I have googled this question and the closest answer I can find is a claim on, I think, PL Premium saying that it will outlast a project.
Is this generally the case? I am using only foam-compatible adhesive to hold some foam insulation against cinder block walls and I guess I’m just not entirely confident that over the two-three decades with moisture getting in around the glue from time to time that it truly will last. Will it?
I can’t seem to find anything out about anticipated lifetimes for these adhesives that seem to be so frequently used everywhere.
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I'll put my money on the polyurethene products any day.
Example?
Take a look at a pair of old work boots. The soles on most of those are polyurethene. They outlast the leather. I have one old pair that are close to thirty years old, and other than wear from walking concrete and roof shingles, there is nothing to indicate failure of the material. I know of poly floor finishes forty years old that are doing just fine. I know of a crew that tried to take apart a floor I framed almost 20 years ago with regular const adhesive ( PL400?) in a damp enviroment and they were cussing me for having used adhesive. They had to destroy it to take it apart.
Will it last 100-400 years? Ihave no idea.
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How do you get a pair of work boots to last 30 years?
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
cover them Pl...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
quit wearing them!I have some from my days in Colorado that were heavily insulated and big cleat soles. I don't like a sole that traps the peastone and mud to drag inside so just for hunting/fishing
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I had to remove a cracked oak tread from a finished staircase. Maybe 15 yrs old. I warned the client that if the tread was glued, I might not be able to remove it in one piece and would likely have to replace (rather than repair).
I removed the ballusters and the trim and tapped a chisel between the underside of the nose and the riser. The tread popped right off. It was glued with what looked like Liquid Nails or some cheapo construction adhesive. No fight at all. The glue was soundly adhered to the underside of the tread as well as the stringers, but it had no internal strength at all.
Got lucky I guess.
If you get into tearout over a period of 20=30 yrs you get to see the real track records of certain types of products.
Some subfloor adhesive perhaps in application didn't do jack.
a good thing for the remodeler.
Others? bonded fibres and layers together better than volcanic activity and thousands of years of compression.
So, to answer your question?
beats me.
However, the bond of that adhesive you are working with will probably last as advertised to the foam. What you glue it to however is the iffy part. Was it clean, dry and whatever else is advised on the label? Did you pull it back and re-press (if required)? Good and full contact?
The application and installation techniques is their "out" as far as warranty.
Pretty much you have to find, use and monitor a product over the years to be sure. Or read the label and take your chances.
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Thanks, guys. This is one of those hope and take chances, since getting to the foam later will be tricky :)
I think the failures I have seen in subfloor adhesive were when used on wet and or dirty joists, but that is no problem with polyurethene glues since they are moisture cure initiated.I'd far rather used poly foam to glue insulation sheets to CMUS because of that to get an indestructible bond in the first place
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Man I hate using that poly adhesive. If you get it on your fingers it takes forever to wear off!
Probably a good thing for the customer, though!>G<
Great for hiding those finger prints. Sure beats trying to get rid of them with a belt sander.FBI don't like it though. :)Russell
I figure 3 days for PL to come off without surgery. Never use after Wednesday if you want clean hands for the weekend.John
As with all glues & cements [const adhesive is a cement] the product becomes pretty much inert when it cures. So what is going to destroy it? Sunlight probably would but inside the building cavity that wouldnt be a factor. Repeated wetting & drying wouldn't be good, but hopefully that's not happening inside your wall either. The passage of time? Remember, this is essentially a petroleum based plastic - you probably couldn't break it down if you tried. Anecdotally, I've done demolition involving this stuff at 20+ years and it was still doing its thing pretty darn well.
i'm curious which definitions you had in mind for the words 'cement' and for 'plastic' as used in your statement.
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Many adhesives lose there adhesive properties as they dry out. Think about old, dried out duct tape. This is especially a problem for adhesives that rely on their pliability to maintain a van der Waals bond vs creating a true chemical or mechanical bond of some sort.
This country will not be a permanently good place for any of us to live in unless we make it a reasonably good place for all of us to live in. --Theodore Roosevelt
I thought PL Premium eats white foam insulation.
I use the foam compatible glue, here we call it PL 300.
I also add a few concrete nails to hold the sheets.
you are correct...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
Correct???
Wow! there's something I don't hear everyday...sniff...*
About the Premium eating white foam or using nails?
it will....
use 300.....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
I ran across some weird construction adhesive a few months ago. It came form a building supply and was labeled as their house brand so I really can't say what the brand really was. Regular 29 oz tubes. Anyway, it didn't smell like regular construction adhesive - it smelled faintly of alcohol, and it took about a week to harden. It looked like construction adhesive, although maybe a little lighter tan rather than the usual dark tan. Anyone seen anything like this? There was an 800 # on the tube so I called and talked to their tech support. They wouldn't say what brand it really was, and long story short the lady who was nice and at least attempted to be helpful said don't worry - it is good stuff, and we warranty it. Didn't exactly give me the warm and fuzzes. Thoughts?
you get it from BMC????
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
ProBuild, formally called Contractor Yard which was owned by Lowes up until about 5 years ago.
the PL300 is the right tube glue. I prefer the foam guns tho, rather than tube adhesive.
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Are you planning on using it with no mechanical fasteners?
I think pl premium is foam compatible but I have been using pl300 entirely because it is preferred, or at least most recommended. I didn't use mechanical fasteners at the beginning, just the glue but got sick of putting up braces and waiting for it to dry so yesterday started screwing them in, too, two to a sheet for about the last 2/3 of the basement. For the other stuff I was going through half a tube per 2' sheet. The stuff is $3.50/10oz so it's not cheap.I did test with a piece of scrap on cinder block and found that after 24 hours curing it's strong enough to start ripping a little bit of foam when I pull it off but after 48 hours the foam is destroyed when pulled off the block where the glue was touching it.This is extruded foam. I haven't found many people speak highly of expanded in many circumstances, which is probably why home depot carries very little of it.
I've found liquid nails to be pretty much filler. It gets to hard and cracks.
In almost all apps there is movement and the adhesive needs to move a bit.
Will Rogers