for whatever he wants. He can also say that the job is done since there was no prior aggrement established to determine what the job would ultimately entail. Your choice? Everything is negotiable. Call him and tell him what you want or he is not getting paid. Period. When he shows up make sure your husband or boy friend answers the door.

1. 
   Ryan_C | Mar 06, 2001 06:22pm | #2

   *There must be more to this story. Did you get a price, even if not a contract? Do you know this guy from somewhere else? Did he spend a week or half a day? Are you asking if the price is reasonable? Don't know, I don't know what he did.Even if you answer these questions, we won't know what to tell you to do but my curiosity is up.Maybe I need to get into painting.

1. 
   mary_tracy | Mar 06, 2001 07:06pm | #3

   *Yes, there's more to the story. But I was trying to keep it short so it would be read. The painter was recommended to me by a builder.He came to see me in January and told me he would paint all the French doors, the door frames, the mouldings, and the six interior doors plus the pickling described for $2200. Upon "completion" of the job, he left me the bill for $2200. I didn't get a contract in writing. I watched as he took notes on what he was going to do, and we went over it in detail. When I spoke to him about the things left to do, he said we had a "miscommunication." I remember exactly our conversation. I was stupid to believe him and stupid not to get a written proposal. How long did he work? Since I wasn't there, I can only estimate between 10 and 12 hours total with a crew of 3 others.My thinking is pay him $35 per hour, times 12, times 4 for a total of $1680. I'd rather pay someone else to finish the job. Any more thoughts?

1. 
   ed_reilly | Mar 06, 2001 09:38pm | #4

   *MaryAs a painter, the price ($2,200) sounds reasonable to me. The issue is the misunderstanding regarding sealing the walls. Did he say he would seal the walls? Did you specifically insist that you wanted them sealed or did you just say you wanted them pickled? Perhaps his idea of pickling walls does not include sealing. If you said you wanted them sealed, then he should be obligated to do so regardless of appearance. Always, always get the details in writing. I wouldn't pay until the work is done to my satisfaction. Keep in mind that if he takes the $1680, you'll be hard pressed to get the rest of the work done for $520 by another painter. I would suggest you negotiate an additional price to seal the walls, explaining the misunderstanding to him, and using the money not paid as leverage. ed

1. 
   Carl_Shaw | Mar 06, 2001 11:41pm | #5

   *So there was a verbal contract. Personally I would jog his memory. If what you say is true and there is no language barrier (does he speak English well?) he also knows what the deal was. For what you described Ed is right, the price is fair but I must admit when it comes to this pickle thing I feel like a idiot. I assumed it is a staining technique. But about half of my work is painting and related work. Not only have I've never pickled, I do not know specifically what the heck it is. I have brushed, rolled, ragged, sponged, sprayed, feathered, wiped, and lord knows what else and have never pickled. I have been in a pickle once or twice in my day but have never had the pleasure of pickling. Or maybe I have and just call it something else. Help.

2. 
   ed_reilly | Mar 07, 2001 01:26am | #6

   *Carl,Go to http://www.antiquerestorers.com, they describe pickling in detail. ed

3. 
   Carl_Shaw | Mar 07, 2001 02:09am | #7

   *Thank you Ed. Neat web site! I feel humble.

4. 
   The_Tennis_Court_Builder_...on_t | Mar 07, 2001 02:16am | #8

   *Job done...Don't ask us what to do!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!You, your conscience...the painter and his conscience need to live with this unwritten mess!Not me...near the stream writing and or trusting!ajGood luck though...I hope ya skiid in three feet of powder today like I did to get back to what life is really about!

2. 
   mary_tracy | Mar 07, 2001 02:18am | #9

   *
   Last week a painter came to my house to pickle my cypress wall with white pickling stain and, I presumed, seal it.

   The surface was completely sanded, ready to go, switchplates removed, no furniture to move, etc., etc.

   The surface area to be finished was three 15x15 areas (8ft. ceilings). Two of the areas have two sets of double French doors as part of the 15x15 (so no stain here) and one area has a double French door, side lights equal to a single door, and a single French door (no stain at these points). There was also a very small hall area with six door openings (minimal surface area here.) For doing this described, the painter left me a bill for $2200!
   I was stunned. I couldn't imagine that he was finished because he applied no sealer and told me sealer with Minwax water based pickling stain is unnecessary and would make the walls awful looking with shine. (The can of stain clearly states that sealer is the finishing process of the pickling.)

   Help!!! I haven't paid the painter (we had no contract). What should I do?