Well, in early December I was laid off from my corporate job. Been giving it a lot of thought and thinking I might not be able to go back to that kind of work. Sitting in a cube all day and dealing with corporate politics.
I’m thinking maybe I should try general handyman stuff. I know in know…this title gets a bad rap but I have restored most of my own home and can do a lot of different things. I can fill in with people I know that would know how to do the bigger things.
How did some of you get started with this sort of thing? Any advice? How do you drum up business, Are you a one man operation? Insurance costs? etc. etc.
Replies
Insurance and licencing is going to vary region by region.
And..............just so you know, every laid off carpenter and then some is a Handy Andy these days.
There is a wealth of info here.
You should spend a couple of days searching through the business folder.
Best wishes
I have been doing home repair for 15 years now and I am feeling the pressure from people coming into my field.
Fortunately for me the differance from new construction and home repair are such that alot of these guys don't have systems down for repairs or the patience to deal with homeowners directly.
It has taken along time to build up a clientale that keeps me busy when the economy has gone bad.
Another advantage is that I have invested heavily into my tools and trailers and inventory that when I arrive on a jobsite I am capable of getting several jobs done in a day without too much lost time or trips back to the box store.
So toolsguy my advice is be prepared to get dirty and frustrated and you need a significant other with a steady income and good insurance plan and a good sales personnality and a decent business sense and a large network and a way to impress people with your earnest hard working nature ETC....ETC.... ETC....
ANDYSZ2WHY DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO FRIENDS AND FAMILY THAT BEING A SOLE PROPRIETOR IS A REAL JOB?
REMODELER/PUNCHOUT SPECIALIST
Back in '72 a friend of mine said-I want to build a head shop, you have a saw, wanna help?
The rest is history. At them time the pay was 75.00/wk. and all I could do.
And I still have that first client at a different rate of pay-Saturday I set some cabinets in his new condo. Yup, he told the electrician all about giving me my start.
The business contacts have been built over the years, all 36+ of them. Here's hoping the good reputation will bridge this #### ty economic doldrum that seems expanding here in the shadow of the motor city.
Insurance-definitely regional and sometimes you get what you pay for. Licensing etc is also different according to location.
Starting now is a bold move.
A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
My dad and grandfather were remodeling contractors. They started in business in the early 50s.
I started working for them after quitting college for a lack of better choices. I never wanted to do this growing up.
33 years later, I'm glad I became a carpenter. I can't imagine myself being happy doing anything else.
Bull ####, imagine being the fitter in the Foundations department.A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Yeah, you might have a point.
Maybe taste tester in a brewery would be tolerable, too.
Or a Playboy photographer.
" taste tester in a brewery would be tolerable, too.Or a Playboy photographer."I dunno man - the overtime would be hard on your family life.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
great grandpa was a carpenter, grandpa was a carpenter, dad worked with grandpa untill he went into the army in WWII and college on the GI BILL--- but I rarely saw him pay ANYONE to work on his house- he did almost all of it
so-- in the early mid '80's I married at 21, almost immediately bought a fixer-upper house and started working on it while simultaneously working 48-58 hours a week in a chrome plating shop
At that time my Father in law was a union carpenter and construction superintendent and my brother-in-law was the head maintenance mechanic in the tallest building downtown----so anything I couldn't figure out from a book--they came over and showed me
I would do something to my house--and invariably a neighbor would ask me to do the same to their house
and over time-- i got to the point where i was making more working evenings and weekends on my own-----than i was making in the chrome shop
Painting, carpentry, roofing--- really anything for a buck. At that time I topped out at $6.50/hour in the chrome shop, and had a stay at home wife with one baby and another on the way.
since i was making more working on my own- i wasn't thrilled about all the overtime in the chrome shop----working overtime was costing me money
chrome shop folks said---- 'you gotta pick one or the other"
so I grew a set of cojones and went out on my own.
the economy here THEN was very similar to the national economy NOW---so it CAN be done
on the other hand i only needed to earn $17,000 or $18,000 to be doing OK back then--- but i was still the sole support of 4 people.
I gradually realized that roofing earned better than anything else---and eventually put my wife through college and my 2 sons through 13 years of private schools---oldest one will graduate from a private college next spring.
So- it CAN be done, and by dumber guys than you- i am living proof.
Very best wishes,
stephen
BTW--- if failure is not an option-- if you really have a gun to your head you WILL do what MUST be done, no matter what
but- if in the back of you mind failure IS an option, because you think you have planB or an escape plan in mind-- you probably will fail. you do not have to be smart-- you just have to be willing to work longer,harder,higher than those other guys who are willing to fail
again-very best wishes to you
Edited 2/3/2009 6:04 pm ET by Hazlett
Thanks everyone for the input so far. I am not afraid to get dirty and yes my wife is working and possibly more in the future. Its a tough economy and the choice to do this is going to be a hard one since its bas all around. Just doing my research at this point.I too have built up a significant amount of tools and skill from working on my own house and having a few friends/neighbors in the trades who have been patient enough to teach me a few tricks along the way. For now the way I'm looking at it is if i cant even find a job like the one I had, I might as well try this. We'll see.Thanks again.
Wow! Some great responses.
Andy's last two paragraphs sum it up perfectly.
Hazlett hit the nail on the head when he says that failure cannot be an option.
My story: Goofin off till I was 20. Signed up for a home improvement night class and learned the very basics of most of the trades. Enjoyed framing the most so I started building decks in the summer of '96.
Laid off in october, hooked up with framing company then laid off again in Apr '97. Bought my first framing book
Followed my foreman to another framing co. and stayed till 2000. Foreman left in early 98 so I started running framing jobs. Thought I knew it all. Realize now I knew nothing. Treated everyone fair. Learned how to read a blueprint on the fly. Missed alot along the way but if you're not afraid to ask questions you realize that those with the most knowledge are most willing to share it when asked.
Partnered up with my old foreman and split off on our own in 2000. Started off framing custom homes starting at $5+ sq.ft. Ended in December of 2002 framing boxes for Ryan homes at $3.15 sq.ft. He left for Colorado with all the $ and I realized then that no contract=no partnership. I got to keep a framing gun, compressor, hose and the moneymaker(Dewalt 12" compound miter saw) that I had still in the back of my truck.
Headscratch into '03 and decide to get into remodeling, not much different from where you are right now. I realized how little I knew about a home other than framing so I started buying books to learn. If someone asked me if I could ___(fill in blank)_____ I said I sure could, then I bought a book and figured out how to do it. Thats how I collected tools too, out of necessity. Ha, whoever heard of a basin wrench? Man that thing is GOLD!
Lots of downtime in between small jobs for the first couple years. Hardest part is starting with no money and having to spend any money earned on a job for a tool to complete the job. Man I had no cash for quite some time. Good friends and old coworkers would call me when they needed help and I always worked my tail off for them. Big thing was they knew I was only temporary, that I was trying to build my own company.
Got married May '06 to a teacher. Nice.
Met a local guy in '06 who did high end remodels outa town. Framed whatever he needed whenever?wherever he needed it. We quickly became friends and he became my mentor. I asked him thousands of questions and banked that info as best as I could. He was the first guy I met who I considered a "successful remodeler". Awesome dude.
Had a baby girl. Internal drive kicked into overdrive.
Got incorporated January of '08. This was a huge step for me. It felt like all my hard work had paid off and I finally made it big, ha. Picked up some nice remodels. Still love framing. still do framing jobs. Realized how 1 bad job can ruin the profits of 5 good ones.
Still postitive. Not as broke. Lots of experience. Lots more to gain. I feel like I made it past the tipping point, like I am running a construction company. It's up to me to make it succeed.
It's worth repeating, Failure is NOT an option.
Thanks for listening.
Matt
Nice story Matt
I was one of those ryan guys who had to teach the framers how to frame "the ryan way"
Left there in 00 after 11+ years and was at 3 other companies till 07 when I was fired/attritioned/laid off.
I was 41 and thought, since i hit 40 and did not start my business, that I never would.
Now, I've been in the renovations mostly and some new construction for 2+ years and still feeding the kids. (not steak but feeding the kids)
Still a good life but tough in this market.
And yes, when client asks if we can do X, the only correct answer is absolutely!
there was a guy here on Breaktime about 10 years ago--- I forget his name------ but his gig was something like building Tennis courts for rich people in the Adirondacs?
any how I remember him saying---- "if someone asks if you can do something---- say yes---and then go home and figure out how to do it!"
stephen
Stephen,
I remember that guy! That was when the forum was just a list of posts with no folders or anything.
I agree as you always act positive and tell folks you can do anything...which indeed you can...they just have to be able to pay for it. I had folks ask me once to put a second floor on their home as other guys told them it couldn't be done. It could be, its just they couldn't afford to do it.
Mike
Re. what can and cant be done.
In these economic times, those of us who have the attitude that we can get it done will prevail.
Won't likely be rich but we'll make it thru better than the doomsayers.
aj... by the stream... was supposed to come to RhodeFest in '04... but never showed p and that was the last time anyone heard of himMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
that's the guy! every so often I get a vibe from someone or another here on breaktime- and i wonder if it's that guy posting under another name....
stephen
I quite often say "I can't do it as that isn't my field" I follow that with, " I do however know a company(engineer, specialist....whatever) who can and I will bring them here to meet with us to solve the issue. I wouldn't attempt a slate roof for example, nor a copper one, nor a curved stairway but I know who to contact and hire to get them done. My attitude is would the client rather have me bumble my way through or know that I am bringing the best in the field in. Dad used to say it isn't what you know it is whether you know where to go for the help that counts. edit for sp.
Edited 2/8/2009 7:17 pm by dovetail97128
gotta stay near our " core competencies'
if a customer asked me if I would wall paper their powder room-- i would say " sorry--no!" however- when they ask me" while you are up there replacing the roof -would it be possible to replace the redwood siding on that dormer?"--- I say "Yes certainley" that's my real interest-- those little oddball things that most roofers would say no to, or suggest vinyl siding for.......
stephen
I think a good point was made regarding tools. A cordless drill and impact, a rough carpentry miter and a circular saw isn't going to get you terribly far, but it will get you started. I started with an OD babypoop colored, blade eating B&D scroll saw, a disposable circular saw and a pathetic Sears router, which needed new bearing every fifteen minutes (so it seemed). At some point, remember that say: "I can't afford cheap." Anyway, those tools, eventually, bought me the means to play with all manner of wood, granite, sheet rock and so forth. I have around forty thousand dollars worth of "handyman" tools and equipment. There isn't a HB freight item in the batch. It's all Fein, PC, Delta, Milwaukee, Hegner and so forth.What got me into business? It's simple, I couldn't afford what I wanted, so I made it. The first things, through crude (art work), were bought bought by someone with less taste than I, and that got me more materials, or my second router bit. Things just grew from there: http://www.flickr.com/photos/functional_art).There are things that are key to growth:Use common sense (if you don't know how to do it, go find out how;Don't take short cuts that will hurt your customer, now or in twenty years;Within reason, give your customers more than they asked for, this may include spending time to educate them;Keep in mind that, just because someone is licensed, bonded, or has been doing something for years, does not mean they really know what they are doing (a good example might be that Home Depot, Lowes and other have been selling deck treatments for years, but much of it is trash, too, just because someone can build something, doesn't mean they know how to care for it (most of the time, they don't));Remember, tools are part of your business and job. You are limited by your lack of them (and the reason you have what someone else wants is you never lent it out before. Keep in mind, too, I used to clean sand belts, but now consider my value to make that impractical;Develop your imagination, along with your knowledge. You'll need it to anticipate problems, to solve them, to survive and to stand out in the crowd;
Thats some really good advice. Thanks. I have put together a decent set of tools over the years already from working on my house and a few other projects.
rarely saw him pay ANYONE to work on his house
Interesting comment. When I was 5 YO pop actually paid somebody to install a gas furnace and new ducts to replace the old coal gravity furnace. Otherwise, never ever saw him pay anyone else for mechanical skills. One time he did take the rear axle to his cousin's shop to have a new rear bearing pressed on for the 52 Mercury as he destroyed the first bearing trying to heat and then drive it on with a pipe and sledge, otherwise never saw him take anything to any shop.
Must be hereditary, neither my kids or grandkids have ever seen me have anyone else do anything on anything but on my teeth, plus they were not born or not admitted to OR last time I had to have any major surgery <G>.
Did consider building houses for a living in the late '70's but relatively high tech work was more interesting. In hindsight, building would have probably made me richer over the years, as that was a low financial time also.
dad did pay to have an olld furnace replaced---FORMER coal burner converted to gas---- i was terrified of that thing as a kid-----giant mechanical spider contraption lurking down there in the basement. in the late 70's when I was in high school he paid a local company to replace the roof--- very well known, well respected company here in the neighborhood.
My career NOW--- is basically going around replacing all those roofs that company did back in the 70's---including the very one they did for dad back in the 70'sStephen
BTW--- if failure is not an option-- if you really have a gun to your head you WILL do what MUST be done, no matter what
but- if in the back of you mind failure IS an option, because you think you have planB or an escape plan in mind-- you probably will fail. you do not have to be smart-- you just have to be willing to work longer,harder,higher than those other guys who are willing to fail
I think that is one of the best and most true statements I have ever read here.
if failure is not an option-- if you really have a gun to your head you WILL do what MUST be done, no matter what
You know, that made me start thinking. I've jumped into most things in my life never considering that I could fail. And on the other hand, I've never thought much, if any, about success. I just always think "this looks interesting" and away I go.
DW often asks me what I'm going to do today. My standard answer is "whatever needs to be done the most". I make her nervous.http://www.quittintime.com/ View Image
ya gotta keep 'em nervous...Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
"DW often asks me what I'm going to do today. My standard answer is "whatever needs to be done the most". I make her nervous."
Geez. you are in my parallel life. My dw is quite anxious and has no clue what I do every day. She (and her whole family for that matter) think I am just a dumb contractor sometimes. (until they have a problem and ask me if I can help them (for free or cheaper)
I can always resolve their dilema but they have no clue what skills it takes.
Not to worry, I just keep on going. getting stuff done and generating revenue to keep the wheels turning
Thats good advice. Thanks
I'll second that. Dude should write a book.
Reminds me of how I got started in self employment, just seemed like a good idea at the time. But holy moses, if I had known then what I know now about what you have to know to be good at business.....yikes...there really is something to be said for working without a net....Naive but refreshing !
Re. failure
so true and well stated.
Failure is not in my vocab.
When a client asks if i can do something, I ask them if they think I can. My clients know me as willing and able to do anything that is even remotely possible.
From 2 story rear additions to dog fences to pool cover repairs, etc.
If you need to be successful, find yourself saying yes!
In 87 when I started college, my neighbor who was a contractor came over and asked what I was going to do for work while I went to school. I thought I was just going to be a student and not do a damn thing but party but my parents thought otherwise. Hence, I started working with him.
And God bless him and my parents for pushing me to do it as all these years later, my degree isn't worth much but the knowledge I got from him and his pushing for me to get my own license has earned me a career.
Jayzog told you most of what you need to know. I'll add that if you do what you say you'll do, show up when you said you would, and return phone calls promptly you'll be ahead of most of your competition.
bldrbill,
I liked your post-- I think about that mindset a LOT.Tell them EXACTLY what you are going to do
Do EXACTLY what you said you would do
Charge them EXACTLY what you said you would charge. My answering machine message says " thank you for calling Hazlett Roofing & Renovation Ltd. we can't answer the phone right now, but if you leave your name, your phone number and a time which would be convienient for you to recieve a return phone call we will call you back. People don't really expect me to be poised by the phone waiting for their call-- they expect me to be climbing on someones roof----- so they will generally say something like " could you call me tonight after 7:30?---- I will call at 7:31 and when they answer I will identify myself and mention " You asked me to return your phone call tonight after 7:30........." If I make an appointment to meet them and write a proposal for Tuesday at 6:00-- i show up at 6:00. Frequently they will answer the door looking at their watch and mention " Hey--you are right on time" or " I see you are a man of your word- you said you would be here at 6:00"
If they don't mention it on their own-- I call attention to it by apologising" I am sorry if I am late, traffic was a little backed up on the way over here"-- Invariably they will look at their watch with some amazement and say-- "don't worry, you are right on time" Many times i have arrived 5-10 minutes early and parked around the corner so that I could arrive at the customers home exactly on time It amazes me how many contractors won't put ANY effort into being prompt. I have a customer right now for a roof on a building that isn't even built yet. customer has a firm ,realistic budget, an architect who has drawn up a nice set of plans, and his roofer all lined up--- but the other trades----- not so much of a hurry to get pricing back to the customer or make the meetings.
I read a good line in a book once-" successful people do all the things that un-successfull people can't be bothered to do"
It ain't rocket science
stephen
Invariably I hear about the contractors that never called back. After the first meeting I always set up the second meeting, date and time. If on Monday I look at a job before I leave I say " let me take some time to put the numbers together, would it be ok to stop by Wednesday at 6:00 to discuss your project further?" Then show up at 6.
It keeps them in the loop. HO's like being in the loop.
fc....
that's often one of the main reasons there are no other bidders
no one else shows upMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
"Many times i have arrived 5-10 minutes early and parked around the corner so that I could arrive at the customers home exactly on time"
I do that 99 out of 100 times and also always get the "hey, you're right on time" remark.
I always think the house I'm hiding in front of thinks I'm stalking them though ...
plus ... when I was working out of older trucks and vans ... I'd drive either my Jeep or the wife's car. Now I try to get there in the box van, even if I'm cruising around in the Jeep ... nice clean big white truck looks more "contractor-ish".
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
You know, its kind of funny-
but when I drive up in my Mustang, customers tend to think more that I'm a successful contractor, than when I show up with my van.
Particularly in the rich communities.
Maybe I should get a Benz?
that can backfire----- I remember clearly going to price awindow replacement job nad the prospect started complaining about the previous contractor who had showed up in a Lincoln----and he just "knew he was getting hosed if the salesman could drive that kind of car" I didn't get the project either-- but I find my truck works just fine.
stephen
I wrote that kind of tongue in cheek
good thing I don't have a Corvette LOL
fake it till U make it!
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
I've always thought it was funny how so many people judge you by what you drive. I'm going to meet a potential design client today foir the first time, so I thought I'd drive the wife's Highlander, but the guy told me he really likes the fact I have had a long career as a builder and he wants a practical focus, not the architectural ego upgrade, so I guess I'll drive the one ton with the plow and the load of shingles in back.;)I remember a long time ago in FL I went to estimate a roof in the poor part of town. a two story hip roof on a lot where there was maybe 2-3 feet each side to the fence. The old guy had about two hundred religious symbols and statues of Mary in his living room, and incense burning....I was looking around for voodoo dolls too....Anyways, I presented my estimate and usual I suggested that he get back to me after getting other estimates to compare."OH NO! not at all. I can tell you are good because you have that big truck out front! I'll sign this and write you a deposit check right now. When can you start?"That was my first experience with realizing folks look at your vehicle as that important. to me it's just a tool and a way to get from here to there.My Dad was the other way tho. His car was an extension of himself. If a mechanic left a greasy fingerprint on the hood, he took it as a personal insult, like as tho the guy had spit in his face. I never did get that.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
! not at all. I can tell you are good because you have that big truck out front! I'll sign this and write you a deposit check right now. When can you start?"
Had that happen to me also. Driving my stake rack, got a call about estimate on the way home stoped measured and left with a check in under 45 minutes. Fellow liked my big truck!
There's no getting out of politics.
I guess the one big difference is that you're theoretically the master of your own little ship, however tiny it is.
However, if you don't mind the politics, or maybe even like that part, then this is the life. I moved into residential building after several years in unrelated stuff, put in some time as an employee first as a laborer then later as a framing foreman. Went out on my own part time once and figured out that I needed to learn some more, so went back into wage world for two more years. Finally made the clean jump a couple of years ago and haven't looked back. I've made a couple of bad calls and learned a thing or two, but the projects have turned out well, the customers are calling back, and I'm making a living.
One bit of practical advice that served me well. Hunt yourself up an older truck (or van or whatever you prefer) even if you could afford a newer one right now. Make sure it's in the best shape it could be in every way and keep it clean inside and out. Doesn't matter if you don't know/care about automotive stuff - find a mechanic. It sends a message about you that matches what customers want in a renovator - you're interested in older stuff maintained and shown off to its best possible advantage.
hope it works out
if it doesn't, post here and you'll find lots of takers for your trailer full of tools ;)
j
WHen your working on peoples home they have a tendency to feel vulnerable since your are in there space and working on the most valuable thing they own. Add to this the perception held by many that contractors as a breed are shady at best and con artists and alcoholics at worst. We are known for showing up late and making promises that we don't keep.
I recently made the transition from carpentry sub contractor to general remodler. The first real job I did was a room addition for a guy who had made it clear from the beginning that he considered many of the characters in this business to be suspect. At the end of the job he told me this: " We love our new room you did a great job.... etc. BUT! The most important thing is that you did exactly what you said you would". He has been a great referral over the last couple of years and has gotten me close to $500,000 in new business.
Remember each job is a potential gateway to several more. Your reputation is your business.
I also recommend David Gerstel's book Running a Succesfull Constuction Company.
As mentioned before networking is a good idea. Get to know your locale cabinet shop owners. You local counter top fabricators and lumber yards too. Go introduce yourself to commercial contractors because they will sub out a lot of stuff. Get to know other one man contractors because you can co-contract bigger jobs together. And above all shop a good bank who will give you short term loans for projects.
A lot of people think contractors are shady. One way to offset that is through communications. You do this by being open as to what you are doing. When they trust you they become at ease and problems will evaporate.
"A lot of people think contractors are shady. One way to offset that is through communications. You do this by being open as to what you are doing. When they trust you they become at ease and problems will evaporate." - Ozzie NelsonView Image "...craftsmanship is first & foremost an expression of the human spirit." - P. Korn
bakersfieldremodel.com
Do you live in Bakersfield? I met a young police officer from there at a St Louis Rams game last year. (2007)
The guys who have said that "Failure wasn't an option" are right. that's the best motivation you can have.
And the better your back up plan?
The more likely you are to fall back on it.
I wish that instead of blowing sunshine up my a$$, someone would have laid some cold hard realities on me.
So forgive me if I sound like the lone dissenter her. But here are some things YOU need to ask yourself, and things you need to know upfront.
To begin with? There's the wife thing. Does she understand what's involved and support it? Does she understand that just because you don't have a job to do that day, it's still a work day? Does she understand that just because money comes in doesn't mean it's all there for you to spend?
Of the guys I know who succeed? Maybe 50-75% of them owe a share of the credit to their spouses. Of the guys who fail? Probably 90% owe some of the blame to their spouses.
Make sure she's on the same sheet of music.
Next, get started right. Lots and Lots of guys in the trades are behind the eight ball because:
They owe the IRS.
A GOOD accountant and insurance agent are critical. When you're looking for an accountant? Ask guys who HAVE BEEN AUDITED AND SURVIVED who they use. Lots of guys THINK their accountant or attorney is good....but that perception often fails to survive first contact with a court or audit.
Set up a Business.....all the guys here who are succesful? Most will tell you that it didn't turn good until they treated it like a business.
Have a PLAN.
This place is full of guys who are very succesful and will do well and retire comfortably.
And it's also chock full of guys whose retirement plan consist of working long enough to reduce expenses enough to live on Social Security and 20 Hours a week at Lowes.
Which guy do you want to be?
Look into your state's licensing requirements.
Here in Virginia, in order to be licensed as a contractor, the commonwealth requires on the job experience. I think it's 5 years for a Class A and 3 years for a B or C license.
great teaching points , robert..
<<<
A GOOD accountant and insurance agent are critical. When you're looking for an accountant? Ask guys who HAVE BEEN AUDITED AND SURVIVED who they use. Lots of guys THINK their accountant or attorney is good....but that perception often fails to survive first contact with a court or audit.>>>
i spent an hour and a half with my insurance agent this morning... actually , we have three.. not to mention USAA besides... which uses no agents
anyways.. this agent has been with NML since about '73... we bought a couple of whole life policies from him back in '79 and we've added to them over the years....
he's saved me a bundle and has kept us out of bankruptcy at one point by having the policies to borrow against..... hooking up with him was one of the no-brainer things i did by sheer luck..... but it has really paid off
our company has another agent that handles all of the business insurance... again... saved me tons and watched my back about potential litigation
third agent has our commercial property ( residential rental fire ) insurance... good service
USAA has the homeowner, private vehicle, banking, and brokerage
i'm a relationship person.. and my customers tend to be the same... they are looking for someone they trust.. i'm doing the same..
bookeeper.. accountant.. lawyer.... insurance agent... real estate agent... all of those people are an integral part of my business
Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
I learned the hard way.....
I used an accountant that a friend used at first.......turns out he didn't survive first contact with the IRS and neither did I.
Luckily I was able to pay the bill.
I'm amazed at how many people don't bother too look for good accountants and agents.
Side note: When my dad first started out, we lived near an office complex. It had a price waterhouse office there and one day My dad stopped in to ask a few questions.
The office manager didn't have the heart to tell him that he was WAY below their minimum business level. He ended up using them for 5 years.
Keep in mind, your insurance man is not your friend. It's business. The money you borrowed is money you already paid in. It was your own money you borrowed. If you died tomorrow, your wife would get the cash value minus the loan. Listen to him, but remember, his living is on commission and depends on you buying. His biggest money comes from cash value plans (it's illegal to promote them as investments, for the reason stated (you lose four or five percent in the first few years))
hah, hah, hah.....lemme show you the history of my investment accounts versus my inurance accounts.... guess which ones have a higher return over the yearsMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
If you get a higher return on your insurance, it's only the luck of the draw. Guess where insurance companies invest your money? You may, or may not have a cash value plan at the end of the year.If you have a cash value insurance, it would be interesting to see how much more you would have made off it than a rental investment, a long term bank deposit and so forth. Like I say, insurance salesmen cannot promote such plans as investments when selling them and it's for a reason.Edited 2/8/2009 10:02 pm ET by dejure
Edited 2/8/2009 10:04 pm ET by dejure
Thanks. Yes, my wife is totally supportive of the plan. We dont have crazy expenses and arent the types that spend it all when it does come in.I'm figuring out all the details at this point and researching insurance, accountant etc like you mentioned. Thanks for the advice.
I wanted to add,
My brother and sister live near you.
A good handyman in their neighborhoods costs upwards of $90 per hour and is still booked full for weeks. Even in these times.
Might not be such a bad move.
Good to know. Thanks
I used to be an accountant for 11 years before i made a switch to becoming a handyman. I started like you, remodeled the house and liked the work. My dad and were always doing something to the house.
I got started in 1999 when the economy was good and people were complaining that their contractors would not call them back or charged them an enormous amount. It was perfect timing. My first job was painting a barn that was guarded by a mean dog and full of pigeons. I had to give up my lunch to the dog just so i could get near the barn. But, it went up hill from there. It is all about building a client base and charging a fair price.
Advice: 1) Dont buy a big diesel truck with a trailer.
2) Don't buy thousands of dollars of tools in the first year.
3) Form a Limited Liability Corporation.
4) Don't run an ad in the paper.
5) Network,Network, Network.
6) When a potential client with a Lexus parked in the garage, tells you they
do not have any money. Don't believe it, ignore them.
7) Collect deposits.
8) Take the phone off the hook on Sundays.
Right now my area has 16% unemployment. It is so bad the President is visiting my area on Monday, to tell us its going to be alright. I am down to working between 20 and 30 hours a week because everyone is now a handyman! The problem here is guys are collecting unemployment, and working for cash. These guys used to bring home a $1,000.00 a week. Now everyone feels sorry for them. It is frustrating, I am now the highest bidder in most cases.
I can certainly see the value of networking but why do you say dont put an ad in the paper? No diesel truck?
for that kind of work, all has come thru referrals - word of mouth advertising - networking, never once from a newspaper ad, tho in some communities it can ad some credibility
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I see. Thanks.
I was getting calls from people who wanted their toilet changed in their mobile home.
Big truck means more gas, bigger payments, and a false image. I am more impressed with what a guy can do, not with the size of his truck. I have owned the truck and trailer before and it just didi not workout for me. Hard to park, had to unhitch the trailer to get to the back of the truck. The city told me I could not have it parked in my drive. I now use a Ford 250 van and love it.
i left a job as a assistant plant manager in 73
a year earlier i had bought a former school house in the country that was being used as a barn
this building was soo bad the agent wouldent even put his sign on the property
i started renovating it and had neighbours ask me if i could do some work for them
at the time i was on unemployment insurance 7 bought another old school house in the nearest town & later renovated it also & sold it for a decent profit
i acquired 40 acres adjacent to my own place & applied for 2 severances from it which paid for the 40 acres
the balance i applied for a plan of subdivision 38 lots and am still develop[ing it by just selling lots
across the street i have a option on 32 acres owned by a customer of 32 years
whom i bought 4 lots off previously , all paid for by doing renovations for them
as others have said when asked if you can do something always say yes and do your best
if you get all a customers work you dont need as many customers
my wife works and has a good govt job but dosent put money into the business
however she owens 48% of the business
in the 9o.s we had to sell our winter home in Fla so we also know what it takes to survive in hard times
this area is very stable compared to the rest of Canada at present with propertys expected to increase 1.5 % this year so hopefully things keep going good
you get most of your best business from strangers often who if handled right become your best friends because they value you enough to pay you your full price and not try to get a discount just because they know your name
relatives i found were the worst i found ... Best of luck in your endevours and try to have some fun while at it
AS someone once said " i have been rich and poor , rich is better "
Mine is a little different from any so far so I will tell it. I am an Army retiree, worked in aviation industry for 10 yrs and moved back home because of aging parents, my Mom and wife's parents. Was going to build a panelized home on family property but after a medical problem with Mom ended up adding 1750 sqft to the original house I helped build as a 9-11 yr old.
GC'd after designing it myself and built it using a family of guys who did the main framing, siding, roofing. Helped install electric, plumbing, and did all trim with my wife. Slept in it one yr after getting permit.
Got asked to replace a bath tub in a rental (trailer and a very ugh one at that). Ended up redoing whole bath and then some. Next was BIL total bath redo with a bump one wall into another room to get some space. More small jobs, mostly friends, family, church friends. Converted some commercial space then ended up doing some tenant improvements.
My now insurance agent asked me to look at a new to them house and finished off a lower level and cleaned up after her professional painters.
My rural area will not support the prices the repair and remodel work should command but I have the luxury to adjust price if I want to do then job. I do a lot of work for my church pro bono and a lot for another one in my town. Will usually bill them at lower rate than others. Work for some other churches also.
Fell into a large (for me) commercial job converting a florist shop and antique store to a Credit Union branch. Currently working with them on a foreclosure where homeowners spent a lot of money to screw up an old house. More work than I want to do with the time frame they need to get it finished and sold and off their books. Will be more of a consulting/PM job. Will probably get a bunch of them that require a lesser effort.
I tell folks I only work to support my habit, tool that is. My insurance is around $650/yr for 1/2 mil per occurance, 1 mil total and $5k tool ins. Have not totaled up tool inventory but probably $8-10K at least. Bought a 2000 Dodge 1ton church van and shelved it out. Have a 91 C1500 pickup with a wooden homebuilt ladder rack.
Work with wife usually if help is needed, have borrowed/subbed a couple of guys a couple of times. Once got into a soffet repair that grew into taking 1/4-1/3 of the roof down to top plate in 9 deg weather. Won't do that again.
Intend to keep level down since I decided to take Social Security early.
Sorry for long and boring rant.
I still contend that as the economy tanks more will repair and remodel.
Bob
.made up some bussness cards stood in front of the hardware store passed them out to any one who would take them .got some calls and whala i was self employed